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Solve the Paranoia

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This game is completely riddled with paranoia, it's honestly out of hand.

The constant fear of being banned for an item you buy is utterly ridiculous and severely hurts the fun of an other wise great game. The complete randomness of the drops makes it near impossible to judge what is hacked and what is not beyond the blatant hacks. This included the "end-gamer"s' opinions, I have specifically talked to several of the most well-known players on the forums and in the game; they simply do not know when it comes to amazing items or what could just be a clever hack.

And what about the honest player that buys something that is admittedly very good but pays a justifiable high amount for it? What if this player gets banned for playing the game as it was designed and how everybody else plays it; that money they spent on the game, DLC's (as most of us buy it all) is an utter waste. Not to mention amount the extreme amount of hours some of us put into the game to have everything yanked from you when you never intentionally did anything wrong, unless you consider playing the game as doing something wrong.

Some will say, "oh just farm everything yourself". Which would consist of 100's of hours to look for the gear you need, it is simply not practical. This game is a 100% gear-based or stats-based game and with that comes the trading. To simply say "never trade and you will be okay" is a ridiculous solution that is not viable to 99% of us. DD has centered itself around trading, this is not the players fault. It was developed around trading and anyone can see that, to just ignore trading is an absurd "solution."

What's worse? As previously stated there is NO way to identify if an item is hacked or not. The one potential solution, which would be time consuming but would at the very least give the players an "out" is to send item checks to Trendy as I've seen some suggest here. As most will tell you, that is a waste of time. They simply ignore your item check leaving you wondering and paranoid. I have experienced this myself on 3 separate occasions when I have submitted an item check. This story is further supported by several others I have talked to, all of which were ignored by Trendy when an item check was submitted.

End the paranoia Trendy, I'm tired of being reluctant to use any good item I see in fear of being banned for playing the game the way it was intended on being played.

Keep the thread civil, think before you post, and use your intelligence when posting. I do not want to see this thread being closed, awareness is the key to solution.

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I think if you guys are worried ablaut it being to complicated join the consoles we get very little so its pretty simple on our side of the game...

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This again?

It's not that difficult. If you're using an item that's hacked, but it looks 100% completely legit. Nothing bad is going to happen. Know why? Cause you're not going to be reported.

That's all it boils down to. I'm sure at least a few of the people I've seen with insane stats have been hackers, but unless their equipment is outlandish enough to be impossible (I'm talking, 500's in all stats on all armor) then I don't report them. Other people won't report them, and if you're not reported you're not going to get banned.

There's no reason to be paranoid. You just have to be smart. If you're given an item that sounds too good to be true, ask the forums.

It's unfortunate, but true. If a hacker is SMART enough to make a completely legit looking set, they could get away with it. Possibly forever. They don't worry though, because it looks legit, and because it looks legit, they won't get reported. The only things people should worry about are the dumb hackers who give themselves full supreme outfits with 400 levels and 600 to all stats.

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I think the only hackers that are left are the smart ones the hard ones to catch you will never be truly rid of them because they will come back somehow!

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This again?

It's not that difficult. If you're using an item that's hacked, but it looks 100% completely legit. Nothing bad is going to happen. Know why? Cause you're not going to be reported.

That's all it boils down to. I'm sure at least a few of the people I've seen with insane stats have been hackers, but unless their equipment is outlandish enough to be impossible (I'm talking, 500's in all stats on all armor) then I don't report them. Other people won't report them, and if you're not reported you're not going to get banned.

There's no reason to be paranoid. You just have to be smart. If you're given an item that sounds too good to be true, ask the forums.

It's unfortunate, but true. If a hacker is SMART enough to make a completely legit looking set, they could get away with it. Possibly forever. They don't worry though, because it looks legit, and because it looks legit, they won't get reported. The only things people should worry about are the dumb hackers who give themselves full supreme outfits with 400 levels and 600 to all stats.



To rely on others not to report you is not a solution at all, basically that would just rely on luck on whether if you get reported or not- that's not fair to anyone.

