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Naed.draagur

DD-Project-01

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Project Name: Project 01

Version: 0.023


Workers:
Finally, Naed.

Purpose:

Team based Hero TD 2v2 with opponent attack possibility. Shops with upgrade items.

Limits:
No towers and no (or very limited) leveling.

Description:

Map info:

2 identical "simple" maps where the part-goal is to defend your crystal from the creeps spawning at the top of the map. Primary goal is to survive longer than the other side or have more lives at the end of the last wave.

The 2vs2 is to be understood as team 1 and 2 are able to attack each other by way of a third-party device/unit. There will not be any pvp element (in the classic sense of it) in it at all.

It will be possible to play either 2 players on one "side" or 4 players against each others in 2vs2.

It will be 1 big map with 2 seperate parts on it.

Estimated length is 30 waves max. Depending on how much the pc version pushes a system with its most intense maps, expect at least a tripling of unit count of that. It is meant to be hectic and everything but relaxing to play.

So users looking for a challenge should feel right at home.

Because of the size and the "pressure" the players will be under. There will be teleports to help you move quicker around the map.

It will NOT play like normal dungeon defenders at all. It will be impossible to solo the map without cheating, NO matter the difficulty. Teamwork is required for the players to survive beyond a couple of waves.

Challenge and award wise, there wont be anything besides actually surviving. We aim to make that reward enough in itself.

Hero info:

The Heroes will not have access to their normal gear or skill levels.

And since you are so busy trying to survive, there will not be hero switching.

Your hero will respawn (if killed) after a set amount of time back at your crystal.

There will most likely be limited leveling, but it will "only" give you access to predefined skills. If you choose to use them or not are your choice, you wont survive without them thou.

Each map replay will see you start at the same lvl. There is NO saving of level between replays. This goes for items too.


Item info:

There wont be any drops at all. You kill to earn mana to keep yourselv supplied from the shops. In keeping with the offical line that there will be un-official map characters where anything goes. It doesnt make sense to drop anything. And you literally wont have time to equip it even if we did.

There will however be shops on the map where you can buy gear suited for the map.

The items you buy on the map will have no use outside of this map.

So they like your level will not be saved between replays.


Misc info:

The players crystal will have a total of 100 "lives", each mob no matter the type will take 1 life away if it reaches the crystal.

There will NOT be an option to start at anything besides wave 0

This is the first map I've started on for this game. There will be others.

This is a modding community made map. So it is not TE approved more than any other future community made map will be. If the map turns out to be popular.. who knows :)





///
Any project that im involved with will have a layout like the first post here. In essence just like a sticky that will get updated as new info becomes relevant/detailed/blackmailed. For all projects the name will be the last thing decided on, mainly because its the funniest part of making a map :)


Constructive INPUT is of course more than welcome, but keep it on topic.

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Work phases:

Phase 1: Map Design and testing
Create map, it has two identical halves (vertically split) shaped sorta like a U. Each half has 2 lanes where monsters spawn(at the top) and move towards the crystal at the bottom. Test first with competent players, release second as a fully playable map for further testing. (Add wyverns attacking from all directions to mix it up - not for official release).

This Phase will be to test the map and make sure there are no game breaking holes in the ground or ways to jump off, etc.

Phase 2:
Add forced custom characters (no clue if possible yet, but I assume it will be), choose from main 4 classes. Add item shop (forges), remove monster drops. Change max mana held to unlimited (or max allowed). Allow custom leveling (change exp charts). Use built in skills for now. Leave 4 character max. (Probably not pub)

Phase 3:

Balancing! New skills (again, if possible), Teleporters added (again if possible) Not Pub

Phase 4:
Pub Release and balancing changes (still 2 player)

Phase 5:
Add PvP elements and add in 4 player pub release

Phase 6:
Balance!

