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When are apprentices gonna get the buff they deserve?


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How is it that Devs allow the squire to be stronger in every single category, while the apprentice, who most believe SHOULD have the best towers, are left in the dust?

Squires make good DPS, and have the best twr setup by far.

The App has towers that dont penetrate, the App's HP on their walls and towers is absolutely laughable, and theird DPS is completely dwarfed by a squires.

I have a 78 app with 2.1k twr dmg, and need to build with my squire who has 900 twr dmg because he's BETTER.

How is this even possible?

Oh, and thanks for the mana bomb buff.... *sigh*

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Swap the gears^^


That really isn't the point Im trying to make. We shouldn't be forced to play squires to have any shot of doing well in high end game.

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To be honest, apprentice towers don't NEED a ton of health. They're not meant to take extra punishment. Squire walls are for that. Fireball is AoE, and lightning technically 'penetrates'. You're just doing it wrong, apparently. Combine a strength drain aura with spike or bouncer blockades and a lightning or fireball tower. That should do the trick.

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As the poster above pointed out, you should be combining your towers more often. I find that a fireball and a harpoon clear lanes much more effectively compared to 2 harpoons or 2 fireballs. And that while my squire's gear is well above 2k stats on everything, while my app is just above 1k.

Also, complaints about walls should probably be pointed towards EV's at the moment. They pretty much beat both squires and app's hands down. Heh, I actually use app walls more than squire walls now. You know, for spider distraction.

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Back to squire one demonstrating the unviability of Apps if you start suggesting squire towers.

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Back to squire one demonstrating the unviability of Apps if you start suggesting squire towers.


WRONG. 100% WRONG. This game is NOT about solo builds. It's about teamwork. There's a tooltip ingame that clearly states that it's better to combine different class towers for the best builds. Apprentice is not meant to solo. Sure, you can try. But it's not meant to have massive HP with the walls. If you think that using one class for the entire build is good, then you're doing it wrong. It takes high stats to solo-build with squire. And by then, that's not skill. That's cheap tactics. IT takes more skill making a working multi-class setup. Monk auras. Apprentice towers. Huntress traps. Squire walls. EV buff beams/proton beams. Put them all together(With at least somewhat good stats) and you've got a good setup if you did it right. Obviously, kreyson, you take squire too much for granted. No class is meant to do it alone. You need multiple classes to do it right.

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WRONG. 100% WRONG. This game is NOT about solo builds. It's about teamwork. There's a tooltip ingame that clearly states that it's better to combine different class towers for the best builds. Apprentice is not meant to solo. Sure, you can try. But it's not meant to have massive HP with the walls. If you think that using one class for the entire build is good, then you're doing it wrong. It takes high stats to solo-build with squire. And by then, that's not skill. That's cheap tactics. IT takes more skill making a working multi-class setup. Monk auras. Apprentice towers. Huntress traps. Squire walls. EV buff beams/proton beams. Put them all together(With at least somewhat good stats) and you've got a good setup if you did it right. Obviously, kreyson, you take squire too much for granted. No class is meant to do it alone. You need multiple classes to do it right.


Well... what ever makes you happy. If you enjoy the "Requirement" of leveling and gearing up SIX heroes.

Go for it, all the more power to you.

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Well... what ever makes you happy. If you enjoy the "Requirement" of leveling and gearing up SIX heroes.

Go for it, all the more power to you.


It doesn't have to be your own heroes. This game is a multiplayer game, have someone help you. I have six heroes, yes, but it's not that hard to level them. I already have all of them at least at level 60+, most of them at 70 by now. The lowest one is apprentice because I've been focusing on the other ones. Sure, takes longer to gear them up, but I intend on selling my eggs and getting some myths anyway.

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I find App Fireballs and lightning towers, combined with monk auras, and EV/Squire walls to be really good. Sometimes an harpoon to take on air if my MM do not do it satisfactory.

The recent change to lightning tower was a nice one.

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It doesn't have to be your own heroes. This game is a multiplayer game, have someone help you.


I believe the phrase the Young People use is 'This'.

The game is designed to to reward the use of multiple hero traps and abilites whether your own those of friends. To me it is a big part of the fun of the game.

I don't think you need a lot of extra classes, nor do they need the levels or gear of your main so it isn't such a big grind.

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It doesn't have to be your own heroes. This game is a multiplayer game, have someone help you. I have six heroes, yes, but it's not that hard to level them. I already have all of them at least at level 60+, most of them at 70 by now. The lowest one is apprentice because I've been focusing on the other ones. Sure, takes longer to gear them up, but I intend on selling my eggs and getting some myths anyway.


This game changes dramatically once you start doing Nightmare. Someone who plays level 60-70 characters is not able to add anything constructive or relevant at all to these discussions.