I've personally been called out for hacking on an item that I personally picked up off the ground. I was apparently reported in this instance, that'll all fine and dandy for that item that I know is legit. But what about all of the items I have bought on the forums or in game that supposedly get checked when you are reported.

Relying on luck that another player does not report you is not a solution.

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You're making it sound like Trendy has a machine that they input account info for, which will look for any hacked item, and take action if any are found.

Trendy are human beings. Just like you and me. They've also said before they look at every hacking claim seriously. If they find someone has 40 billion legit items, and 2-3 hacked ones, it's probably safe to assume the person is not a hacker, and the items that were found were just coincidence.

It's not something to be worried about. If it's a serious concern of yours, ask the grouping / trading forum. I've asked there everytime I've reported someone, and always got prompt replies from members of the community.

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My friend was recently VAC banned for some reason. I'm unsure why, sadly, he bought a too-good-to-be-true monkey.

I know VAC bans arent something trendy can put on an acct.

I honestly suggest to not buy from a shop. You can buy starting gear or something, but I've seen a few shops with some op items.

Hopefully a solution or an answer will come from this VAC ban.
Mmm. Now I got no one to play with ;(

Please be sure to avoid some shops. If its too good to be true, then do not buy it. Someone could wrongfully accuse you of hacking items and get you banned from ranked. Thanks.

Right before summoner ;/ hot damn. I was hoping to buy it for him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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I'm not paranoid of getting banned (before I was, because people was going "omg that myth armor is impossible to get"). Now I just simply don't care if they report me. I earned the item I was farming for, and hell I will F***ing use it.

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You will be paranoid forever :/ The best you can do is be careful and do what Ruoivas has suggested.

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My friend was recently VAC banned for some reason. I'm unsure why, sadly, he bought a too-good-to-be-true monkey.

I know VAC bans arent something trendy can put on an acct.

I honestly suggest to not buy from a shop. You can buy starting gear or something, but I've seen a few shops with some op items.

Hopefully a solution or an answer will come from this VAC ban.
Mmm. Now I got no one to play with ;(

Please be sure to avoid some shops. If its too good to be true, then do not buy it. Someone could wrongfully accuse you of hacking items and get you banned from ranked. Thanks.

Right before summoner ;/ hot damn. I was hoping to buy it for him.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


He wasn't VAC banned for buying something from a player shop. Trendy does not have the power to VAC ban people. Your friend was banned because he was using a cheating program, or was mistakenly VAC banned. Either way, it had nothing to do with buying that monkey.

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He wasn't VAC banned for buying something from a player shop. Trendy does not have the power to VAC ban people. Your friend was banned because he was using a cheating program, or was mistakenly VAC banned. Either way, it had nothing to do with buying that monkey.


The awesome thing about VAC is that it doesn't ban offenders right away; it has a delayed affect.
The point is so cheaters will have a harder time finding out why they were banned.

Also you are exactly correct. I just wanted to throw that tidbit out there.

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People scared of being banned are generally unskilled, and happened to catch a lucky break. Elite players don't worry about this because they know what they get is legit. They vend and shop because it is time effective (time = money = mana ~ skill).

Hackers have no reason, other that malice, to sell their hacked items.

Malice is impossible to stop; nothing else is relevant.

TLDR: hackers are non-existent as long as you don't befriend them knowingly.

PS: players with absurd stats who are clueless to builds may be hacking.

PS II: Most hackers are smart enough to just plain and simply "skip the bull****" and will never be recognized.

Don't worry about them (unless you are suspicious of hackers buying your items with bull**** tokens), it's really that simple.

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He wasn't VAC banned for buying something from a player shop. Trendy does not have the power to VAC ban people. Your friend was banned because he was using a cheating program, or was mistakenly VAC banned. Either way, it had nothing to do with buying that monkey.


I figured this to be true. I havent talked to him since he was banned.

He doesn't hack which is odd... I just hope a solution or a reason for being banned is brought up.
But thanks for tellig me VAC isnt triggered from being banned on ranked.

