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The Jason Order

Defender-In-Training
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About The Jason Order

  1. I have some for sale as well. I can confirm they do drop, but I've only ever played floor 120+ on this patch.
  2. This is fantastic. The DD2 wiki is in a sad state, and it's really hard to find relevant information about even common questions. I'm really glad to see someone step up and change it rather than just complain (which is what I did). Just a suggestion, but can you also list what you need to hit the speed cap / range cap for certain defenses? For example, if X caps with just a shard + ascension, or if they only gain a slight boost from mods etc. It would be nice when planning out builds to see if I can save a mod and/or shard slot. I also have a lot of gilded shards, I'll take a look this weekend to see what you are missing. I also have almost all of the "c8" shards as well, but I don't know if you are including them.
  3. The problem with the current iteration is that it is too binary. It's simply a flat damage number, and currently this number is just straight up worse than other options, so it's 100% useless. The previous version was the opposite, being better in 99% of cases. I'd like to see the trade off shift to another area, like maybe range, to become an actual trade-off and choice instead of simply being +damage.
  4. Yeah, I agree with [[177890,users]]. On higher floors consistency is really what you want. I'm only using a Mark on Sand Viper, because of the interaction with Split viper, and Oil Geyser/Sand Trap, because I don't have enough Power Transfers and I never upgrade them since they are only for crowd control. Aside from that, Medallions are simply better. You trade a tiny bit of damage level 1 for lots more damage at higher upgrade levels and more consistency. It's not even close.
  5. This happened to me too. I took some time off to play They are Billions, and when I came back things were harder - because I had forgotten how to build properly. Like which angles get more damage as Projectile towers, where to place barricades to avoid getting hit by Hex Throwers, and the timing for attacks to peel assassins. Basically, a lot of small details I took for granted when I was playing all the time.
  6. [[177890,users]] I've had some really cool lane combos too. One with every air lane open. And another with both quad lanes opening up! Neither had Frost or Cyborks making them super efficient DU wise. As for EMP Kobolds, a trick I've been using is to simply put an Obelisk in each lane that has them. They'll never die, and they'll eat every EMP Kobold and still a lot for other lanes.
  7. @Mighty Mango 1. Yeah, starting from floor 1 means that if you ever Prestige once, you will legitimately never have a challlenge again for 100s of hours, since you are a) incentivized to keep prestiging when you hit the minimum amount b) be doing easy floors for the entire duration. So if I ever prestige I'm looking at 100s of hours of literally face roll easy content. Why would I want to remove all challenge for the next few months I play this game? 2. I was really disappointed when Ancient Power was first revealed, and I made it known. I'm not the only one. The time / reward investment is way out of whack. There's a lot of super simple things that would make Ancient Power appealing. Faster walking speed in build phase? Double jump on other heroes? 1% higher number does nothing and worse - doesn't make the player feel more powerful. There are lots of indirect power options they could have gone with. 3. It's really not efficient to buff all defenses rather than nerfing the outliers. You have 4 table legs, and you need them to be the same size. Do you cut down one? Or build up the other 3? It's literally 3x the amount of work for the same result, and even more so when there's so many defenses. Bee is really the main reason so many defenses are not used. Explosive Trap is incredibly strong and efficient, but compared to Bee, it's lackluster. I imagine when Bee gets nerfed the amount of defense diversity will skyrocket, since right now its possible to literally build bees from floor 1 to floor 300, from campaign to mastery 7.
