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Reichert

Do you agree with the 60% damage reduction to harpoons?

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Enough said?

I don't know exactly what you want to say with that picture.. Early access can be understood in 2 different ways.. If you preorder Guild Wars 2, you will have early access to that game for 3 days, before anyone else.. I see the same meaning with this.. They added the early access to nightmare to be ensured money from all 4 parts, instead of maybe only getting money from part 1 and people deciding that it was terrible.. Early access does not mean that its beta - it just means that you get access to it before the public.. Which is why I think the whole "Nightmare is still in beta so qq more" attitude is completely idiotic.

This bundle also includes early access to Nightmare Mode for all original and upcoming missions


It does not say the word BETA anywhere. I don't care if Trendy consider it beta, they didn't state that anywhere in the agreements or the package info when you buy the game. So the fact is, they are screwing up the game we paid for, because they dont have any idea of how to balance a game.

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Regardless of your opinion on the specific wording in whatever agreement you think was made or not made NM was not even close to balanced before. Think of it this way. You designed a game with 4 character classes. Through the course of some changes you made you overlooked something and one character class became so good that the others were literally made useless in the high end game. What do you do? You plan out the changes to bring it all back in line.

In this case step 1 is bringing down the crazy high numbers on the squire. Step 2 is likely some changes to fix the instant deaths in survival so the players can contribute more player DPS to the equation. Step 2 is very likely quite difficult. Thankfully we have a full dev team working on this and not a single person so they can split the load and work on other smaller fixes (see Upcoming Patch Notes thread) while the bigger changes are worked on.

All in all, adapt and overcome, grow up and learn to deal with not getting your way all the time.

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Regardless of your opinion on the specific wording in whatever agreement you think was made or not made NM was not even close to balanced before. Think of it this way. You designed a game with 4 character classes. Through the course of some changes you made you overlooked something and one character class became so good that the others were literally made useless in the high end game. What do you do? You plan out the changes to bring it all back in line.

In this case step 1 is bringing down the crazy high numbers on the squire. Step 2 is likely some changes to fix the instant deaths in survival so the players can contribute more player DPS to the equation. Step 2 is very likely quite difficult. Thankfully we have a full dev team working on this and not a single person so they can split the load and work on other smaller fixes (see Upcoming Patch Notes thread) while the bigger changes are worked on.

All in all, adapt and overcome, grow up and learn to deal with not getting your way all the time.


I never said it was balanced before.. But it sure as hell is not balanced now. This game has once again taken a step back and have made the game playable if you already got crazy gear, but if you are just getting into nightmare or are trying to progress from what little you had previously achieved, you just wont be able to.. I can't do the same maps that I could do before this change.. And i already got the gear from those maps, so now I can't progress on my own. I will need to go into a shop to buy my gear. Where's the fun in that? I like progressing but Trendy is making that near impossible with the way they change things.. You dont balance things by throwing around 50 or 60 percent changed to things. It only shows one thing, and that's that they got no idea of how to balance a game.

The last sentence is just ridiculous. I dont mind not getting my way. But if I PAY for things, then I can atleast expect the game to be working and not to **** me over constantly. But that is not what you have received by Trendy in the past month.

The squire was not overpowered before this change. It might've been in comparison to the other classes, but when you looked at the difficulty of the maps, I dont feel it was. I dont know how it was in the wave 30 survival, but when you were just trying to progress into NM, it certainly wasn't overpowered. You could just barely do a wave or 2 in Endless spire. You got 1 or 2 pieces of gear, and you got a little closer. The progress was slow, as it should be, but there was progress. Now everyone he is not decked out in top notch gear, has been set back a lot, and might not even be able to progress on their own anymore. Now the game will consist of farming mana, so you can buy one overpriced item in a shop, farm even more mana to upgrade it, and then do it with another item. Then in about 1 month, you will be back to where you were, 2 days ago. Call that balancing if you want to, we both know it isn't.

