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Ron Bloodwings

Drakenfrost Frustrations

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To put things bluntly; Drakenfrost is my most disliked map in the game at present. In its initial release it was a neat map but after the Drakenlord arrived it quickly plummeted in fun value for me. I never in my time playing had gotten a Burning Strikes shard out of C5 and was only recently able to acquire one thanks to the new shard shop. So from the time the Drakenlord became fully active and the latest update I avoided Drakenfrost altogether solo because the map's provided mechanic of lighting torches was a joke to accomplish alone and the huntress felt very slow to light as well. This doesn't even factor in the whole invisible Drakenlord bug which I have had the misfortune of coming across the other day and made a map I already found un-fun to be outright obnoxiously difficult to etch out a win on. Then came my decision to start climbing Onslaught again...

Previously, I had gotten to a higher Onslaught floor on my first reset with largely less powerful gear in terms of MODs and less ascension but have simply hit a brick wall with Drakenfrost at floor 39 and have found it to be particularly frustrating for me. The difficulty spike in the map with the Drakenlord freezing defenses feels very unfair because it punishes you not for building incorrectly but for simply not lighting the braziers fast enough which if you're using the map's provided method is nigh impossible to accomplish while Burning Strikes not proccing fast enough can cost you the map. Adding to this is the assassin factor; bad assassin timing can just plain loose you the map with no fault on the player. It should be noted I haven't experienced the invisible Drakenlord bug yet in Onslaught but seeing as I can't even handle the Drakenlord normally this would just make me leave map immediately.

I greatly question whether or not I'll try to push at all after hitting such a hard stop on my climb after having little trouble getting to 39. With Drakenfrost being the only map for 39 I can't get around it either. If anyone has any suggestions on how I could progress that doesn't involve getting all my defenses to C8 with 10/10 tenacity I'd like to hear them.

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Posted (edited)

Would like to share my personal experiences and hopefully this can help even slightly :)

I had same experience as you do, that I was able to complete 100+ and had problem with 39 at the beginning. After a few adjustments, I found Drakenkeep much much easier than temple and I liked it even more, and havn't had any problem ever since, even I've progressed much higher than before. 

1. Equip burning strike (u already doing that, great ~ )

2. use multi-projectile weapon, for example a bow with 10 shots with 2/s is 20 shots in a second, torch would be lit in less than a second easily. 

3. Reroll all HS assassins, and just create a kill box for normal assassins. (If you have Barb, hot swap &  turtle stance instead of reroll) 

4. Turtle Build (I don't do this personally since doesn't work with my build, but I know many have had success even at very high floor) 

5. Be active, pay attention to the dragon, and be there before the freeze comes

I would not recommend throw tenacity on defenses just for the sake of freeze, since that's a sacrifice on your DPS and can be solved by being more attentive and active

Edited by hailminion

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Use the lanes to your advantage you don't have to spawn camp all lanes use the merge points. group defenses for easy torch lighting 

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Hmm we’ve all been thier, And I’m only on my first reset currently, All I do is just be attentive and that dragon show up is to fire the brazers shoot that thing quickly with oil and fire equip of course. Then you should be ok 

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Yeah i agree, we all needed to get our losses on this map to get wins. I remember for me this was huge deal on floor 209. It took me 3 hours to get through this map.

Well the same comes to omega waves in Lost temple - you just need to fail and learn fail and learn many times to discover what is working.

Good luck im sure you will overcome this.

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Posted (edited)

I can already see your problem: You have no means of torch control at your disposal. 

  • Any character with Burning Strikes
  • Barbarian with Oil/Fire pair weapons
  • Lavamancer with Oil weapon
  • Huntress with Torch or Fire Chip + Oil Flask

These methods are the easiest means to light a torch without having to play the gimmick rules. Just pay attention to your radar to where the Drakenlord lands and the direction in which the ice breath travels.  Factor in current spawns when lightning torches as priority is where active lanes are.  

Some lanes also merge into one. Knowing where these are will give you a definite advantage as you can potentially skip torches. No matter what, the worst case scenario is you will need to light 3 torches. Once you get past Wave 1, assess which lanes had the worst problems and divert upgrades to those locations.