  8. forgot_my_acct_name It's random, you can get up to 1800 DU wave 1, and you get 1 additional wave per wave. The mechanics never change after floor 55ish, it's just higher HP, damage and resist. The scaling on floor 120 seems to be intended for having some Ancient Power and cap raises, but you can just play more efficiently or rely more on hero crowd control. A Mystic with 0 gear could realistically hold Floor 1000 solo. ChrisH36 The Cybork variant of Frost + Control Burn is the easiest, since Frost and Cyborks are functionally the same, limiting ground defenses. Frost + Geode is much harder, since you can't easily use ground defenses or PDTs. Whompers is also the easiest Frost schedule, since it's just slow regular minions like Orcs and Warboars. For a lane like that, I'd use 1 PDT at the start of the lane and another at my wall with a Ballista and a Cannon. If it was a really long lane, a PDT would actually kill everything solo, with maybe 1 Cannon at your wall to catch leaks. Fairly easy. Basically, for controlled Burn, always use PDT, even in Geode lanes, then add something to kill the Geode like Oil Heyzer / Protons. Water Elemental seems to not work reliably on Controlled Burn. I find the hardest mutator combo is usually just a ton of Assassins immune to stun. You can't reliably solo hold a lane anymore since you'll often be dealing with assassins (you can't get them off you using usual methods, since immune to stun is also immune to freeze.) Assassins also start having tons of Hp (24+M each) and when there's 5+ 3 times per wave you pretty much have to deal with them full time, even worse if they get Immune to Stun + Immune to Player spells, which is the most obnoxious combo in the game. But aside from that there are rarely 3 hard lanes in a game. So you simply overbuild one, and hold the other. Acenf, Deadly Strikes, Max Ascension, and whatever gives you enough damage to always kill Goblins with Flame Aura at level 1. That's really the main goal of Flame Aura, to deal enough damage to kill all smaller minions. So a lane with lady Zerker + Goblins, you could put 1 flame at the start of a lane, killing all the Goblins, and an LSA at your wall, killining all the Zerkers.
  9. Wave 2, Lane 11 - Zerker Fodder with Maximum Effort and Cursi-Kazi Cursi-Kazi = Proton until they fix it, but I had a ton of DU so I threw random stuff in here. Wave 3, Lane 12 - Game Ogre with Power Block and Controlled Burn Wave 4, Lane 13 - Zerker Wompers with Vampiric and Headstrong Wave 5: Frost something with something. I just threw like 6 rams here and hit G. I literally just throw DU at these lanes, since I had a ton and nothing is happening in any lane. Victory! If this was at all interesting or helpful, I'll do it again for other floors.
  10. It's pretty difficult to give advice on how to build in Onslaught, since there are so many different mutator, schedule and lane combinations. So I thought I'd just play through a floor, and take a quick look at what I built, why I built it, and how it worked. My goal in playing floors is probably very different than most players. I try to build as fast as possible, to minimize my time spent climbing. Building slowly and careful takes far too long, and even if it increases the chance of failing by a little bit, I'm saving more time in the long run. I'm also very comfortable picking up the slack with hero DPS. So the builds here aren't exactly the most optimized at all. They are just what I thought I could get away with. If I see a difficult lane, I usually just overbuild it by a huge margin. So if some of these lanes look like overkill, they probably are. So here's Map 3 Floor 120 of Onslaught. For reference, the enemies are roughly twice as hard to kill as Floor 65, so if you can do Floor 65 with half DU you can probably make it here. ______________________________________________________________________________ Lane 1: Hex Throwers with Proximity and Toxi-Kazi - 130 DU. (80 DU possible) The core is very close and in clear line of sight, so I need to build a wall further up than I would normally like. I place it far enough that Hex Throwers can't hit it from spawn. I'm using Training Dummy because it has a very narrow hit box, which makes it easier to hide behind Reflect Beams, but this usually doesn't matter. I go with 1 Flame Aura and 2 Lightning Strikes, 1 Reflect and a Wall. 130 DU. I could probably get away with just 1 LSA if I really needed to be greedy, since all the enemies are ranged and would simply sit there hitting the reflect, and the Kobolds would damage the wall but otherwise do nothing. But since the lane has Mages, and I'm already way under budget, I overbuild this otherwise very easy lane. This lane ended up being a boss lane, but