A better way to fix the squire being better than the others would be to buff the other classes. They wouldn't have to change every variable concerning the mobs, and the other classes would become viable again. They decided that they didn't want to do that, cause if the other classes did enough damage, they wouldn't sell any Series EV DLC's.. Now people are practically forced to buy it, if they want to progress anywhere.

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Not going to let this thread disappear, everybody still needs a damage buff in nightmare.

Add more waves or something rather than decreasing the waves people can get to.

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I didn't say adapt or die at all, I said 'would' be ****ed until they get their balance finalized if they hadn't released the ev. Now is a perfect time to remove a 'bug' that buffed the only class used to build and entice people to buy a class that buffs towers. I merely mentioned early access as a point that should always be considered with nightmare. That does not justify the crazy nerf removing the bug creates - that's justified by ev booster beams. In the time it takes them to come up with a workable balance, the hardcore and moderates will get by with ev beams and the casuals will stay where they were, IF there are any casuals left from moraggo's release still playing nightmare. Just check the pc guides section, people found a build with ev boosters that got you to wave 20 misty with like 1k in everything. You got a new tool, you had a week, maybe two to mess around with it casually, now you got to use it for real. And don't talk about it costing 4$ - you probably got it and barbarian for 3 each, after getting dundef on sale for 7$ or less, genderswap for 5$, and shards for at most 15$. 33$ for a game you can easily put 2-300 hours into is awesome.


The problem with that logic is, you shouldn't have to buy EV just to be able to beat the levels now. And please stop making assumptions about what was and wasn't bought, some might've bought the original game and didn't have or want to buy the characters but still wanted new maps. But now it is impossible for those people to progress any farther because they didn't want to buy some character that didn't appeal to them, so what are those people going to do? Most likely they'll get bored and quit playing the game b/c they aren't a fan of microtransactions.

10 pages is too much to read, I made it through the first 2 pages and the last page so sorry if someone has mentioned some of this already. Fact is harpoon towers IMO are way too good, they can grind through tons of enemies, and since they provide generic damage it means that a squire is all you need to succeed. IMO that shouldn't be the case. This nerf was necessary. what I would like to see is Nightmare require at least 2 different tower sets when you have more people in the game. So a squire should still be able to do solo runs (an app should be able to as well), but in games with 2-3 more players, they should have to contribute to the DU as well. In my opinion there is a simple fix to this, add monsters in nightmare that have something like a 60% resistance to generic damage. These mobs will only spawn with, say 2 or more players in a single game. This way multiple squires in a game can still use their primary weapons to fend off mobs that there towers start to get overwhelmed with. OR, a well coordinated team could keep their towers repaired through the onslaught of the increased immunity. This change would instantly bring usefulness to the app towers while not ruling out the Squire towers altogether. I thought it was really boring with Squire as the end all be all ultimate class of the game, this nerf is a step in the right direction. It also means that the EV buff beam will start to become more popular, so keep that in mind.


But you shouldn't have to buy the EV that isn't included in the QFTLES package to be able to compete in nightmare mode, you shouldn't need to buy a dlc just to complete a dlc that you already paid in full for(Nightmare Mode).

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Well fine, if you don't want to buy EV, then don't. Just make friends who have the EV and play with them.

There, simple as that.

If you wanna solo but still don't wanna buy EV, then either adapt, or give in and buy it.

Simple as that.

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"Just check the pc guides section, people found a build with ev boosters that got you to wave 20 misty with like 1k in everything."

Yeh great, thanks. GETTING to 1k in everything now is the problem for alot of players.

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Right now, you have a small subset of uber-geared players who acquired much of their needed gear before any of the nerfs, and you have the rest of the community who most likely cannot progress without buying gear from these players, or at least get carried through by these players.


