People importing characters to open and modding there - Beware

About 2-3 months ago I began playing on trendynet servers after playing on open since the games' retail release.

I have modded mana, characters stats on open, but never on the actual servers, recently I transferred my trendynet characters to open and began testing items out etc...

I received a VAC ban and was curious as to why this was placed on my account, I requested a non-copy and paste response and this is what the response was.

"Hello *****,

Lan mode does not use VAC however Open is VAC secured.

I understand your frustration in this matter; however, our system has confirmed that the ban was applied legitimately. A VAC ban applies to the game(s) regardless of who was using the account at the time.

It does not matter if you let someone use the account, or if the account was being used without your knowledge. It is your responsibility to safeguard your account against such activities.

I am sorry, the VAC ban on the game(s) will not be removed.

Before continuing to use Steam and Steam games on your computer, please remove all cheats from your system. Failure to do so may result in further VAC bans on the account.

Please refer to the Steam Subscriber Agreement and the Rules of Steam Online Conduct if you wish to review our policy regarding this matter."



I want to state I never said anyone was on my account, thats just part of their copy and paste, the key part of the response is Valve considers when you go to open that it is VAC protected. I honestly had no idea, I thought it was trendy servers only.

I understand I will never be unbanned and ill never be able to even play on open/lan again, but id like to help clarify this for future players and prevent them from being VAC banned.

I hold no grudges to trendy, I want to thank you for a great game(sincerely).

-Sutar

VAC isn't going to discriminate between if you're playing DD on Open or Ranked, if you're using a program that is going to modify the game in any way, VAC is going to catch it. You can use that same program on Ranked, likely. There are guidelines as to what things you can do to your character on Open and I'm pretty sure memory-editing, for example, is one of the no-no's. DD as a whole is VAC-protected, I believe. That means you have to be careful of what programs you're running in the background.

In short, if you got banned, it wasn't because you were modding in Open or because you transferred a Ranked character to Open, it's because you were using a blacklisted program in the background.

Ah, I didnt know there were blacklisted programs. Could you send me in the right direction to this list so I can prevent myself from being banned from other games ive purchased?

Oh I have no idea in terms of an itemized list. A rule of thumb is don't have anything running that can modify game files. Cheat Engine is a pretty generic example that I'm pretty sure it would catch. I don't think VAC likes memory editors. Other than that, I don't know what people use to hack DD.

Why can't people just NOT mod the game? If your interested in programming or changing mechanics, buy a Book about C# and go ahead - even Neural networks are possible here.

Buy a game and play it the way the producer/publisher intended. if they release a modkit, feel free to use it, you wont get banned using it, but if not, ACCEPT IT AND DONT DO IT.

my warning to everone: STOP CHEATING. its 1. not worth it, 2. it destroys your fun (like reading the last site of a book) 3. it could cost ya your account. what is your profit? cheated mana and 1 billion damage weapons you cant use because it makes absolutely no sense to betray a computer opponent?

honestly... well deserved ban.

@BatLB it's actually allowed to "cheat" on open. Quote from devs "Anything goes in open".

@BatLB it's actually allowed to "cheat" on open. Quote from devs "Anything goes in open".

Correct! Here's the quote itself

Hahahahahahahah, well anything goes in Open :D

-Jer

Well when he said that i'd assume he actually meant ANYTHING goes in open not sure what to think of this, though.
btw, cheating on local is kinda fun if you ask me lol

You dont even need to quote the devs on that, the open button has it literaly writen on it. Use your characters in anyting-goes online play or something.

My question would be: open is still online and therefore vac protected, vac cant distingiush between game modes. But what if you pick local play from the start menu? Can you safely mod (or cheat) there?

trendynet tell that you can't cheat in open(you can only use mod they give you).. so it is not a problem of vac.. if you want cheat you can use local, but if you click on open when you have your program running.. ban coming.

Yeah a nice little warning label saying "Do whatever you want* (*as long as you don't acutally do whatever you want and only what we want you to do)" on open would be good, I myself got smacked with a vac ban from playing around in open(bored between patches).