I didn't get any Cyborks bosses out of it, so it was a non issue. Funny enough, I almost lost from this lane, as a Kobold decided to path around to the core, and I managed to stop it in time from across the map with Gunwitch. I'm actually not sure if the Kobold would have one shot the core, and this pathing issue rarely happens with non Zerkers. If there were Zerkers in this lane I would have built a wall on the other path. Lane 2: EMP Dragons with Armored - 90 DU. (30 DU possible) I build an Obelisk in every EMP lane, as Skyguards will rarely kill an EMP in time, since at this floor they have far too much HP. Since this lane was Armored, I could have actually got away without an Obelisk, which was only hit once. I also could have saved more DU by just using Skyguard or even using Sand Viper.  Lane 3: Cy Zerker Whompers with Enraged and Pile it On - 170 DU. (70 DU possible) A very easy lane that I overspent. While there are Cyborks in this lane, the layout makes it very easy to use Auras. I could have got away with just 1 wall and 2 LSAs, with the second by the wall but on the ledge. You might even be able to get away with 1 Cannon here, especially if you upgrade it to 2 or 3. When I checked the damage at the end of the game, the Cannon had almost 0 damage and the Ballista had 1/3rd of the Flame and 1/2 of the LSA. Lane 4: Cy Frost Whompers with Proximity and Pain Aura. The first lane I don't like the look of. This spot is actually really good for PDTs and Flame Aura, since theres a ledge right by spawn thats safe for Flames and you can place PDTs facing backwards down the lane on the other side, but since it's Frost I can't do either. I place 2 Ballistas and a Ramster, but I came back later and add 3 Cannons. I also ended up upgrading quite a bit here, since the lane ended up as a boss lane Lane 5: Geo-Whomp Zerkers with Vampiric and Yeti - 160 DU Lane 6: EMP Kamikazi - 90 DU. I intentionally overbuilt these lanes, because they are on a side of the map on their own, so I want to make sure I never have to come here again. The air lane gets an Obelisk and a Skyguard, because sometimes Kamikazis will misbehave. The ground lane gets 1 Flame, 2 LSA and an Earthshatter. Normally I wouldn't need the Earthshatter here, but since the lane has Vampiric, and I never want to come here, I place one down as insurance to kill all the Zerkers. No idea what I could have dropped here, the wall never got hit but I never came here once to check on it. The second LSA had okay damage too, so things were getting close. Lane 7: Cy-Guard Whompers with Spellbreaker and Unstoppable - 150 DU (90 DU possible) Cyborks and Spellbreaker, and yet, the best option here is still Flame Aura! Unfortunately, there are no good AoE options for physical damage because of Cyborks + Vanguards, so even though this lane has Spellbreaker, I just put down 2 Flame Auras. The lane setup makes it easy to put Flames close to the lane but out of reach of Cyborks. I do end up placing a Ballista behind the lane and facing towards my wall, but this lane is a bit wonky for projectiles, so while it had more damage than both Flames if I needed DU I could have upgraded the Flame Auras and ditched the Ballista. The wall actually got knocked down to half HP on the first wave, so I upped both Flames to level 2 and then it held for the rest of the game. Lane 8: Stabby Kamikazi - 50 DU. (30 DU possible) Just a simple air lane, one Skyguard. I could have used a Cannon or Sand Viper. Lane 9: Air Raid with Long Shot - 90 DU EMP = Obeslisk. Simple and straight forward. I like to place my anti-air up on this ring. The Skyguard actually died wave 5, but nothing interesting happened here. Lane 10: Hex-Frost Throwers - 220 DU The last lane for wave 1, so I overspend here. It's also pretty far from where I want to stand, so I don't mind overspending. Note that I still put Auras in this lane despite being Frost since this schedule doesn't have any minions thats freeze towers in 3/5 waves and only a few in the other 2. So now I'm sitting at 1470 / 1600 DU and I start wave 1. Lane 7's wall got hurt so I added upgrades here, but everything else did fine.
  11. Poison Dart Tower placed at the start of each lane, with your walls much further into the lane, will do a lot of damage to most things before they reach. But you are right. Early on, before range shards, AoE options are very mediocre versus Cyborks.
  12. [[83985,users]] I have a lot of legacy shards, and most of them either don't work in Onslaught (Water Elemental does not drench Controlled Burn lanes) or have been permanently disabled (Radiant Power). Out of the 24 Legacy shards, I feel like only 5 are good, and they usually aren't best in slot. Although I really like Super conductor.
