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gigazelle

Thoughts, impressions, and feedback for EV

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Posted (edited)

Just watched Juicebags video on EV, and I'm really disheartened to see that it is basically a tit-for-tat copy of DD1's EV. No improvements or lessons learned, including the most disappointing part: an immediate shift to a buff beam meta.

It is another direct copy from DD1 without even any attempt at something original. This gives continued evidence that DDA is in fact just a copy of DD1 minus 90% of the content. Instead of CG using their valuable dev time to create unique and original content, they are squandering it to attempt to play catch up with DD1, who is still many years ahead in terms of content. 

I don't want DD1's EV. I don't want a meta centered around a buff beam. Instead, I want an EV that combines the best of both DD1 and DD2, and tosses her own unique flair in the game. 

  • Reflect beam is a great defense, and a staple to her arsenal.
  • Maybe have another go at the weapon manufacturer. Instead of making it a damaging tower, return to its original design of being a pickup-based defense. Crank up the damage of the nukes and let EV shine at burst damage. How satisfying would that be to have a weapon manufacturer build a nuke throughout a wave, and give you the ability to one-shot a couple ogres no sweat?
  • Give us a brand new tower that we've never seen before
  • Give EV her own weapons, otherwise EV will always be at odds with apprentice and huntress at who uses staves/guns better. 

If THIS was the EV that was announced, I would be a lot more excited.

I don't want parity to DD1. I want a new take at a tower defense RPG with DD1 core game mechanics.

Edited by gigazelle
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Posted (edited)

i think if they removed the buff and reflect beam ,the EV will be just like the barbarian and so many other characters , they are there because they are there to be honest.
and i don't think they want get to far from DD1 so the game don't fail like DD2 

Edited by edrose86

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Considering that DD2 has more concurrent players than DD1 and DDA combined, and considering that DD2 has a better review score than DDA, I wouldn't call DD2 a failure. Sure, it didn't reach critical acclaim like DD1 did, but neither has DDA. In fact, I'd submit that DDA's lack of critical acclaim is precisely because it refuses to stray from DD1.

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I definitely agree with all the points (of the original post) here. Especially with giving EV new weapons. The canisters that was introduced in DD2 was a great upgrade and concept as it adds more uniqueness to her. It would've been a good opportunity to explore more cool arm cannons concepts as this incarnation does includes an actual hand on her cannon arm.

This version of EV (visually) does seem like an upgrade, so it's quite peculiar that she retains all of the old tech. 

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, gigazelle said:

Just watched Juicebags video on EV, and I'm really disheartened to see that it is basically a tit-for-tat copy of DD1's EV. No improvements or lessons learned, including the most disappointing part: an immediate shift to a buff beam meta.

It is another direct copy from DD1 without even any attempt at something original. This gives continued evidence that DDA is in fact just a copy of DD1 minus 90% of the content. Instead of CG using their valuable dev time to create unique and original content, they are squandering it to attempt to play catch up with DD1, who is still many years ahead in terms of content. 

I don't want DD1's EV. I don't want a meta centered around a buff beam. Instead, I want an EV that combines the best of both DD1 and DD2, and tosses her own unique flair in the game. 

  • Reflect beam is a great defense, and a staple to her arsenal.
  • Maybe have another go at the weapon manufacturer. Instead of making it a damaging tower, return to its original design of being a pickup-based defense. Crank up the damage of the nukes and let EV shine at burst damage. How satisfying would that be to have a weapon manufacturer build a nuke throughout a wave, and give you the ability to one-shot a couple ogres no sweat?
  • Give us a brand new tower that we've never seen before
  • Give EV her own weapons, otherwise EV will always be at odds with apprentice and huntress at who uses staves/guns better. 

If THIS was the EV that was announced, I would be a lot more excited.

I don't want parity to DD1. I want a new take at a tower defense RPG with DD1 core game mechanics.

I agree with your arguments, but its too soon to be talking about the amount of players and the amount of content in dda. DDA is still in early accsess wich means that the game is not complete. Is simply not done. If you want a finished product you dont buy the game at early accsess, you wait until they remove early accsess and then play.

One of the big differences with dd1 and dda is that dda is server based, this means its much harder to cheat in the game. I think there is no cheaters in dda. If you want to cheat in dd1 you can simply download cheat engine or a program that simply lets you change a players and items stats easally.

dda is a better version than dd1 in so many ways and of course worse in some ways like trading and shops and as of right now, but it will improve in the future. Remember that dd1 is like 9 years old or something and dda is a couple months old.