Onslaught isn't as bad as Lost Temple is because of the preset pattern the enemies spawn on and both air lanes spawn within interception of the ground lanes. The only thing you truly need to fear is large clusters of enemies with opposing affixes (eg. Spellbreaker and Armored) and Headstrong air lane north if there are Kobolts there. Dark Assassins aren't as bad if you got a good Barbarian as Turtle Stance blocks them.

For the south, if the lane has Kobolts, you can place an Obelisk where they fly and use that as Kobolt bait 

You can also save DU by not having a stunlock combo on the following lanes:

  • Just Timmy (PDT or Flame Aura)
  • Omega Squad Epsilon (wall + reflect)
  • Hexfrost Throwers (wall + reflect)
  • Drakin Barrage (wall + reflect)
  • High Rollers (slow + projectiles aiming engine)
Quote

I would not recommend throw tenacity on defenses just for the sake of freeze, since that's a sacrifice on your DPS and can be solved by being more attentive and active

Only do this for auras and traps you plan on using in the presence of Cyber Orcs

Edited by ChrisH36

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14 hours ago, ChrisH36 said:

I can already see your problem: You have no means of torch control at your disposal. 

  • Any character with Burning Strikes
  • Barbarian with Oil/Fire pair weapons
  • Lavamancer with Oil weapon
  • Huntress with Torch or Fire Chip + Oil Flask

These methods are the easiest means to light a torch without having to play the gimmick rules. Just pay attention to your radar to where the Drakenlord lands and the direction in which the ice breath travels.  Factor in current spawns when lightning torches as priority is where active lanes are.  

Some lanes also merge into one. Knowing where these are will give you a definite advantage as you can potentially skip torches. No matter what, the worst case scenario is you will need to light 3 torches. Once you get past Wave 1, assess which lanes had the worst problems and divert upgrades to those locations.

Onslaught isn't as bad as Lost Temple is because of the preset pattern the enemies spawn on and both air lanes spawn within interception of the ground lanes. The only thing you truly need to fear is large clusters of enemies with opposing affixes (eg. Spellbreaker and Armored) and Headstrong air lane north if there are Kobolts there. Dark Assassins aren't as bad if you got a good Barbarian as Turtle Stance blocks them.

For the south, if the lane has Kobolts, you can place an Obelisk where they fly and use that as Kobolt bait 

You can also save DU by not having a stunlock combo on the following lanes:

  • Just Timmy (PDT or Flame Aura)
  • Omega Squad Epsilon (wall + reflect)
  • Hexfrost Throwers (wall + reflect)
  • Drakin Barrage (wall + reflect)
  • High Rollers (slow + projectiles aiming engine)

Only do this for auras and traps you plan on using in the presence of Cyber Orcs

Thanks for the tips (both you and others) I did have Burning Strikes the last few times I tried Drakenfrost now thanks to the shard shop. But I still had some troubles getting it to light the torches fast enough even with a Quintuple 4/s shot on my monk. I'll give this and the thoughts of others in this thread a try soon enough.

Ironically, Lost Temple is perhaps my favorite map to build and strategize around for its additional lanes with each wave! Drakenfrost with its torch mechanic just plain rubs me the wrong way since it forces you to move around the map in ways you may not be prepared for. Like say; if a lane just needs a bit of extra help because a boss like Thorc or Geode Prime shows up in a lane that called for auras or projectiles  but the Drakenlord freezes another lane. So you have to choose to either let one of those bosses run over your defenses or let the frozen lane get run over.

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If you want go on discord - ask for help and we can help you to learn correct placement - which is usually the problem. Or PM me through discord and i can check your build.

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My best recommendation for that is to pray to rngesus xD

13 hours ago, Ron Bloodwings said:

still had some troubles getting it to light the torches fast enough even with a Quintuple 4/s shot on my monk

If can't light with 20 shots every second with 20% proc chance on every hit. The only thing left is really pure rng, which can truly mess u up pretty big sometimes

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Posted (edited)

This map in onslaught is the reason I quit this game after more than 2000 hours. I loved this game so much that I keep checking to see if they've removed it, but alas. They screwed it up for a lot of us who were playing dd2 for onslaught.  Many of my friends stopped playing too. Sad! 