One of the most aggrivating things is, when I realised I was VAC'd I shot of a message to Mr. Community-manager-dude-guy asking if I was mistaken about open being "anything goes". Was actually just after a "sorry but thems the breaks" or a "sorry but turns out valve screwed up". A definite answer one way or another.... not got a peep back though

see i thought Open was LITTERLY open like Diablo 2 Open was... :/ bit strange they have ranked AND open servers then... whats the point in open if not to test mods and gear? i always use ranked anyway so no problems, but... its a bit pointless and considering i and most people i know thought open was for that reason... there needs to be something there saying open is STILL vac secure sorry to hear that man, that blows... :(

see i thought Open was LITTERLY open like Diablo 2 Open was... :/ bit strange they have ranked AND open servers then... whats the point in open if not to test mods and gear? i always use ranked anyway so no problems, but... its a bit pointless and considering i and most people i know thought open was for that reason... there needs to be something there saying open is STILL vac secure sorry to hear that man, that blows... :(

Thanks, yeah I had the same mentality, I thought open was the same as diablo 2, everything would be client side and no interaction with the servers of valve or trendy meaning we had "open" reign on our own content.

Especially after reading posts from the developers such as "everything goes on open".

I wish that this message of "only use these certain mods on open" would be shown so players wouldnt use them and get banned for breaking a rule they werent made aware of.

Unfortunately all online play is VAC secured; There is a difference between modding (playing a map like mad mana or extreme EXP) and using a hack program to get stuff. Only using tools provided for or approved for use with the game is allowed. Essentially this means you can use 1) the DDDK and 2) AHK (which was always allowed, though a misunderstanding caused an issue with it, which has now been addressed)

Trainers and hack programs are NOT mods: they are cheats. Mods are things that are created with the DDDK.

Unfortunately all online play is VAC secured; There is a difference between modding (playing a map like mad mana or extreme EXP) and using a hack program to get stuff. Only using tools provided for or approved for use with the game is allowed. Essentially this means you can use 1) the DDDK and 2) AHK (which was always allowed, though a misunderstanding caused an issue with it, which has now been addressed)

Trainers and hack programs are NOT mods: they are cheats. Mods are things that are created with the DDDK.

Thats fair enough but i didnt accatuley know that, would be a bit easier if there was a disclaimer in open saying that only DDDK creations are allowed because 'open' implies that its "OPEN" other games with the same selection E.G. Diablo 2 (doing this cus i have no other games that have open) you could use ANYTHING you wanted.

I don't think they will do that, because trainers are not mods. "Mods" refers to custom content created for a game, and only that. They shouldn't have to change it to say "..including support for mods, but not cheat trainers!"

The only reason you could cheat on D2 open was because it was not policed- Blizzard still doesn't want people hacking (and they still try to use legal means to shut down trainers and hacks), they just don't devote any time to stopping it. VAC is automatic and thus doesn't require any staff time.

i spose you got a point if its not indorsed by Valve or Trendy then its obviously malicious software that could do harm to your core game, but all im saying is i didnt realise Open was governed by VAC but i spose if you have the license why not use it

I don't think they will do that, because trainers are not mods. "Mods" refers to custom content created for a game, and only that. They shouldn't have to change it to say "..including support for mods, but not cheat trainers!"

The only reason you could cheat on D2 open was because it was not policed- Blizzard still doesn't want people hacking (and they still try to use legal means to shut down trainers and hacks), they just don't devote any time to stopping it. VAC is automatic and thus doesn't require any staff time.

Not to nitpick(seriously trying to help my understanding for future reference), but as far as I knew "Mod" was short for Modification? And wouldnt that mean modification of game data? not specifically to any part of the game...maps, characters, items, etc? You referred to something I would consider one in the same since they function as modifiers to the game.

So saying dddk tool and not any other tools on open would be at least to me a good idea since a lot of people(including myself) did not know it was monitored and also did not know only certain tools were allowed. In fact the developers use the terms "anything goes" in open quite regularly.

