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Odinwolfe

Eternal Limbo.

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[QUOTE]But then this comes right back to the debate of shards survivals being beatable without the EV (and summoner for Sky) which we seem to disagree on. [/QUOTE]Survival was originally percieved to be endless. No survival has to be played through to the end in order to beat the game and see the credits. Thus, I don't feel it has to be lowered to the same standard of completability as the main game- It's supposed to be much harder than the main game. Again, that's just how i feel. Beating all the survivals is like beating the True Final Boss in an RPG. It's hard as crap, but something you have to do to get through the game and see the ending. It's the very fact that it's not required that allows them to make it so much harder than everything else.

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Wonder how many people actually believe they would dare make DD2 their next project at this point.

I don't even think Trendy is dumb enough to make that mistake so soon. I do think that they eventually will if they remain as the same team for a couple years and enjoy some success, but if they treat their next game like this one, then I will not be getting my hopes up for a high quality game as their third release.


What game do you think they'll work on next? Chicken Coup II? Ha!

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That's more than a little spiteful. So you think there's no chance in hell a developer could learn from its mistakes in developing one software title on its next one? And you would go so far as to "not let" your friends buy a game from that developer? Can't they make their own decisions?


They can, they can learn from their errors, but they also can fix by releasing a patch, instead of focusing onto the next game they will release.

It's like a moment ago, I bought a second-hand LG phone, and it had major bugs. no patch whatsoever, but they did learn from customer feedback, and they corrected it... in their next phone series. That's what made me quite mad.

Trendy should correct bugs in DD and concentrate not to make the same mistakes in DD2 or something. This, would be the best solution ever, even if they should retard the launch of DD2 from some weeks, they would retain the majority of the player fanbase here to buy their game.

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[QUOTE]
Trendy should correct bugs in DD and concentrate not to make the same mistakes in DD2 or something.[/QUOTE]There are still some patches to come, and they absolutely are wise enough not to make the same mistakes again.

You should also be aware that none of their next projects are coming out any time soon. Again, read the thread above. Whatever idea they're trying to execute now they didn't just come up with yesterday.

About the phone analogy: you ought to expect if you buy a used phone that there might be problems with it (and no warranty, yada yada yada). Also what you described is just how the phone industry works. Technology advances too fast so they don't have the time or means to keep supporting all their older phones once they make their new ones. I understand how that can upset you, but this is also why phones are so cheap and / or are often given away by the wireless companies.

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Specifically states that it's easier with DLC characters but intended to be beatable by any characters. It would be wrong to say "easier w/ dlc *BUT* beatable by any if the "any" always included a DLC character, because that would negate the first statement- "easier with" doesn't mean "impossible without."


Not trying to argue, but let me clarify that. There is a difference between "any" and "every." "Any" just means that a certain amount of combinations are viable while "every" means that all combinations can be used. "Any" is a word that can include one or some (regardless of how many there are), but is not used to include everything.

That's why I said that the answer was ambiguous. With the way it is written it can still mean that nightmare is balanced on the usage of specific characters.

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Not trying to argue, but let me clarify that. There is a difference between "any" and "every." "Any" just means that a certain amount of combinations are viable while "every" means that all combinations can be used. "Any" is a word that can include one or some (regardless of how many there are), but is not used to include everything.

That's why I said that the answer was ambiguous. With the way it is written it can still mean that nightmare is balanced on the usage of specific characters.


"Any" does mean "every" in the answer that was given

[quote]It's balanced around any combination of 4 heroes (definitely not meant to be taken on be a lone player).[/quote]

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Even all of that aside, it is a massive gear issue. Without a community to trade with, it becomes near impossible to progress. Would take months upon months just to gear up for the shard maps, and honestly, that is assuming you play for 7-10 hours a day farming.


Alas you describe me all to well!

It took me months of grinding to break 2k hero attack and 3k towers.

I see people hit these stats wicked fast by some while others such as myself get screwed by RNG for months.

