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ddace

CDT Update 6 RC is Here!!

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Posted (edited)

Thanks to all for testing and providing feedback for this Update 6 so far.  It has been coming along and has hit RC where you can now play it and have your Ranked data progress saved by selecting it.  We are looking to hopefully release this soon and quickly move to Update 7 for yall.  So please test this when you can and provide any further feedback and report any issues with the update or with the game that need to get fixed.  Minor issues may get fixed in Update 7 as that will be moving quickly to beta as well for all to test after this release. 

To go ahead and switch to version 8.6:

  1. Go to your Steam Library
  2. Right click on Dungeon Defenders and select Properties
  3. Click on the Betas Tab
  4. Click on the drop down box and select update6_rc

Note:  Your Ranked Progress will be saved but if something major happens where we need to update again or remove items, then you may lose those items.  Or if you happen to exit the beta and go back to the Live branch, items from Update 6 will disappear.  

Here are the current list of Patch notes for this this update.  


New Map - Crystalline Resurgence 4
 - Rewards buffed Sky City lower difficulty weapons and Mini Kraken pet

New Map - Coastal Bazaar
 - Campaign rewards  new lamp and carpet weapons
 - Survival rewards genie wave 25 and Mini Genie King end of survival wave 35

Updated Map - Emerald City
 - Reskinned Boss and changed name
 - Added survival 
 - Rewards imp wave 25 and Desert Cupid end of survival
 - buffed emerald sword and staff stats
 - Emerald thrower now has more central spread
 - Random rewards were buffed to Moonbase levels
 - Added magic carpets to help move around map faster

QoL
 - Added quality color around item names in inventory to help make it easier to identify item qualities.  Toggles with "CTRL+O" 
 - Display 3 decimals for buff beam boost values
 - Show DPS in tool tip for Bouncer Blockade and Slice n Dice like other towers

Edited by ddace
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Just to state my opinion in here. The rewards for CR4 are not worth the time investment you have to place in the map, especially when they are done on the same way the Polybius rewards are. Getting a pet that rolls ult and higher less than 10% of the time, and each time you want to farm one it takes you at least 10 minutes is not something nice. The map was made less annoying to run with the removal of one wave, but the rewards don't make it worth running for them.

Balancing around emerald city weapons was nice on the staff and sword were nice, but the gun change was questionable, the weapon is still very underwhelming when compared to a blaster rifle or even a pawn shot (weapons that came way back and are easier to farm) since they don't have a spread and do generic damage only.
The carpets on emerald city are kinda useless since the time it takes to get on them is higher than just running to where they take you most of the time, they should be moved or changed to something smaller imo.

Coastal Bazaar is by far the best map in this update. The end of map rewards are pretty good on campaign and the survival drops make it an alternative to moonbase (the old meta armor run that everyone did). The use of the higher quality makes people that don't have high end pcs able to farm armor without taking way more real time than ingame due to getting low frames.
The amount of ogres at the end of waves is kinda high at the moment, getting upwards of 50-70 on the last few waves of survival. Mini Genie King rolls are kinda underwhelming on the quality factor, suffering from the same problem as the Mini Kraken.

 

Overall, all 3 pets that were added this patch seem quite bad on the quality percentages. If you compare the difficulty of CR1 and CR3 to CR4 and Emerald city, they're around the same for farming a pet on them, but the CR1/3 pets roll ultimate or higher 50-60% of the time, while CR4 and Emerald only get 10% at most. The difficulty on Coastal, while not as high as the other 3 survivals, is higher than doing a King Game survival run for a dice, but the dice rolls ult 20%, which is double the percentage of the new mini genie king.
Speaking from experience on this, even when the Mini Spider Queen (MSQ) and Crystalline Dragon roll ult that often, due to the sheer difficulty of the map not many people farm them really often. Meanwhile Dice get farmed a lot due to the low difficulty of the map, low time it takes to run 2 waves and high quality of rolls on them.
The new pets need to roll ultimate more frequently, otherwise they won't be pursued after.