I'm not worried about being VAC banned. Just the sight of seeing a friend VAC banned is what's scary :/


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The awesome thing about VAC is that it doesn't ban offenders right away; it has a delayed affect.
The point is so cheaters will have a harder time finding out why they were banned.


Delayed bans have their advantages and disadvantages.

Unless you have been using a number of different programs you will no doubt know exactly what program got you banned.

The point of delayed bans is to catch more people and to try to slow down the development of cheats. It makes it harder for the program designers.

Steam probably also makes more money that way, even if its not much more.

I figured this to be true. I havent talked to him since he was banned.

He doesn't hack which is odd... I just hope a solution or a reason for being banned is brought up.
But thanks for tellig me VAC isnt triggered from being banned on ranked.


He cheated in one game or more, he might not of in Dungeon Defenders but the only way to find out is to ask him. Vac bans are game specific, so he will know what game(s) he has been banned from.

EDIT: On Topic:- Trendy created the paranoia, whether they did it intentionally or not why would they solve it if it keeps the game a little cleaner/cheater free?

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hello :)
let me add one to this.

the other day i saw a guy who had accessories with stats higher than 100's. and we ALL know for a fact accessories NEVER reach past 100. he had a shield with 500's. there are ways to catch them in the act as well. one time i was playing a glitterhelm INHC to farm xp, and suddenly my striker towers were doing 133337 damage. when i deleted th e upgraded turret, and put my DST back down, it did the same damage.

if it has more than three or four 400-500 stats, and there are no negatives, its hacked. no matter the amount of ups it has.
i've seen 200's across the boards, i've never seen 300's across the boards, and i've never seen a item that had 200's and 300's and only have health dps speed summon, and then all the towers at the bottom. i am a shopkeeper, and i see loads of items every day. Bear in mind I am only one person.

here's the point of it all:

the easy hackers are gone. the guys using trainers are gone. all thats left now that i've seen is the ninja hackers, that dont tell you or anyone else what they are doing, and dont advertise by loading their stuff with high stats. instead they do what i described above, and hack things directly, or balance their gear appropriately. now its gonna be hard. fast and hard rule should be if you think its hacked, you're probably right.

but this sucks because i have several pieces of supreme gear with 400's and 500's on them. i am afriad to open a match to the general noob public because they just dont know the specs of legit gear... so... trendy... can we please get a response on this? i'm tired of having to hide my games because i have over 2k on a stat. i've been accused of hacking myself, but tyipcally i play with players with more 'situational awareness' than those of a tree shrub. even so, the fact remains we are not being told what the highest legitimate stats can look like, and we're to this is to to prevent hacking? i hope this isn't the case.

the fast hard rule is that if it has negatives, its got a chance of being legit. if all their stats are 400's 500's on an item, accessory, etc, its obviously hacked. this is all i really know. i've never seen a piece of supreme that had more than 2 500's. and i've never seen a piece of anything with a stat of 600. this is all i honestly know, and it could be i just haven't seen any at that high, or that could be the current state of things. either way, if you think its hacked dont buy it. and dont buy anything in any shops that require you to pay money, as this goes against the TOS.

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I really hate playing on public, with any supreme armor or weapon (or good trans), equipped on my heroes. Because I know, I will be harassed for having decent gear.
I was playing with a friend recently on a random map, and suddenly (out of nowhere) I was kicked. Over steam, my friend told me, that the host said "Lol, obvious hacker" after the kick. Thanks for ruining my playtime with a friend, I said to myself. Similar events have forced me into hosting games. Most of my gear is found by myself, so I can almost guarantee that it isn't hacked, but this is where it gets cruel. What if one of the pieces I've brought was hacked? What is I misjudged some gear, and I was suddenly banned from a game that I enjoy? Do I really want to risk that?

hello :)
the fast hard rule is that if it has negatives, its got a chance of being legit. if all their stats are 400's 500's on an item, accessory, etc, its obviously hacked. this is all i really know.