Edited by Lolstol
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22 minutes ago, Lolstol said:

I agree with your arguments, but its too soon to be talking about the amount of players and the amount of content in dda. DDA is still in early accsess wich means that the game is not complete. Is simply not done. If you want a finished product you dont buy the game at early accsess, you wait until they remove early accsess and then play.

...

dda is a better version than dd1 in so many ways and of course worse in some ways like trading and shops and as of right now, but it will improve in the future. Remember that dd1 is like 9 years old or something and dda is a couple months old.

DDA is not in early access, it has been OFFICIALLY released. 

It might still feel like EA due to the missing content, but it is not. 

 

Regarding the age of DDA vs DD1, sure DDA is younger, but it was meant to be a remake of DD1, the age should not matter.

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1 hour ago, gigazelle said:

Considering that DD2 has more concurrent players than DD1 and DDA combined, and considering that DD2 has a better review score than DDA, I wouldn't call DD2 a failure. Sure, it didn't reach critical acclaim like DD1 did, but neither has DDA. In fact, I'd submit that DDA's lack of critical acclaim is precisely because it refuses to stray from DD1.

DD2 From outside it looks absolutely Great (Style and graphics) the best in the series  for sure
in  reality it's Grind AF ,Microtransactions Game 

it will probably shutdown soon so everyone can play it Offline like orcs must die unchained 

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30 minutes ago, chpoit said:

DDA is not in early access, it has been OFFICIALLY released. 

It might still feel like EA due to the missing content, but it is not. 

 

Regarding the age of DDA vs DD1, sure DDA is younger, but it was meant to be a remake of DD1, the age should not matter.

Then i was was wrong. I really thought it was still EA. 

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DD1 - Released Oct 2011
DDE - Released Jun 2014
DD2 - Released Jun 2017
DDA - Released Feb 2020
DD3 - Released ...

Alright, I'll see you all around June 2023!

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I was hoping they'd have brought more of DD2's positive influences into the game. Sure, DD2 has flaws. Big ones. But it had a lot of cool ideas and improvements, too. The Huntress's Poison Dart Tower (I will forever miss those, and was extremely sad when I learned they didn't make the DDA cut), Weapon Manufacturers (an amazing idea, but balanced in such a way that the original intended weapon was obsolete. If it could be balanced to either use the weapon itself, such as in the form of a manufactured turret that fires it, or to have the weapon be worth picking up, it would be a fun and unique defense that would be super fun to play with), Earthshatter Towers, Sky Guards, and a bunch of other awesome defenses that would have been great mixed in with some of DD1's defenses. Instead, everything seems to just be a carbon copy of their DD1 versions, which just doesn't feel satisfying. Why bring back the same meta that people had already mastered? This was an opportunity for a new meta, a new balance... but alas.

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I would like to see much more new content in general.

We wanted it to go back to it's routes with DD1, but we didn't want another remake, so new characters or new skills would be a really nice thing to have.

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Agree with all of the original post. 

 

Copying DD1's EV is probably the single worst decision made so far.  I would have rather seen a 6 month extension to launch date if it meant we could avoid having buff beams in DDA.  As everyone else says... might as well play DD1 if DDA is going to have the same, stupid, forced meta.  Good-bye creative building freedom...

This is sad.  I was all in favor for giving CG a break.  After hearing this news, it is very hard to cut them slack now.

Weird part is, it seems like almost the entire community is not in support of copying DD1's EV.  I don't really understand where they got the notion that this was a good idea.

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I have to say I agree with some parts of OP's post. I love EV (I like EVA as her name too) being in the game, and I love her towers (buff beam, and reflect), but  - I do think that some parts of her could have been changed. I never played DD2 and know nothing about Ev in that game, so I cant compare to that. 

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39 minutes ago, UncrownedData said:

Weird part is, it seems like almost the entire community is not in support of copying DD1's EV.  I don't really understand where they got the notion that this was a good idea.

Eeeeh, debatable. I think that most of those who post in the forums don't want EV.

I personnally like EV buff beams because it makes it so you need less of specific defenses to protect chokepoints and allows for more variety in the towers you decide to build with. The only thing I don't like about buff beams is having to guestimate the proper spot to put your auras and traps before they blow up in size.

I think the actual issue with EV is that her two "attack" beams are just bad compared to traps and auras.

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Posted (edited)

i think EV+Summoner will be always the Meta unless there is new characters that can actly join them other than that it will be always the same thing , don't get me wrong i would love new skills and weapon for every character But it's highly unlikely

Edited by edrose86

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On 8/4/2020 at 2:51 PM, gigazelle said:

Considering that DD2 has more concurrent players than DD1 and DDA combined, and considering that DD2 has a better review score than DDA, I wouldn't call DD2 a failure. Sure, it didn't reach critical acclaim like DD1 did, but neither has DDA. In fact, I'd submit that DDA's lack of critical acclaim is precisely because it refuses to stray from DD1.