While talking about how useful they are and not only on the quality rolls, both the Mini Genie King and Mini Kraken irrelevant choices. For both of them you need around 500 upgrades with good hero stats to beat a 39k chicken (which only takes at most 3-4 hours to farm, compared to the hundreds of hours for a high quality roll of the new pets). They shouldn't need that high of rolls to be comparable, somewhere around 400 should be the number to aim for. The MSQ at 400 upgrades and decent stats does way more damage than a chicken on non-boss mobs due to her quirk of shooting webs. While the Mini Genie doesn't need to outright outdamage a chicken at lower upgrades due to it giving the player mana, it needs to be at least on the same level without a god tier roll on upgrades and stats.
The Mini Kraken on the other hand needs to outright beat a chicken due to the sheer dificulty of farming it, being awarded on one of the highest difficulty maps of the game.
I can't say anything about the desert cupid due to not farming a decent one yet, but once I do I'll come back and say something about it.


As always, this is only my opinion, but I think a bunch of people would agree on it.

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Hmmm seems like you forgot to write about a change in the QoL part of the post there Acen. Because I can't see where it says that item recovery is coming to maps such as Sky City and Kings Game...

But i guess it's understandable that you guys dont want to add it with the community being so against it (https://forums.dungeondefenders.com/forums/topic/165969-item-recovery-for-sky-city-kg/?tab=comments#comment-1548053)

 

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5 hours ago, Sam116 said:

Hmmm seems like you forgot to write about a change in the QoL part of the post there Acen. Because I can't see where it says that item recovery is coming to maps such as Sky City and Kings Game...

But i guess it's understandable that you guys dont want to add it with the community being so against it (https://forums.dungeondefenders.com/forums/topic/165969-item-recovery-for-sky-city-kg/?tab=comments#comment-1548053)

 

That was not designed to be a part of this update.  However that doesnt mean it isnt coming in the next one.

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I'd appreciated for making Coastal Bazaar, this map, easy management.

I just use my Tower Boost monk and it still has a high drop rate in NMHC(non-MM) survival game.

So far I got sup, ult, ult+ armor here.

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Posted (edited)

Baby djinn are stupid on emerald survival, they have 20m hp on later waves and only take damage from players. There shouldn't be a mob that can just two shot my towers on a map that's already this hard on non-MM. I can't even imagine how hard mixed mode is on this map. This map is way harder than any other map in the game on survival because of this and the fact that they are able to make all enemies golden.
I legitimately don't know what is less annoying to run for the rewards, campaign with the boss and the "kill all towers" mechanic or the survival with the "lose your run" djinns

The cupid pet is fine for dps, but I stand on the fact that

To add on this, the 40-50 ogres that spawn at once at the end of the map already make it hard enough as it is, the baby djinn just make it so the map is bs. It feels the same way as tow when kobolds killed the east crystal out of nowhere

 

Edited by Thaleskpl
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hullo its bon. not sure how i feel about this update. thales pretty much hit everything i was gonna say but ill reiterate some bits it based on my experiences and the experiences of other peeps who voice their opinions on DDRnG.


so first off the main things that are said about emerald is that baby djinns suck, the few who run it say theyre too tanky and they deal way too much damage. the big boy wyverns on that map have way too much hp and you arent able to clear the survival without wheeling. ive asked people in DDRnG and everyone agreed that any survival that NEEDS wheel to win is a really bad survival and isnt worth the hassle for a really bad pet. thales mentioned how bad the pets drop so just refer to his post up there ^ for  it. the carpets on emerald are scuffed cuz they are really slow. if you get hit by anything while youre on the carpet, it returns you back to where the carpet starts, its really frustrating when youre trying to use the shortcut that floops you across the map when the shortcut is really bad and is slower in most cases to use them than running normally. its faster to run from east core to any other core than to use the carpets there.

for coastal the weapons drop reaaaaaally well for being a really easy map, idk if you guys plan on changing weapons already in the game or whatever but those are definitely the mid game meta weapons since they drop ult like 55% of the time. i get that coastal surv is supposed to be the alternative to moonbase but i feel like its everything and more. but maybe too much more. my testing sample has been really small so farm at only 11 runs but so far ive gotten an average of 8 ults per run on non mix mode from waves 21-35. idk if that maps broken but from watching others get loot as frequently as i did, this is probably intended for the most part.

cr4 isnt too difficult if you have super high stats, ive soloed it around 8 times to make sure it wasnt just luck, the rewards are really underwhelming. specially the krakens, theyre a cool pet dont get me wrong, but they roll horribly. same for the weapons they rolled pretty bad from what ive seen. i definitely havent had enough testing yet but im not sure whether theyre dps weapons or builder weapons since all of their damage is horrid and the stats dont roll high at all. i was expecting them to be a bit better, specially since it comes from cr4 which is arguably the hardest map yet aside from cr3 old one and the survival maps.

im not sure what else there is to say besides this update was kinda butts lol, it is definitely nice having another good armor farming map but this one might be a tad bit op lol

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I don't have very strong opinions about other things but one thing I can talk about is CR4.