This kind of **** drives me crazy. Do you have any sources on this information? Do you really know that all good items necessarily have negatives (or else they are hacked)? Yes, if every stat is in the 500 range, then it's obviously hacked. Thank you Einstein. But if it have negatives, it's suddenly in doubt. That is not a good rule for identifying hacked gear. What if something is on the edge, a really good item with some negatives? I don't want such rules to dominate this game.

We have created a culture of fear and doubt. Let's remove the paranoia.

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This again?

It's not that difficult. If you're using an item that's hacked, but it looks 100% completely legit. Nothing bad is going to happen. Know why? Cause you're not going to be reported.

That's all it boils down to. I'm sure at least a few of the people I've seen with insane stats have been hackers, but unless their equipment is outlandish enough to be impossible (I'm talking, 500's in all stats on all armor) then I don't report them. Other people won't report them, and if you're not reported you're not going to get banned.

There's no reason to be paranoid. You just have to be smart. If you're given an item that sounds too good to be true, ask the forums.

It's unfortunate, but true. If a hacker is SMART enough to make a completely legit looking set, they could get away with it. Possibly forever. They don't worry though, because it looks legit, and because it looks legit, they won't get reported. The only things people should worry about are the dumb hackers who give themselves full supreme outfits with 400 levels and 600 to all stats.


your wrong cause if you joined some random dudes game who hasn't seen good mythic and you have access to endgame contentthat you can trade over to 74+ characters to level up in you could get reported.

e.g. i own many dropped trans and supremes with no neg stats (wave 28-30 drops nm hc mm) to a "Newb" who hasn't seen those drops like 99% of the player base most likely they would seem hacked. (data acquired from open mode without any drop modding)

THIS IS CAUSE YOU DONT KNOW THE RNG, the fact its rng makes it even worse to "guess whats legit". If their was any clear way to know from sight an item is hacked then every hacker would copy pasta the stats. So HAVING A HUMAN SYSTEM IF STUPID AND TOTAL LAZINESS ON THE DEVS SIDE.

Are data is on their servers for ranked, they could easily make a programs that scans through all users gears and modify's or deletes the items if it is above what IS possible. By possible I mean rare drops are not punished e.g. no neg stat items, high base are not toned down due to low drop rate.

This is the only solution to this problem and trendy need to man up if they want a ranked option in their game.
Other wise we have
open mode (mod away mode)
ranked mode (mod away but dont tell anyone mode)

Side note: To the people talking about VAC it why its so successful because it has no human interaction at all. Yeah as a program there may be times when a false positive happens but with refinement and decent programming that can be solved to an extent.

e.g. I dont like the VAC is never wrong logic, if vac banned you or someone used some program Vac does not like is the simple answer but however there might be something else that caused a ban. In my experience vac works
TF2 player X has disconnected "reason vac banned" was so much laughing in voice chat that game.

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I really hate playing on public, with any supreme armor or weapon (or good trans), equipped on my heroes. Because I know, I will be harassed for having decent gear.
I was playing with a friend recently on a random map, and suddenly (out of nowhere) I was kicked. Over steam, my friend told me, that the host said "Lol, obvious hacker" after the kick. Thanks for ruining my playtime with a friend, I said to myself. Similar events have forced me into hosting games. Most of my gear is found by myself, so I can almost guarantee that it isn't hacked, but this is where it gets cruel. What if one of the pieces I've brought was hacked? What is I misjudged some gear, and I was suddenly banned from a game that I enjoy? Do I really want to risk that?



This kind of **** drives me crazy. Do you have any sources on this information? Do you really know that all good items necessarily have negatives (or else they are hacked)? Yes, if every stat is in the 500 range, then it's obviously hacked. Thank you Einstein. But if it have negatives, it's suddenly in doubt. That is not a good rule for identifying hacked gear. What if something is on the edge, a really good item with some negatives? I don't want such rules to dominate this game.