I avoided shops for fear of hacked gear and RNG boned me every chance it had.

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[QUOTE]It took me months of grinding to break 2k hero attack and 3k towers.

I see people hit these stats wicked fast by some while others such as myself get screwed by RNG for months.[/QUOTE]

Ditto

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So, piecing together the hints dropped by Alhanalem, it looks like the next Trendy game won't be coming for a LOOOONG time, it will be called "Afterlife," and it will be a 180 degree change from the DunDef art style. I'm not sure what that means... but I'm guessing afterlife will either be a super-realistic, brown-and-gray, uncanny valley game, or something so stylized you need to be under the influence to "get" it (like some of the PixelJunk games for PS3).

So, if Afterlife isn't coming out for a while, how will the Trendy team afford to feed themselves and keep a roof over their heads without a revenue stream? Maybe continuing sales of Dungeon Defenders? Maybe they should polish up the last few problems with the game so people will actually continue buying and playing it. Having a stellar game with a broken endgame is guaranteed to leave a bad lingering aftertaste.

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To be honest, I won't be buying DD2 (if it ever comes out). And I won't let my friends either (they probably wouldn't anyway since they are as frustrated as me). The reasons have been posted a thousand times on the forums and Trendy's indifference about it has turned my love for DD into frustration.



Claiming I won't buy DD2 is a lame attempt at influencing Trendy, and to be honest. I think that they will not make the same mistake twice. I am betting DD2 will be more satisfying at the end game after all of this hubbub about how poorly DD ended.



I'm one of those who went over to D3 and was sure that it would be satisfying and completely destroy DD. Much to my dismay, D3 was god-awful. I kept hoping for a patch that would fix it, but it was not coming. After about a month, I came back to DD. I tried to pick it up where I had left off and was completely in love with the Summoner and parts of the Jester. I started up my favorite haunts (survival misty mire and some of the original maps) only to be DESTROYED by ogre copters. I tried this and that and another thing to counter this new threat, but everything ended up basically the same.

I took another step back and started re-doing some things on insane instead of nightmare - after much lamenting and hurt pride - and attempted to get some drops that would make my gear better. I got fed up with that and just decided to sell my cube and portal gun, then use that money to buy some nice gear.

Anyway, long story short: I came back to the forums to see if others were having the same issues I was and to see if there was maybe that patch that would make life more tenable. I saw that there were no upcoming patch notes and very few Trendy posts. It was PAX and I hoped maybe they were gone there, so I waited. I played some more and tried different tactics. I got a little better at my favorite levels and eventually was able to get past wave 18 on most, but it didn't help because I wasn't getting any better gear and was basically frustrating myself. I came back to the forums after a week or two and saw much the same thing I saw the week of PAX... nothing.

Then the digest came out that said they were absolutely not fixing RNG and it essentially sounded like they were giving up on DD. It was covered up with PR-talk, but reading between the lines said that they had made their money on it and they were moving on. I kinda got that sense after getting the legendary skins, too. It just seemed like they had fun with the Summoner and the Jester, but building that last level was forcing them to do something that they didn't want to do.

So, what I hope you leave this textwall with is my experience. Some people are only out for money. Some people will take something extremely popular and kill it (Diablo 3). Some people will start out really indie and make something revolutionary, then they'll get money and become mainstream, then try to get more money and more fame (Dungeon Defenders 2?). It was fun while it lasted, but what I've learned is you can't wait for a patch to fix a game, especially after you and seemingly everyone else asks for it and the devs simply won't listen. When they say "it's too deeply built into the game to change" (this game) or "we know many of you are upset and we've heard your concerns, but we're going to try this to make the game fun" (Diablo 3), you can rest assured that you will never be appeased and your voice will never be heard. You can accept that and continue to play the game, or you can move on. Those are your options. *****ing on a forum is not an option.

In closing, it was fun while it lasted guys. Enjoy your pocketfulls of money, because there are many of us who will never give you more.