Edited by CrusadeR@DD2

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On 5/11/2019 at 6:01 AM, Ron Bloodwings said:

Thanks for the tips (both you and others) I did have Burning Strikes the last few times I tried Drakenfrost now thanks to the shard shop. But I still had some troubles getting it to light the torches fast enough even with a Quintuple 4/s shot on my monk.

Figured I would highlight this part since I have seen it more times than I can count. With a lot of Monk players I see people trying to light the torches from far away with their secondary attack and at those ranges your quintuple shot is really only a single shot because you arent going to land all 5 projectiles unless you are hugging the torch. At a longer range the monk is actually very bad at lighting them.

I agree with Hail's suggestion of using Scatter shot which is 10 projectiles but that is also very shot range shotgun so you would still need to be there before the dragon freezes. To have the best chances to light and still do it from as long range as possible Burst shot would be the best shot type. It puts 4 projectiles in a line right behind one another and can shoot far.

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GW Megashark also works great. Insane fire rate and reflects/pierces off 1 surface or enemy. I just spray down the area and almost always hits. 

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I always get messages from other gamers who need help on Floor 39. I don’t blame anyone who hates this map because most of the time I’m running around like a headless chicken. 

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Well after a few more tries I got past Floor 39 Drakenfrost, it only makes me dread the eventual return of it at 49...

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After more than 2000 hours in the game, it's clear to say that I loved the game till the Drakenfrost update, and the devs killed the game for me. Let me explain.
This is an Action RPG TD, the action part has been reduced to running around lighting torches from actually defending and providing support to the defenses.
The only way to play this map on onslaught is to have overpowered towers that they can defend on their own so you run around and light torches.
If you grind and get your towers to be able to handle Drakenfrost on their own, then the next 10 onslaught levels become a bore because there's no hero defense needed, till you hit the next Drakenfrost map, and then it's lighting torches again.

 

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@CrusadeR@DD2 I find Lost Temple having that problem more. I spend 10% the time lighting torches in Keep (a wave is like 2 min, takes 5s to light 2 adjacent torches, and 4 waves of freeze I get the most per wave)

While Lost Temple, I spend 30% time running across the map, 40% on lag, 30% on mobs running off their paths, and 0% most time on actual any lanes at all. 

I'm definitely with you for what you are saying and completely agree the concept. However, if anything, Lost Temple needs to go before Draken Keep, for how many problems players have reported for the map, which still havn't been fixed for over half a year. At least Keep we can get moving faster, learning the freeze mechanic and react to it better, and contribute more time in lanes. There's no fix on players' side for LT. 

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Posted (edited)

The real problems with Lost Temple boil down to the following I find:

  • Air lanes and their paths (eg. Wyverns that are supposed to attack the 2F Crystal at the Start spot fly to the 1F Crystal at the bridges)
  • Ground lanes have wonky pathing, especially in double lanes or if there are 2 Crystals in the area
  • The fact that all the lanes are active at the same time and have no real set pattern with exceptions like Zerkers and Healers, certain Omega Squads and certain formations in Mob Gallery.

The farthest I got to was 114 but I largely lost because my defenses were being outclassed, but it also didn't help I didn't have a trash relic for a SGT, didn't use my Earthshatters as well as I thought I should have and I had a dead weight mod on my PDTs that I replaced with a better one (Damage Buff > Anti-Melee).

It also doesn't help if 2 or more problem lanes are on separate quadrants on the map. I had a few runs where all the problems were contained in either 1 area or there was a set pattern I had to move around in order to control the problems. 

The Omega Waves were a nuisance but then I started using LSAs with Anti-Miniboss and I fried them in seconds. Getting to them is the real test.

 

 

Edited by ChrisH36

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Posted (edited)

I also hated this map, but then I found the Fire Frost weapon mod. I have it equipped on my monk with a 5 projectile 4s attack speed polearm that can pierce projectile barriers. The map is not completely irrelevant at my difficulty level. I am only on floor 130 something, but I have zero C8 relics and no Ancient power.

Edited by Zimmermann

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