I'm calling BS on this. Apprentice is pretty close to as powerful now as it was when it was the dominant builder. People were clearing survival and killing the Spider Queen long before Squires got attached to their unintended extra damage. All that's really changed is nightmare becoming easier (more HP for players, less damage for DEWs, less ogres in survival, etc.) and the addition of djinn.

The problem is that if a bug goes on long enough it becomes the normal so anything done with it is a nerf even if it is just a fix. Squires became used to the damage they did and rightfully so because they did that damage for so long but everyone knew something was gonna happen. Instead of taking the buffing path for app they chose the other far more dangerous path of nerf squire and nerf monsters and hope that all balances it out. This all is still in BETA you know. We are the beta testers. There just might be less of us now.


Let's pretend you accidentally received double the pay you were supposed to get from work for the last 2 months due to an accounting error. Let's say your boss is really cool about it and lets you keep the extra money, but they've fixed the accounting error and it won't be happening anymore. Would going back to a normal paycheck amount be a pay cut or simply a bug fix? It was there for 2 months, that's long enough for you to consider it normal, right?

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I'm calling BS on this. Apprentice is pretty close to as powerful now as it was when it was the dominant builder. People were clearing survival and killing the Spider Queen long before Squires got attached to their unintended extra damage. All that's really changed is nightmare becoming easier (more HP for players, less damage for DEWs, less ogres in survival, etc.) and the addition of djinn.


When App was the dominate builder wasn't there no cap on ensnare aura right? Back then you could get ensnare down to 2% with an app guardian buffing it.

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One minor difference between App now and App then: Fireball dps was not restored. Sure they buffed lightning and magic missile, but 90% of the towers were fireball. So they don't scale well into endgame and it happens to be the only tower that deals damage to masses of monsters reliably at a reasonable amount of DU.

In the end I'm sure the nerf was justified, but not without a bunch of other balances(they've done *some*). Because right now you are required to own EV or play with someone who owns EV in order to beat maps. Which is total bull.

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One minor difference between App now and App then: Fireball dps was not restored. Sure they buffed lightning and magic missile, but 90% of the towers were fireball. So they don't scale well into endgame and it happens to be the only tower that deals damage to masses of monsters reliably at a reasonable amount of DU.

In the end I'm sure the nerf was justified, but not without a bunch of other balances(they've done *some*). Because right now you are required to own EV or play with someone who owns EV in order to beat maps. Which is total bull.


EV helps immensely while soloing and helps a lot overall, but I wouldn't really call it required when playing with 2 or more people. Dual guardian buff is still way more DPS on your turrets than a buff beam, and you can still use a tower HP squire to build barricades.

A 3 star buff beam with decent stats is around
2.25 dmg * 1.75 spd = 3.9375x DPS per tower

Dual Guardians is about
2.75 dmg * 2.75 spd = 7.5625x DPS per tower

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STOP NERFING. Jeez. For once, just try buffs. It's like Guess and Check with these patches.


ITs not only them. It's a basic game design action.
"The Nail that sticks up will be hammered down."
You don't stick up ALL OTHER NAILS.

The issue with buffing all other towers to squire level is that Nightmare becomes much more of a joke, and then they'd end up buffing the health of monsters on nightmare to compensate...Keeping numbers down is GOOD.

Difference between "I need to do everything i can to make Nightmare easier for myself" and "Trendy, make Nightmare easier for me"

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"Just check the pc guides section, people found a build with ev boosters that got you to wave 20 misty with like 1k in everything."

Yeh great, thanks. GETTING to 1k in everything now is the problem for alot of players.


Not really. Since the change I was still able to get to wave 13 in UMF with Stats no higher then 650 on my squire (was something like 580/630/400/300). I was clearing it before with those stats with minutes remaining but still gear drops there should get you to 1k mark. I was doing OMF with under 1k stats as well (and I suspect with a good build you can still clear many of the waves which have good ups). I had to rework my strat some on both maps. I don't have the godly 2k stats other have and I'm progressing just fine (abit a little bit slower now).

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