Phase 7:
Add additional content like specialized classes and skills mattering on how much is actually possible =p

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this is sort of like HoN, but better cause its Dungeon Defenders.
i think u should make the creeps not come in waves, but they are random spawn
and if the crystal has "lives" i think the amount of health left over on the creep should determine amount of lives "lost", but also they are killed in the process of hitting it, (example: a monster with 10k health takes off 10 lives, and it rounds down except foe less than 1k) Also, i think the weapons should have an amount of "lives taken" from crystal, but another stat for taking monster and player health. (like 10 crystal lives but 100 player damage)

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i think u should make the creeps not come in waves, but they are random spawn

and if the crystal has "lives" i think the amount of health left over on the creep should determine amount of lives "lost", but also they are killed in the process of hitting it, (example: a monster with 10k health takes off 10 lives, and it rounds down except foe less than 1k) Also, i think the weapons should have an amount of "lives taken" from crystal, but another stat for taking monster and player health. (like 10 crystal lives but 100 player damage)


The waves will be needed for you to have just a sliver of breathing room to restock and try and get your pulse back to normal. So that idea is a no-go.

I would need some confirmation for the second paragraph. it doesnt make sense to me at all. So please explain.

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ok...so a monster starts with 20k health, on insane, it makes it through all ur traps with 5k health left and hit crystal, crystal loves 5 lives but the monster is dead

and the weapons can only kill a certain amount of "lives" on the crystal, but has a seperate stat for the damage they do to the creeps and other players. Like how the monk weapon has both a melee and ranges attack damage, i hope this clears things up =)

Edit: the crystal damage is amazingly lower than the regular damage, it could vary considering the weapon, but also the heros could be so weak so the traps and other heroes could kill them fast, or they could be same as the creeps where they have to spawn at their crystal instead of dieing.

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ok...so a monster starts with 20k health, on insane, it makes it through all ur traps with 5k health left and hit crystal, crystal loves 5 lives but the monster is dead

and the weapons can only kill a certain amount of "lives" on the crystal, but has a seperate stat for the damage they do to the creeps and other players. Like how the monk weapon has both a melee and ranges attack damage, i hope this clears things up =)


First part: Not relevant. The "old" difficulties will not be comparable to what we are aiming for.

Second part: There will be too many mobs for that. Said another way, if we do it like youre suggesting. We would have to give the crystal at least 500 "lives"

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Few questions to ask:

Suggestions now:

Unluckily, i cant give more suggestions until i think of some or get some answers :-)
P.S. on irc u said i can help... How?

Edit: took off answered things in irc, will post an irc log later :-)

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Few questions with minor details...



All of the above will be answered in rev: 0.01 of the OP.

Anyone can help at this stage, comment all you like. we will try to explain the concept better.

We have an idea, but we need input to better explain it. So comment! :)

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Hey, love the idea! It sounds nearly identical to Hero Line Wars - a custom game from Warcraft 3. I'll list out how Hero Line Wars works for you, not in the hopes that you make yours the same, but because you might get intrigued by some of the ideas. (Skip below if you're familiar with HLW)

Similar setup, 2 teams face each other in completely separate lanes. The difference is that each team buys monsters to send at the opposing team. Each player, individually, has a building to purchase monsters at - they also earn interest every ~30sec or so based on how much they've spent on monsters (players get money from killing monsters too, of course). There are shops that let you buy equipment, skill-points, potions, and even levels for a high price. It's really important to allocate enough money into upgrades while at the same time sending monsters down your enemy path to increase your interest. There's no time limit, eventually one team or another is overwhelmed by the opposing team's monsters - the team with a higher cumulative interest usually wins, so it was important to send monsters all the time - hot-keying the creature building.

There are videos online of game-play if any of it sounds interesting. Again, not saying you should just copy them, but you were looking for input and ideas and this came to mind after reading your posts. Anyway, looks fun!

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Hey, love the idea! It sounds nearly identical to Hero Line Wars - a custom game from Warcraft 3. I'll list out how Hero Line Wars works for you, not in the hopes that you make yours the same, but because you might get intrigued by some of the ideas. (Skip below if you're familiar with HLW)

Similar setup, 2 teams face each other in completely separate lanes. The difference is that each team buys monsters to send at the opposing team. Each player, individually, has a building to purchase monsters at - they also earn interest every ~30sec or so based on how much they've spent on monsters (players get money from killing monsters too, of course). There are shops that let you buy equipment, skill-points, potions, and even levels for a high price. It's really important to allocate enough money into upgrades while at the same time sending monsters down your enemy path to increase your interest. There's no time limit, eventually one team or another is overwhelmed by the opposing team's monsters - the team with a higher cumulative interest usually wins, so it was important to send monsters all the time - hot-keying the creature building.