We have created a culture of fear and doubt. Let's remove the paranoia.


too bad. i know thats not the reply you wanted. trendy isn't willing to discuss them, so we must speculate. also..
your join date: Join Date Apr 2012
this makes it very hard for me to believe you know anything about gear at all.

i dont really post that often anymore because of people like you pulling stunts like this. what i said is true. this isn't a debate; its the truth. i have never seen an item in months with no negatives and at least 3 of four very, very high stats be legitimate, not since they changed things months ago. If you have proof, please provide a video with the item falling on the ground, and show you joining the match ON CLOSED, what map, what wave, etc, all on camera. this is the only way you can disprove what im' saying is wrong. i've seen thousands of items and i know what legit looks like. this is not debatable without proof. even then it could still be in doubt to some people. hope you have a big hard drive to make that video, because a clip wont do it for me; it must be a full video starting with you logging your character on closed, making the game, playing it to its full conclusion, in full view of the camera for me to even consider it to be legit. otherwise i will consider what you said above to be trolling.

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too bad. i know thats not the reply you wanted. trendy isn't willing to discuss them, so we must speculate. also..
your join date: Join Date Apr 2012
this makes it very hard for me to believe you know anything about gear at all.


Oh please, Iv'e been playing the game since it came out, and joined the forums April. Join date means nothing.

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if it has more than three or four 400-500 stats, and there are no negatives, its hacked. no matter the amount of ups it has.

Yeah. That's what I used to think. Then I got a seahorse which has 4*420 and no negs.
It has 3 crappy stats (<100), but no negs. Sadly, it was move, cast rate, tower range and tower health. Yay.
Also have a supreme chestpiece with no negs and 3 very high stats.

While these items are rare, sadly, they do exist.

So, i'd revise your comments to say "no bad stats" rather than "no negatives".


but this sucks because i have several pieces of supreme gear with 400's and 500's on them. i am afriad to open a match to the general noob public because they just dont know the specs of legit gear... so... trendy... can we please get a response on this?

Agreed. I don't actually care who calls me a hacker or reports me, because I know my gear is fine. But I've had people quitting the game I join because they don't want to play with a hacker. When I'm ruining other people's enjoyment just because I join a game with high end gear, something has gone wrong.

[quote]i'm tired of having to hide my games because i have over 2k on a stat. i've been accused of hacking myself, but tyipcally i play with players with more 'situational awareness' than those of a tree shrub. even so, the fact remains we are not being told what the highest legitimate stats can look like, and we're to this is to to prevent hacking? i hope this isn't the case.[/quote]
Around 3600 for a non barb/EV and 4100 for a barb/ev.
Exact upper limits aren't final, because a full set of upped accessories could (in a totally perfect world) boost a single stat by 150 or so.

Based on the equipment I've seen drop, I'd expect to be able to get max values on 2 stats, with 2 more trailing 500-600 behind. So a tower builder, with totally maxed-out top-end gear would be looking at 3000/3600/3000/3600. Ish.
An EV booster might have 3100/4100/3100/4100

As a comparison, I've got a an app in a supreme/trans/myth mishmash who has 1200/3200/2000/2800

But the whole discussion is kinda pointless. You can complete any map (including survival) on this game with 2000 stats, a friend, and a strong build. With my 3200 stats, the only thing that can fail any map for me is when you miss a goldfish in mix due to the fireball visual hell.


Finally, looking at how statcaps have progressed, I suspect the next set will be capped at 600. Just to make things even worse. (delta has so far been 60 then 80. 100 is next logical step). Which means around 4700 max stat for a norm, and 5300 for barb/ev.

So, unless they are preparing to make late-wave sky city survival bat**** loco hard, I don't see what these stats will do apart from make the game boring as hell.