Again I am seriously trying to discuss this and want to help make it clear for future players like myself so that they do not get banned for unknowingly breaking a rule that seems to up for interpretation.

[QUOTE]Not to nitpick(seriously trying to help my understanding for future reference), but as far as I knew "Mod" was short for Modification?[/QUOTE]Cheat trainer or Hack != Modification. That's all there is to it. There's no ifs ands or buts about it. You don't need to hack to mod a game. Hacking and modding are NOT the same thing.

For open play, you can generate any kind of equipment you want through the DDDK, you can get all the mana and EXP you from custom maps, there is no reason whatsoever to use any cheat trainer or program hack, period.

Cheat trainer or Hack != Modification. That's all there is to it. There's no ifs ands or buts about it. You don't need to hack to mod a game. Hacking and modding are NOT the same thing.

For open play, you can generate any kind of equipment you want through the DDDK, you can get all the mana and EXP you from custom maps, there is no reason whatsoever to use any cheat trainer or program hack, period.

I'm finding it difficult to understand the difference between that argument and the one about using a keyboard for macros and the AHK program?

VAC isn't going to discriminate between if you're playing DD on Open or Ranked, if you're using a program that is going to modify the game in any way, VAC is going to catch it. You can use that same program on Ranked, likely. There are guidelines as to what things you can do to your character on Open and I'm pretty sure memory-editing, for example, is one of the no-no's. DD as a whole is VAC-protected, I believe. That means you have to be careful of what programs you're running in the background.

In short, if you got banned, it wasn't because you were modding in Open or because you transferred a Ranked character to Open, it's because you were using a blacklisted program in the background.

Please do not describe how to circumvent VAC, even if it only works on open.

No programs should be used to modify DD but the official DDDK. There are many maps that give you free xp/mana/items already made.

<3 Fin

Why can't people just NOT mod the game?

There is a fundamental difference between moding and cheating. Modding in the community usually produces favorable results. A lot of valve's games started out as mods of other games and valve hired the modders. Granted, these were done by people who know the ins and outs of programming and were capable of creating their own games. But the point is, open should be an area for you to explore different things, if it truely is "anything goes" then you should be able use any kind of program, mod or hack.

I'm finding it difficult to understand the difference between that argument and the one about using a keyboard for macros and the AHK program?

The AHK program isn't playing for the player but making attacking easier. If you did that with a keyboard macro it should be okay (can't confirm officially).

Now when you make huge macros to play for you, that is not okay.

The official AHK program only makes shooting easier, not plays for you!

essentially, the smaller programs just send signals that emulate keyboard and mouse presses sent from an external source. They require no information about the game and just preform a series of commands using a small amount of input. an example of this would be if you have a program that makes you strafe left and right as you hold down the forward walk key and you run it in notepad it will just type out wadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwadwad.

On the other hand, larger programs that actually "think" need to gather information from the game itself. If I take an aimbot, for example, it doesn't just fire the gun for you, it actually has to find where the head hit-box is, aim the gun accordingly, and then fire the gun. It's programs like this, that VAC is actively looking for, they're looking for programs that are requesting information from the game that should, under normal circumstances, not be requested.

AHK has been approved because for the most part it's not doing anything you couldn't already do with a gaming keyboard. In that respect, it actually levels the playing field for those who do not want to spend money on a fancy keyboard.

If you're really good with AHK scripts, you can make it do things that aren't really intended, however the primary purpose of it has been auto-fire scripts for apprentice, upgrading without killing your mouse, and "press G for my alts so I don't have to wait for the timer to run out."

Most people aren't misusing it, and if it does cause a problem, Trendy could always (giving appropriate advance notice) decide that they're not going to allow it anymore.

But let's be perfectly clear here: AHK is currently an exception to the rule. Any non-approved program is still subject to getting you in trouble, whether you're on ranked or not.

So , how many of you are going to buy it again with all the DLCs.