There are videos online of game-play if any of it sounds interesting. Again, not saying you should just copy them, but you were looking for input and ideas and this came to mind after reading your posts. Anyway, looks fun!


I've played it but enfos is better imo.

Enfos usually has more characters and the buying monsters could be a cool "mode" later on.

Gotta figure out things for a first go tho first >=]

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Hey, love the idea!
The difference is that each team buys monsters to send at the opposing team. Each player, individually, has a building to purchase monsters at - they also earn interest every ~30sec or so based on how much they've spent on monsters (players get money from killing monsters too, of course).

There are videos online of game-play if any of it sounds interesting. Again, not saying you should just copy them, but you were looking for input and ideas and this came to mind after reading your posts. Anyway, looks fun!


Thank you :)

In regards to HLW compared to Enfo (which this is based on), is that the "balance" in most HLW is horrendous :( also for most enfo projects that have tried the HLW way of doing it, balance goes out the window faster than fast :/

This doesnt mean that it wouldnt be a viable option to add in, but it means that i personally would be very cautious about even trying to balance it. :)

And as Finally said, there are other things to get done first :)

Thank you for your input and keep it coming :)

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For Ned, this is how I see us playing with the map...

Phases

Phase 1: Map Design and testing
Create map, it has two identical halves (vertically split) shaped sorta like a U. Each half has 2 lanes where monsters spawn(at the top) and move towards the crystal at the bottom. Test first with competent players, release second as a fully playable map for further testing. (Add wyverns attacking from all directions to mix it up - not for official release).

This Phase will be to test the map and make sure there are no game breaking holes in the ground or ways to jump off, etc.

Phase 2:
Add forced custom characters (no clue if possible yet, but I assume it will be), choose from main 4 classes. Add item shop (forges), remove monster drops. Change max mana held to unlimited (or max allowed). Allow custom leveling (change exp charts). Use built in skills for now. Leave 4 character max. (Probably not pub)

Phase 3: Balancing! New skills (again, if possible), Teleporters added (again if possible) Not Pub

Phase 4: Pub Release and balancing changes (still 2 player)

Phase 5: Add PvP elements and add in 4 player pub release

Phase 6: Balance!

Phase 7: Add additional content like specialized classes and skills mattering on how much is actually possible =p



Note about Enfos:

Each wave is different and more powerful then the last... there are some where the units move really fast but are easy to kill, or others where the units are normal and normal armor. Some are boss waves, others super def units that are super slow. I imagine having 10 or so unique waves and then repeating them with each set getting stronger. Final wave goes on its own over and over until one team slips up and gets owned >=]

Video of EnfoS:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sV_yhzso9kg - I imagine a little faster waves with more monsters

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Dang, that's pretty cool - wish I had seen that game mode while I was playing WC3 =). Balance was a huge problem in HLW, that system (the video linked) looks epic.

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Dang, that's pretty cool - wish I had seen that game mode while I was playing WC3 =). Balance was a huge problem in HLW, that system (the video linked) looks epic.


While fun, I always had to host and most players were too noob to play beyond hard...

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We still plan on making this >=]


Looks good!

One thing I didn't understand from the original description... It said it was 2v2 Hero TD .. but then said "no towers". What does TD stand for if there are no towers?

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here is the first mockup of how the team vs team arena could look like :)


enfos!!!!!!



you have to have those spell binders/bringers... defeats the purpose of the map :D

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Alpha-Testers? xD


if you want to see what the game is gunna end up like go find enfos on warcraft 3 custom maps. that will be the closest you gunna get without actually playing it

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Do you plan on having any custom mobs or mini-bosses?
I am currently working on custom enemy scripts and "smarter" AI. -- You can find this thread somewhere under the DDDK discussions.

As for the no level for heros... I don't think it can be accomplished, however there is a possibility of no equipment.
My current solution to leveling up, is to spawn a custom aura to provide whatever stat bonuses you need, either permanently or temporary. This is easier, since you can always just keep stacking them after each wave, or you could stick with the traditional route of having to invest mana to upgrade it by physically having the player level it up.

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