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Final_Bosu

Hyper Shards-Opinions and stuff

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If you clicked on this you more than likely already know what they are and how hard they can be to acquire.  Seeing as they cost as much to upgrade as your regular gilded shard, I'm curious to know what other people think when it comes to AP resets and whether you think Hyper Shards should be protected against resets.  I think they should be protected against resets and would be willing to push this issue as long as we can have a healthy discussion about it and here's why: 

1. Prestigious Item - anyone who has any or all of the Hyper Shards understands how hard they are to acquire.  I'd say they are the highest reward for completing any of this game's content.  Some people spend more time acquiring one hyper shard compared to the time it takes to craft one gilded shard

2. Cost to upgrade - every Hyper Shard costs two million gold to max out, or 2,000 Defender Medals with the most expensive one, Automation, costing three million gold or 3,000 medals.  If you're doing resets on a daily basis you're going to run out of gold/medals pretty quick.  Now not all of the hyper shards are worth upgrading for resets depending on certain builds but majority use Mass Destruction and Vicious Strikes.  

I hope to have a healthy and constructive conversation about this.  Should they be protected since they cost as much as a gilded shard?  Should the costs be adjusted a little lower?  Or is this just a small price we have to pay for acquiring one of the hardest items in the game?  

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I ap'd 66 times. I say this for perspective. I did not use hypershards while AP grinding. I did 36 of them before proteon update. With mods hypershards are even less needed. 

Please understand the following statement is from the perspective of multiple floor pushes and going 55-65 66 times.

AP grinding (to 65) has 0 challenge after you get the hang of it.

You dont even need max relics let alone hyper shards.

Its a mind numbing time consuming grind but it doesnt need the bis shard setup. Make your grind fast and cost effective.

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..to add, Bosu, the AP system is being re-worked and, by the sound of it, soon.  If you're going to reset, don't worry about buffing your hypershards until you are finished grinding AP out, for a time.  See what this AP re-work entails, as well.

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You guys are right, good points.  Hyper Shards are not needed at all.  If you're only pushing to 66 then resetting there's no need for Hyper Shards especially with mods.  However, I stand by the idea that since they're so expensive and hard to get they should still be protected.  

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Making them not protected just means they will not get used...which seems like a big waste of design. Why play mastery to get something you will not use a vast majority of your climb? The whole AP reset process is counter-intuitive to me for a game that makes it foundation on gaining levels and collecting stuff - both of which the process wipes out. 

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To directly answer the op, I think hyper shards SHOULD be protected against resets. You only have one of each, so protection would not trivialize the reset process. Also, protection would be further incentive for people to go get the hyper shards in the first place. 

As others have mentioned, a lack of protection means no one is going to use the hyper shards during AP grinds. Thus, without protection, a player aiming towards the AP grind might be detered from ever pursuing hyper shards. 

I don’t think we want one end-game route to be antithetical from another end-game route. I think the game is better when one avenue synergizes with the other. 

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There was an AP survey recently.  I did not take it, but hopefully, those that did, have an inkling of what might be coming.  Hopefully the new AP re-working involves the ability to gild hyper-shards, but I'm not hopeful on this one.  I am looking forward to seeing what they have to say about the survey, and what will be done.

"Thus, without protection, a player aiming towards the AP grind might be detered from ever pursuing hyper shards. " - Sell Sword

They wouldn't pursue the hypershards until they are convinced that their AP grind is completed.

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@SELL SW0RD quote:

I don’t think we want one end-game route to be antithetical from another end-game route. I think the game is better when one avenue synergizes with the other. 

YES!!!!!!! So very well said. Exactly. 

Why collect everything (or anything), if it will be taken away from you? In a collection game i am looking for things that add, never subtract. Especially when "rare drops" are involved. AP resets and the rest of the game are currently in direct conflict with each other. To me - the bigger issue is not just how to fix it, but how to do so without making all the people who have already used the current way and not piss them off and drive them away, as the pride they have for their accomplishments are very real and must be acknowledged. 


In other games i have that also do resets (mostly RPGs mind you) - they only thing they tend to take away is the level your hero is on - which then directly translates into points you put into their base stats. The hero's power is derived from the base stats times the level the are on, so with each reset - you drive those base stats further and further up, which then equals more and more power. They did not reset a single thing beyond that - including all money, weapons, gear, spells, etc. In the process - i loved resetting as i only got stronger, and the only thing i lost, was having to level my hero back up, which i could do just by having them in my party, in the back - and beat one of my current levels, and BAM they are already like 60% of the way back. Same weapons, same spells, etc., and no unequipping and reequipping needed. I reset all the time, and in that game, you reset when you hit level 9999, and could then store up to like 180,000 base levels/points if you wanted to, and make some unholy huge damage amounts. If you are curious, that franchise is the DIsgaea series, a SRPG that has been around a long time, and has had their reset process down since game one. Now a key difference in that system though is resets were done for each hero, and the reset did not universally apply to all, which is a key difference to DD2's approach. However, that game is a "collection" game too, and i think TE could do themselves a whole lot of good by checking that process out and thinking about mirroring it to some degree. I think the current reset process is too geared towards shooters, and not enough like RPGs. 