  13. 1Earth I'm currently on floor 120, and I rarely fail maps anymore. I'd say maybe once every 5-10 floors. I made a preliminary tier list of onslaught defenses here, that I'll update very soon. I was also going to make a short hero DPS ranking, but I've been sidetracked playing They Are Billions. 1. Control Burn and Frost are usually among the most difficult schedule / mutators. But I actually prefer the Cybork variant of Control Burn over Geode. Frost and Cybork are functionally the same anyway, limiting ground defenses, and PDT are the most reliable way to apply status. I usually use 1 PDT near the start of the lane, and another at my wall to catch anything that made it through. If the lane is long enough, your first PDT will severely injure if not kill all enemies coming through, but if the lane is very short you'll need some pretty heavy AoE damage. I usually use 1 Ballista and 2 Cannons (with stun), unless the lane also has Guards, in which case you'll either have to hold it yourself or massively overspend it. 2. You don't need to double wall wide lanes, unless the lane is very short. The main offenders here are Lost Temple at the very bottom of the map, where there's a lane that needs 3 walls ( a wide and narrow choke ) and a very short lane that needs 2 walls. Hex Throwers always target the closest wall, so you just need to place one wall further up, and only place reflects on that. You can also use certain defenses as a 2nd wall, I usually use Frost Tower on some spots, just be sure to place the actual wall much closer. If the lane is long, I use an Earthshatter to catch and kill all Zerkers. You sometimes don't even need to wall unless the schedule has 6+ Zerkers. 3. Mulitple Lanes together are really good. This is because there's a lot of overlap, both in terms of walls (your 1-2 walls is now holding 3-4 lanes) and AoE defenses. You can also usually hold here yourself as player DPS, since if you are holding 3-4 lanes you'll have a ton of DU to spend elsewhere. Otherwise I'd use Rams + Earthshatter, since they ignore all Chaos Enemies. 4. I use an obelisk in every air lane. At 100+ EMPs can't be killed with a Skyguard, regardless of level, but they only deal roughly 500k damage so you can easily tank the 2-4 per wave with an Obeslisk that is actually extremely useful on the rest of the map too. I don't mind spending 90 DU on an air lane if most of that is helping other lanes too (I use Earth Toss). If you're on PC, I can hop in a game and show you some basic builds. On lower floors I was practicing with building with way less DU to learn some very lean and efficient builds.
  14. I just reached floor 100 in Onslaught. I was very happy to hit this milestone, until I realized something extremely depressing. I will never Prestige under the current system. It takes me roughly an hour to complete1 floor. That's assuming I never fail a map, that I never disconnect, that I build extremely quickly and just steamroll everything. If I prestige now, it will take me 100 hours to return where I am, just in pure floors. This does not include gearing up. This does not include looking for specific drops. This does not include sorting my inventory. Checking equipment. Moving shards to new defenses. Switching to better gear every floor. This does not include re-earning my ascension. 100 hours if I never fail. 100 hours if I never disconnect. 100 hours if I never have a single lapse of judgment that causes me to have to restart. Yes, I realize that early floors are less maps. Yes, I realize that failure is unlikely before a certain point, and maybe not at all since I would have gained so much experience on the way up. Yes, I realize that you can skip some maps playing through Trials. But 100 hours seems like a fair benchmark, given that failure resets your progress on each floor. That a disconnect can cost you all your progress for a day. Some maps take longer to build. Some people take longer to build. Sometimes I don't want to play Onslaught, and I'll play something else. If I played 1 hour a day, it would take me more than 3 months to get back to where I am. It would take me an entire season just to return to exactly where I am now. 1 hour a day might not seem like a lot to some players, but 1 hour a day is how much you should practice when you are trying to master a new skill. To learn a new language. To learn an instrument. To become fit. Why? Because every other trade or profession considers 1 hours a day to be a large time commitment. And what would I gain for this? 61Ascension and 1% power. 1220 Defense Power and Crit, and 1% Defense Power. What does this mean in actual numbers? My flame aura would be roughly 5% Stronger. If I quit my job and did nothing but play full time, it would take me 2 and a half weeks to get back to where I was and earn 5% power. Does this seem reasonable to you? The thing is, I'm really enjoying Onslaught. The game mode is great. I enjoy the puzzle aspect of building around certain challenges. I enjoy maximizing DU to try to compensate for difficult lanes elsewhere. I love when I overestimate my defenses abilities in one or more spots and scramble to recover. But the system built around it is complete off the mark. What if I made it to 300 and wanted to restart? I'd have to spend 9 months getting back to where I was. This is ignoring the other problem that if I did Prestige, I would spend the majority of those 100 hours playing content well beneath my level. That I would essentially be playing mindless AFK drudgery without any challenge.
  15. Hey, I'm on floor 94. Gear stops around 60, so the mobs vastly overpower the gear that I am using. Vampiric can cause problems, but there are many ways around it. You can build your walls a bit further back. You can use crowd control to prevent them from attacking. You can use EV2's Reflect Beam to stop ranged attacks. You can use slows to make them take longer to reach your walls. If it's a tough lane, you can spend more DU here, and less DU in easy lanes! If you see a boss coming here, you can use a Hero with strong crowd control or high damage (or both!) to stop them from healing or take them out quickly. There's probably tons of combinations I haven't thought of. Part of the fun (or challenge, depending on your perspective) of Onslaught is building around each lane setup.
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