A big contributing factor to DD2 having more concurrent players is the fact that it is free to play and there is no barrier for entry.  This is a big deal for kids who like to play with their friends and don't have money.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, chpoit said:

Eeeeh, debatable. I think that most of those who post in the forums don't want EV.

admittedly, I don't follow the other community discussion platforms.  

 

2 hours ago, chpoit said:

I personnally like EV buff beams because it makes it so you need less of specific defenses to protect chokepoints and allows for more variety in the towers you decide to build with. The only thing I don't like about buff beams is having to guestimate the proper spot to put your auras and traps before they blow up in size.

I think the actual issue with EV is that her two "attack" beams are just bad compared to traps and auras.

There are several ways to handle a chokepoint.  The real problem is base-scaling for each tower.  In theory, each different character could handle chokepoints alone, if scaled properly (this is assuming the DD1 issue with Ogres glitching through Squire and App walls is fixed in DDA, which I haven't played enough to know).  I don't think a buff beam is going to open the door for variability in how you handle a choke point. 

I think the only thing a buff beam will do for your choke point is force you to place every tower at said choke point in a relatively straight line, or basically be deemed a worthless tower.  

One of the problems, in my opinion, with buff beams (from DD1) is that anything NOT on a beam would basically be destroyed in a fraction of a second in Nightmare mode, unless it was placed behind something else on a buff beam.  DD1 forced you to either 1) put a buff beam under your entire front line at every choke point, or 2) create a tower health summoner that was literally for nothing more than making a high HP minion wall and a mage.  Seems to me that buff beams actually hinder your choice in handling chokepoints (if they take the same approach that DD1 implemented)

 

I do agree that the two offensive EV towers need fixed so they are usable.  

Edited by UncrownedData
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Posted (edited)
On 8/4/2020 at 3:49 PM, Lolstol said:

I agree with your arguments, but its too soon to be talking about the amount of players and the amount of content in dda. DDA is still in early accsess wich means that the game is not complete. Is simply not done. If you want a finished product you dont buy the game at early accsess, you wait until they remove early accsess and then play.

One of the big differences with dd1 and dda is that dda is server based, this means its much harder to cheat in the game. I think there is no cheaters in dda. If you want to cheat in dd1 you can simply download cheat engine or a program that simply lets you change a players and items stats easally.

dda is a better version than dd1 in so many ways and of course worse in some ways like trading and shops and as of right now, but it will improve in the future. Remember that dd1 is like 9 years old or something and dda is a couple months old.

I agree with you on the content part but just so you know it is extremely easy to hack this game just like dd1 their are already tons of hackers.

They should also focus on creating quality content. I dont mind the fact that they are behind on their schedule but they should take their time to make some actual content instead of just shitting out copies from dd1. I honestly cannot believe they are copy pasting ev from dd1, the amount the buff beam buffs seems about the same which is absurd.

Edited by gianthippo96

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On 8/7/2020 at 12:33 PM, gianthippo96 said:

I agree with you on the content part

 

On 8/7/2020 at 12:33 PM, gianthippo96 said:

but just so you know it is extremely easy to hack this game just like dd1 their are already tons of hackers.

I disagree with you on this! I have over 300 hours in DDA and I have played well over 100s of matches, and I have yet to come across a hacker. Do they exist? Sure, but like most games of this size you will find those few who slip through the cracks. Thats where we as players come in, we can report them using the ingame report function. Its not the most ideal, but to sit here and say there are a ton of hackers, is to be absurd. If you associate with these "hackers" then you are going to be in their circle, and their circle of course will have other hackers. If you want to avoid that, then continue reporting as you may have been, and dont engage them. 

 

I would like to reiterate that in my 300 hours of playing this game, I have yet to see a hacker. I am not saying they dont exist, but to say there is a ton, is to say DDA is still in EA. that is - untrue.

On 8/7/2020 at 12:33 PM, gianthippo96 said:

They should also focus on creating quality content. I dont mind the fact that they are behind on their schedule but they should take their time to make some actual content instead of just shitting out copies from dd1. I honestly cannot believe they are copy pasting ev from dd1, the amount the buff beam buffs seems about the same which is absurd.

I think DDA has big plans for quality content, right now they are just releasing these DLC packs for free as additional content.  Now not all of these dlcs will be free, and I hope that any dlc that is purchasable is new content, and not anything regurgitated.

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