The point of threads like this are that the squires towers penetrate, have more health and do more damage than apprentice's, and whether or not that is balanced fairly so people can play the class they enjoy vs the class that is much stronger.

Everyone knows its a multiplayer game, that doesn't negate the argument that the "builder" specs that fill the same role should be somewhat equal in strength. (Nor does it negate the argument that solo play should be viable).

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Ballance is fine till nightmare mode, where..... Harpoons/Buff beams/EV Walls/Gas trap and somtimes Prox/Darkness become all you can realistically use on a Serious 20+ build.

2 harpoons in a buff beam (facing each other to stop spiders), with an EV wall and a Gas trap is almost impossible to beat for 15-18 DU

The gas trap stops anything apart from ogres and the odd immune mob that gets jammed up anyways, the EV wall has the most HP/du, and the harpoons kill Ogres, Djinn and Sharken faster than anything else, these are usually the only mobs that will wipe you since 4/5 of the trash mobs are totally CC'ed

find me any other tower combo that can deliver a 1.4 million Piercing dps facing forwards, 700k dps everywhere else, cover spiders, have 72 range, Hits Air, Perma CC's 4/5 of the mobs in game, has a 233k hp wall(or down to 100k for 1-3 less du)

Nothing else can really handle 30x trash mobs, 5x 20 mill hp "fire immune" ogres and 4x Djinn at the same time.

Technically Nightmare is still in beta Phase and not out yet so....

App towers suck because they have yet to be Ballanced in Nightmare, the Harpoon is fine in Insane.
Imo App towers in NM need; 50% boost to Fireball and Magic missile, Stun/500% boost to Deadly Striker, Mage Magic blockades Immune to Sharken charge bringing them back into use, and drop 2 du off lightning tower cost.

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If you can't beat em, join em. Apprentice has yielded his gear to my squire and will mostly be shelved until App becomes flavor of the month.


Technically Nightmare is still in beta Phase and not out yet so....

They seem to be making it harder too, who knows what wickedness will come with the last shard.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Man my app only has 900 tower health and 1400 tower attack and I get along just fine. From time to time I'll throw up some auras (only 800 stat on my aura monk) but I've never felt this mythical *requirement* to use a squire.

I dunno, perhaps clearing mistymire isn't hard or something, but I've always felt proud of being able to do it.

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Well actually I play as a level 40 apprentice and he's REALLY good, the overcharge buff is really good for quickly repairing towers and defenses and even building them, also the apprentice has pretty strong ranged towers while the squire doesn't have the same, Iv'e played as both, the apprentice is good for ranged attacking enemies and taking out big targets from distances whilst the squire's towers are good in area denial like when me and my friends place slice-n'-dice towers in most paths so enemies can't pass through to the crystal whilst the apprentice ranged towers takes them out from distances, they are balanced in my opinion.

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The real joy of this game is that it is possible to find many ways to play. You can use a mix of defenses or you can go heavy on just one type.

For some maps it is really hard to use just one type of tower, on other maps its ridiculously easy.

I'm having no real troubles with my apprentice tower build. I can solo many maps on NM and NM HC, and every few runs through such maps I find a piece of useful gear. When I run into difficulties I re-evaluate my approach. With so many options available, it's silly to repeat something over and over again for the same results.

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  • 3 weeks later...
Yes the game is meant to be played with all heroes. That doesn't change the fact that the mage in every statistic possible is a worse tower builder that makes no sense at all especially given the fact that the mage is almost purely elemental so things can be immune. Where as the squire is all physical and in every statistic possible stronger. That simply makes the mage useless and he is weather or not you think he is. You deal a lot more damage to a lot more mobs with 2 harpoons then 1 fireball and 1 harpoon.

Why is the mage even in the game?

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I have a question to all people who think Apprentice is underpowered, what map would *You* Like to see be done with just Apprentice towers?

The Map would be done on NMHC Maybe even MM Survival if suggested.

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I have a question to all people who think Apprentice is underpowered, what map would *You* Like to see be done with just Apprentice towers?

The Map would be done on NMHC Maybe even MM Survival if suggested.


I completed through endless spires with just magic missles (and only 1600 tower attack) before so it isn't near as hard as you'd think. I didn't even need a slow aura until around ramparts.

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  • 2 weeks later...
The Apprentice class is extremely powerful. The MMs deal beefy damage for the DU cost, and the Fireballs do a lot more. Not to mention, even with a tower build, if you have a decent wand, you can already achieve a damage output comparable to a DPS Squire or Huntress.

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  • 1 month later...
I hope apprentice gets a buff, cause they are so stupid underpowered compared to squire who outclass them in everything.

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no they don't, squires deal more dps than fireball towers. I've seen it.... even if the App has more tower damage

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