Chewy and I put a decent amount of time into the map to see how far we could push the times learning new things here and there. Significantly more time than anybody else.

During this update, VERY few people every ran the map. After many days there were 7 people on the Nightmare leaderboard in total. It is now up to around 20 compared to Coastal with significantly more, don't have the number off the top of my head but its in the hundreds.

The map is up there in terms of effort and difficulty put in. The only thing I could say that takes more effort than it is Temple of Polybius.

Temple of Polybius drops the best weapons in the game. Nothing compares to their stat rolls. CR4 weapons on the other hand are pretty much on par with Coastal in terms of ult chance and stat rolls.

Both maps require multiple people to get any decent time on it, rewards are account based etc. These maps have a lot of similarities, except for the rewards. The thing about this is that CR4 is on par with Poly in terms of difficulty and effort but takes longer and drops half the weapons. You also can't target a specific weapon you want without using an extremely suboptimal class in most cases. These things should be on par with Polybius' weapons stat wise just considering how the maps function relative to eachother.

Now, the real problem at hand. The Kraken. There isn't much to be said about this thing other than, it sucks. It doesn't deal even moderately close to enough damage to make it usable. Nearly 500 upgrades with a max damage roll is absolutely insane just to beat a chicken on melee damage that can be gotten in a few runs. They need extreme buffs to their melee damage to ever be considered usable.

Even more of a problem, their ult rates. They drop ult or higher less than 10% of the time. This map takes 10 minutes if you're doing it very well in a 2p run. Anything above 2p gets incredibly laggy to the point that I don't care if it was faster, its basically unplayable for the people who aren't hosting. It's already incredibly hard to even get a hawk off on a Barbarian on 2 player due to lag, regardless of connection. You get 1 Kraken per run. Needing to do 10-11 runs on average for an ultimate immediately means they will not be farmed at all, they could beat chickens at 350 ups and still nobody would use them because it is so ridiculously rare to get one for a map this difficult and engaged. To be quite honest, depending on the damage buff that they require, they should be brought to a 50% ult rate. It feels really bad on a map that only drops 1 of a reward you're looking for to have a low ult rate. 

A personal opinion is that I would like to see them beat a 39k chicken at 350 ups assuming max damage roll with a 35-40% ult rate. Another number I think could be looked at is beating it at ~400 ups with a 50% ult rate. Anything below 30% and I honestly couldn't see many people running the map regardless of how good they are.

Krakens roll pretty well on their stats from what I have seen so I don't think they need stat buffs. I think they should be adjusted through negative chance primarily and lowering the ult requirement.

The Kraken's ranged attack is pretty uninteresting and mediocre but I've heard there is already work being done on that so I won't bother talking about it.

Genie Kings are basically the same pet without ranged damage and give mana instead. These things should be buffed too obviously since they basically have the same numbers as the Kraken but I do think they should deal a considerable amount less than Kraken but give more mana. They really don't have a usage currently. The mana isn't enough to mean much for a DPS pet, could do with a small buff to mana to give it a purpose even if it was outclassed on raw damage.

 

TL;DR. CR4 is a complete flop rewards wise. Very nice map now that a wave was removed but lag issues really hurt it.

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Even though it's great to have new updates and the new maps are really great, it's rather disappointing seeing so little quality of life improvements being added. So many things that could be improved, but what is implemented is just more numbers to Buff Beams... As if now its values are any less irrelevants than were before...

> Not differentiating golden enemies on the mini map
> Not being able to cycle while checking towers (not to mention ethereal trap overlaying everything)
> Not being able to type how much mana to drop instead of dropping all or using those extremely sensitive arrows
> Not having a scrollbar in the Accomplishments section
> Not having the option to equip accs to serve purely as cosmetic without the need to remove whatever you were using for stats

I don't want to sound ungrateful in any way, but adding carpets that barely saves any time and more numbers to Buff Beams... So much more relevant things could have been done... But at least north crystal of Temple of Water was finally fixed (and took only 1 or 2 weeks since its release, or a little more...).

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