Edit. Sold the seahorse, but here's something I found earlier today. Hacked or not? (answer: not)

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too bad. i know thats not the reply you wanted. trendy isn't willing to discuss them, so we must speculate. also..
your join date: Join Date Apr 2012
this makes it very hard for me to believe you know anything about gear at all.

i dont really post that often anymore because of people like you pulling stunts like this. what i said is true. this isn't a debate; its the truth. i have never seen an item in months with no negatives and at least 3 of four very, very high stats be legitimate, not since they changed things months ago. If you have proof, please provide a video with the item falling on the ground, and show you joining the match ON CLOSED, what map, what wave, etc, all on camera. this is the only way you can disprove what im' saying is wrong. i've seen thousands of items and i know what legit looks like. this is not debatable without proof. even then it could still be in doubt to some people. hope you have a big hard drive to make that video, because a clip wont do it for me; it must be a full video starting with you logging your character on closed, making the game, playing it to its full conclusion, in full view of the camera for me to even consider it to be legit. otherwise i will consider what you said above to be trolling.


This is the most idiotic post I've seen in months. I'm really sorry, but it is. Firstly you start out with "you joined the forum for a month ago, you must know nothing about gear". I could also say, "you only have 60-70 posts, you must know absolutely nothing about this game. That have NOTHING to do with my point, and it's not a valid argument, given the fact that you can join the forum a long time after starting to play the game.

Secondly, I don't have to disprove, WHAT YOU ARE SAYING, you are the one that should prove what you are saying. When you make a claim about the "truth", then you better live up to it. I can say that there is an unicorn outside my door, and you would never be able to disprove it! What I stated in my first post is that in order to decide whatever or not an item is hacked you will have to know what the maximum stats in an item is. You can't just say "Oh, it has a negative stat, it must be legit", or "Oh, it got no negatives and good stats, it must be hacked!". You are the one saying this isn't a debate, it's the truth. Who is it that is pulling the stunts here?

If you consider what I just said to be trolling, then try and actually debate and think, instead of trying to insult your opponent.

EDIT: I should mention, that "zingfharn" have already made a post explaining the stats in more depth. It's not in favor of your "truth".

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If Trendy would make the absolute low/high limits on spawn stats public, specific to quality level and such, it would be easy to tell if an item in a store falls outside those parameters. It would also be a joy for determining what perfect drops are, as it would now be plain as day. At first thought, you'd wonder why in the world they don't do this. But remember, if those stats were public, hackers would simply make hacked items that fall just at the extreme ends of those technically-possible stats. So they'd be helping both the good and bad; an absolute double-edged sword. I'm not sure if there's a solution as it stands, unless they found a way for the game itself to auto-detect item manipulation (and then as a result, delete the item as soon as it appears in ranked, as mentioned above.) But if they could, well, you'd figure they would have by now. -_-

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This is the most idiotic post I've seen in months. I'm really sorry, but it is. Firstly you start out with "you joined the forum for a month ago, you must know nothing about gear". I could also say, "you only have 60-70 posts, you must know absolutely nothing about this game. That have NOTHING to do with my point, and it's not a valid argument, given the fact that you can join the forum a long time after starting to play the game.

Secondly, I don't have to disprove, WHAT YOU ARE SAYING, you are the one that should prove what you are saying. When you make a claim about the "truth", then you better live up to it. I can say that there is an unicorn outside my door, and you would never be able to disprove it! What I stated in my first post is that in order to decide whatever or not an item is hacked you will have to know what the maximum stats in an item is. You can't just say "Oh, it has a negative stat, it must be legit", or "Oh, it got no negatives and good stats, it must be hacked!". You are the one saying this isn't a debate, it's the truth. Who is it that is pulling the stunts here?

If you consider what I just said to be trolling, then try and actually debate and think, instead of trying to insult your opponent.

EDIT: I should mention, that "zingfharn" have already made a post explaining the stats in more depth. It's not in favor of your "truth".


While a bit harsh, Lyper makes a strong argument and a valid point about the philosophy behind it.

Once again, simply labeling an item as hacked if it has stats X or is above stats Y is naive at best. This solution will only lead to countless false-accusations and will misinform the DD population by stating false limits of random drops.

We need SOMETHING from Trendy at this point. At the very least they could answer the item checks we submit rather than simply ignoring them; while impractical, this would be a start. The end-gamers are getting tired of it and are dwindling. Urza is an example of this, along with several other prominent and well-known players that I have had personal conversations with. You can add me to that list of frustration as well.

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