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Tsuda

The King's Game and its state of balance.

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I would like to start off by apologizing on behalf of the team for several problems that arose with this latest bit of content. If you know who I am, I am blunt and to the point. The balance of The King's Game was not working as intended due to a bug in the maps enemy difficulty scaling.

After reading through the 20 some odd pages of balance discussion, the thoughts of the community mostly reflected that of what we had intended.

The King's Game is meant to be difficult, but not as difficult as the previous maps. Fundamentally, the map is easier even structurally. The rewards are intended to be quite good, but not a joke (no pun intended) to get. We want players who have had trouble clearing some of the previous maps (especially the shards maps) a chance to get that extra push in gear to put them over the hill.

In the coming patch we will be increasing the enemy difficulty of the map, but for those having trouble on Nightmare as is, this should not be another brick wall. The quality of the rewards, although good as is, are being very slightly increased as a response to this mistake.

Again, I apologize for a botched map difficulty, enjoy the rewards while they are easier to get.

If you have any questions, feel free to leave them below and I will answer if possible.

Please keep this thread civil. :summoner:

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As long as the drop quality isn't nerfed to uselessness (or nerfed at all, rather) this sounds fine to me. I've run misty and aqua wave 1-30 NM HC many times and never got an actual upgrade for any of my characters, some of which were still in junky myth. In one run of King's Game I found about 4 upgrades, and they didn't take me a total of 100+ hours to get...

I can handle more difficulty, but I can't handle being at the mercy of the "car without wheels" functionality of the RNG. So provided this stays like you say I'm all for it. Love the map as well.

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My brother-in-law and myself were up ALL night farming this map. We have had nothing but frustration trying to get any amount of Trans items to drop, and this map was a welcome chance for us to finally get over that hurdle.

That and the shiny tiles make for a fun, sleep-deprived good time! "Look at me!!! Im flying...wait...right off the map...Ahhhhhhh!" lol

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Drops will not be changed.

Oh, I wish I could hug you right now. I absolutely love this new map, and the drops that come with it.
Though I do wish the Increased Jump Height would last a few seconds longer, as it stands now if you jump immediately after getting it you can get 2 high jumps in before it ends.

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Oh, I wish I could hug you right now. I absolutely love this new map, and the drops that come with it.
Though I do wish the Increased Jump Height would last a few seconds longer, as it stands now if you jump immediately after getting it you can get 2 high jumps in before it ends.


Done. Made it twice as long.

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Noo the map is ok as it is. :(
How about making better drops on all the other maps as well then.

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Fwew, thank you for this thread. :)

When I saw the Patch Notes, I got worried, but its good to know y'all won't be ramping it up too much. :)

Thank you :)

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can you PLEASE make it so when you drop something from the forge it doesn't fall of the edge? :(
My friend dropped me a item and it fell right into the hole. :(

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How much harder will it be? I have gear I farmed mostly from Misty NM and just now am able to get into maybe low 20s into Aqua NM. A several hour run MIGHT give me an upgrade, or might not. Main stats on my characters are around 1500.

I found survival a challenge. I had to be active from wave 20 on, and even 5 to 10 seconds of not paying attention to one crystal could be a disaster.

I can understand how people with stats of 2500 or more would not find this a challenge, but for those of us who are still trying to crack Aqua wave 30, this map was a VERY nice stepping stone.

I know it's hard to put numbers on game playability... but what sort of equipment do you expect people to need to defeat nightmare, and get to 30 survival in it? Right now that seems to be 1500-2000 at least for survival. With the fix it will be...?

Thanks for sticking around to be grilled. :)

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can you PLEASE make it so when you drop something from the forge it doesn't fall of the edge? :(
My friend dropped me a item and it fell right into the hole. :(


It will land on the deck below :P

How much harder will it be? I have gear I farmed mostly from Misty NM and just now am able to get into maybe low 20s into Aqua NM. A several hour run MIGHT give me an upgrade, or might not. Main stats on my characters are around 1500.

I found survival a challenge. I had to be active from wave 20 on, and even 5 to 10 seconds of not paying attention to one crystal could be a disaster.

I can understand how people with stats of 2500 or more would not find this a challenge, but for those of us who are still trying to crack Aqua wave 30, this map was a VERY nice stepping stone.

I know it's hard to put numbers on game playability... but what sort of equipment do you expect people to need to defeat nightmare, and get to 30 survival in it? Right now that seems to be 1500-2000 at least for survival. With the fix it will be...?

Thanks for sticking around to be grilled. :)


It will have enemies that are nearly as hard as Sky City, however; the general layout of the map and available assists (tiles) will make the map a lot easier in reference to Sky City.

I can not say exactly what I would expect people to have for Nightmare because player skill does play a large role in filling the number gap.

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Tsuda while your at it could you maybe change the music to something less ***... cause this sky o'love track reaaaaaly makes my ears bleed^^

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By slightly increased reward quality, is that going to make the negative stats across the board on the item get worse or better? If they are rolling over that would be a very bad thing, but if that fixes the negative issue that would be awesome.

This is what most of the guns I've been getting look like. NMHC/NMHCMM w30.

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I would like to start off by apologizing on behalf of the team for several problems that arose with this latest bit of content. If you know who I am, I am blunt and to the point. The balance of The King's Game was not working as intended due to a bug in the maps enemy difficulty scaling.

After reading through the 20 some odd pages of balance discussion, the thoughts of the community mostly reflected that of what we had intended.