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So...'bout that patch that was supposed to have come this past weekend, that was mentioned in the Digest?


It was supposed to come out Sunday night. I'm looking into the situation right now.

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So...'bout that patch that was supposed to have come this past weekend, that was mentioned in the Digest?


I was a little disappointed, too. Then I realized that next to nothing that NEEDS to be patched is going to get it, so why even get worked up? Time for a different game.

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I was a little disappointed, too. Then I realized that next to nothing that NEEDS to be patched is going to get it, so why even get worked up? Time for a different game.
Don't be so sure.

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Don't be so sure.


Would definitely be nice if the "Upcoming Patch Notes" at least had some information in it like it use to. For a patch that was scheduled yesterday, why couldn't someone spend a few minutes to write up exactly what is going in the patch? Until it's either released, or the notes are updated, I think it's to be expected that we assume the worst at this point. Although personally my fingers are crossed for at least one major fix/change that was requested.

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[QUOTE]Would definitely be nice if the "Upcoming Patch Notes" at least had some information in it like it use to.[/QUOTE]No disagreement there. That being said, Hitmonchan said that the patch was expected to be out by now and is currently trying to find out more information, so please hold tight.

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Don't be so sure.


http://forums.trendyent.com/showthread.php?44150-Current-Known-Issues-Last-Updated-7-25-12

Once that list starts taking some serious hits, I'll start to assume Trendy's commitment to fixing problems. But the fact is that matters like item rollover prove that it doesn't matter how detrimental an issue may be, anything is up for grabs to never get fixed.

Besides...

Remember, at this point you can't expect much more than minor changes to the game for the most part. Trendy is investing most of its time on its next projects.


And we all know Public Enemy #1, the RNG, has nothing to fear. So I'll be pessimistic, thanks.

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So, have you got any new info about that?


No new info yet. Your best bet is to keep an eye on the Patch Notes section. I wish I had more to share with you.

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Is there a reason the patch notes haven't been updated, at least? The powers that be usually aren't so hush-hush about letting us know what to expect. It's like there's some big secret under wraps, but I honestly don't know what they would even put in the work to do that could be that big of a deal anymore.

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Is there a reason the patch notes haven't been updated, at least? The powers that be usually aren't so hush-hush about letting us know what to expect. It's like there's some big secret under wraps, but I honestly don't know what they would even put in the work to do that could be that big of a deal anymore.


There's been some suggestions on the forums for fixing progression (and they even provided the code for the changes) that would be fairly easily to implement. Maybe they are fixing a lot of stuff with this patch and that's why it's taking them longer than they expected. If it was just the costume speed increase and KG difficulty reduction then it probably would have been out already.

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There's been some suggestions on the forums for fixing progression (and they even provided the code for the changes) that would be fairly easily to implement. Maybe they are fixing a lot of stuff with this patch and that's why it's taking them longer than they expected. If it was just the costume speed increase and KG difficulty reduction then it probably would have been out already.


Be still my beating heart. If they made this game worth playing again I'd actually have to recant what I told my wife about being done with this. That'd feel pretty stupid.

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There's been some suggestions on the forums for fixing progression (and they even provided the code for the changes) that would be fairly easily to implement. Maybe they are fixing a lot of stuff with this patch and that's why it's taking them longer than they expected. If it was just the costume speed increase and KG difficulty reduction then it probably would have been out already.


We can only hope. But I am guessing the opposite. If it was the amazing patch we are all hoping for I would think they would have had the notes updated awhile ago to get us all excited and hanging around. The fact it still isn't updated makes me think it's a weak patch and only minor or inconsequential things no one cares about.

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We can only hope. But I am guessing the opposite. If it was the amazing patch we are all hoping for I would think they would have had the notes updated awhile ago to get us all excited and hanging around. The fact it still isn't updated makes me think it's a weak patch and only minor or inconsequential things no one cares about.

Same here, I think they're just focusing on their next project. The game seems to be dying both ways (development wise and player wise) which is understandable considering its age.

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