The King's Game is meant to be difficult, but not as difficult as the previous maps. Fundamentally, the map is easier even structurally. The rewards are intended to be quite good, but not a joke (no pun intended) to get. We want players who have had trouble clearing some of the previous maps (especially the shards maps) a chance to get that extra push in gear to put them over the hill.



In the coming patch we will be increasing the enemy difficulty of the map, but for those having trouble on Nightmare as is, this should not be another brick wall. The quality of the rewards, although good as is, are being very slightly increased as a response to this mistake.

Again, I apologize for a botched map difficulty, enjoy the rewards while they are easier to get.

If you have any questions, feel free to leave them below and I will answer if possible.

Please keep this thread civil. :summoner:



I dont know why you want to rise the enemy difficulty. Sure, those claiming it to be "WAY TOO EASY, SO NOOBS CAN GET GOOD GEAR... I DONT WANT THAT" probably have awesome gear and seemingly dont care about the drops you can get there.

Im quite a nerd, gaming every single free second, playing this game for hours and hours and hours. Moreover i am a pretty good gamer and for me, it is difficult to finish this map on nightmare hc mm, but for gods sake, it is doable. After all this time it is possible for me to improve myself. To come into the joy of getting better armor, to see a light in the darkness of nightmare and now i hear you want to rerise the difficulty...

I assume, most of the guys being active in this forum have badass gear, having no Problems doing the Shards Maps on Nightmare HC, even having finished Crystalline Dimension on any difficulty higher than easy.

Those having already high gear now will Powerfarming this map. Having loads and tons of ultimates and supremes afterwards for all their chars. Those having not that good gear will probably start trying that map and failing before they get to waves dropping trans or supreme / ultimates. In conclusion this means making this map more difficult with the next patch you just boost the rift between already good heroes and mid to bad heroes.

I know my post will get ragged after i press post reply but i think it has to be said.

How much harder will it be? I have gear I farmed mostly from Misty NM and just now am able to get into maybe low 20s into Aqua NM. A several hour run MIGHT give me an upgrade, or might not. Main stats on my characters are around 1500.

I found survival a challenge. I had to be active from wave 20 on, and even 5 to 10 seconds of not paying attention to one crystal could be a disaster.

I can understand how people with stats of 2500 or more would not find this a challenge, but for those of us who are still trying to crack Aqua wave 30, this map was a VERY nice stepping stone.

I know it's hard to put numbers on game playability... but what sort of equipment do you expect people to need to defeat nightmare, and get to 30 survival in it? Right now that seems to be 1500-2000 at least for survival. With the fix it will be...?

Thanks for sticking around to be grilled. :)


This!

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The problem is, for all those people who enjoyed this map as a stepping stone... it ISN'T. It doesn't bridge any of the large gaps, it simply skips to the end. The loot quality on this map is essentially at the same level as the very hardest maps. Look at the pawnshot for instance... an Ultimate Pawnshot literally has more damage per upgrade and the same SPS of the Ultimate Eternian Energy Cannon. It's BETTER than the weapon from the hardest map in the game. Not to mention, if you want to get a NM HC level Pawnshot, all you have to do is select NM HC. If you want a NM HC level CD weapon, you have to beat all 4 eternia maps on NM HC first, THEN beat an extremely challenging level.

The loot in the level is incredible too. I've never seen Transcendent items dropped in Campaign mode before. I don't know the exact numbers involved, but I expect that the actual drop quality on this map is at least equal to that of the high-end Shards maps.

We're not talking about bridging a gap here, guys. We're talking about building a long enough bridge that climbs past everything, because there's very little improvement to be had once you finish farming this map.

If it was truly bridging a gap, making it easier for people to start farming their upgrades from Aquanos or Sky City instead, I'd be all for it. But it seems HARDER to find upgrades on Aqua/Sky City... not because you can't beat them, but because the gear here is better.

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Making the enemies as a difficult as Sky City is going to work very poorly on this map, imo. It's way too small and confined to have 60 million hp ogres that can whack the crystal from 25 meters away. And not to mention the wyvern projectiles and goblin copter rockets that somehow damage your defenses despite the fact that they directly hit a reflect wall.

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NMHC Mistymire Survival will give you armor that will go into the 2k+ range. Whoever said they barely have 1.5k is not upgrading properly, not picking the right gear, or just plain lying.

With the right layouts, you can go from Wave 30 Misty to Wave 30 Aquanos.

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Making the enemies as a difficult as Sky City is going to work very poorly on this map, imo. It's way too small and confined to have 60 million hp ogres that can whack the crystal from 25 meters away. And not to mention the wyvern projectiles and goblin copter rockets that somehow damage your defenses despite the fact that they directly hit a reflect wall.


Definitely this. If you're going to increase the difficulty, Misty/Moraggo levels would be much better, IMO. Map is way too small and open to be Sky City level of difficulty.

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NMHC Mistymire Survival will give you armor that will go into the 2k+ range. Whoever said they barely have 1.5k is not upgrading properly, not picking the right gear, or just plain lying.

With the right layouts, you can go from Wave 30 Misty to Wave 30 Aquanos.


That's with the assumption you have access to the DLC characters though. A lot of people stuck on progression are in such a state because for whatever reason they don't have SEV or Summoner. Without those 2, it's a lot harder to make the jump to Aqua from Misty.

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In the coming patch we will be increasing the enemy difficulty of the map, but for those having trouble on Nightmare as is, this should not be another brick wall. The quality of the rewards, although good as is, are being very slightly increased as a response to this mistake.


How will it not be another brickwall? If players can't do the shards maps, I don't see how making the enemies as difficult as they are on the final shard map will turn this into anything but another brick wall.

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