But maybe that is an idea - instead of resetting your whole account all at once - we go to resets for only 1 hero at a time, but no gear/shards/weapons are lost. Only that one hero resets, and then there base points (i.e. ascension points)  go up. This may also mean that we would need to eliminate the "all heroes level up at the same time" way that DD2 does things, but if we are gunning for longevity - that would certainly help with that. I can safely say though - until the reset process stops taking my progress on everything away - i do not find the process appealing at all.  

I really want to take part in the AP process, as its like the last part of DD2 i have yet to experience, and i have hit all of my ascension caps for tower power - but...that cost and loss....ugh.... I am afraid i will do exactly what so many before me have done - reset, get totally depressed about how much was taken away, and stop playing the game as a result. 

Anyways, sorry for rambling, just some thoughts and i am sure i've now shared too many. Sorry. 

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@Jaws_420 quote:
@SELL SW0RD quote:

I don’t think we want one end-game route to be antithetical from another end-game route. I think the game is better when one avenue synergizes with the other. 

YES!!!!!!! So very well said. Exactly. 

Why collect everything (or anything), if it will be taken away from you? In a collection game i am looking for things that add, never subtract. Especially when "rare drops" are involved. AP resets and the rest of the game are currently in direct conflict with each other. To me - the bigger issue is not just how to fix it, but how to do so without making all the people who have already used the current way and not piss them off and drive them away, as the pride they have for their accomplishments are very real and must be acknowledged. 


In other games i have that also do resets (mostly RPGs mind you) - they only thing they tend to take away is the level your hero is on - which then directly translates into points you put into their base stats. The hero's power is derived from the base stats times the level the are on, so with each reset - you drive those base stats further and further up, which then equals more and more power. They did not reset a single thing beyond that - including all money, weapons, gear, spells, etc. In the process - i loved resetting as i only got stronger, and the only thing i lost, was having to level my hero back up, which i could do just by having them in my party, in the back - and beat one of my current levels, and BAM they are already like 60% of the way back. Same weapons, same spells, etc., and no unequipping and reequipping needed. I reset all the time, and in that game, you reset when you hit level 9999, and could then store up to like 180,000 base levels/points if you wanted to, and make some unholy huge damage amounts. If you are curious, that franchise is the DIsgaea series, a SRPG that has been around a long time, and has had their reset process down since game one. Now a key difference in that system though is resets were done for each hero, and the reset did not universally apply to all, which is a key difference to DD2's approach. However, that game is a "collection" game too, and i think TE could do themselves a whole lot of good by checking that process out and thinking about mirroring it to some degree. I think the current reset process is too geared towards shooters, and not enough like RPGs. 

But maybe that is an idea - instead of resetting your whole account all at once - we go to resets for only 1 hero at a time, but no gear/shards/weapons are lost. Only that one hero resets, and then there base points (i.e. ascension points)  go up. This may also mean that we would need to eliminate the "all heroes level up at the same time" way that DD2 does things, but if we are gunning for longevity - that would certainly help with that. I can safely say though - until the reset process stops taking my progress on everything away - i do not find the process appealing at all.  

I really want to take part in the AP process, as its like the last part of DD2 i have yet to experience, and i have hit all of my ascension caps for tower power - but...that cost and loss....ugh.... I am afraid i will do exactly what so many before me have done - reset, get totally depressed about how much was taken away, and stop playing the game as a result. 

Anyways, sorry for rambling, just some thoughts and i am sure i've now shared too many. Sorry. 

I mean, what seems like a solution would be to reset ascension, but not pets or gear. Add a gear requirement (must have completed 7 C(y) maps or have Onslaught current completed floor xx to wear C(y+1) gear) type system. Allow players to attempt any Onslaught level they have previously completed, now suddenly skill plays a part in how quickly resets go (If you can solo Onslaught 55 in C1 gear, you fly through it). Give titles & unique pet skins based on AP level prior to this change, unbearable any other way in the future. Change Onslaught so any two players can group together, but in multiplayer completing an Onslaught can only advance your current completed floor by one. So someone on floor 120 and someone on floor 80 can both do floor 120, but now one player is up to 121, the other up to 81.

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I don't believe hypershards should reset. I also wish, and i might be in the minority that mastery would reset. I would love to be able to have more than one of each hypershard so that can play the game with some more tower diversity instead of being forced to use one tower heavily.

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Agreed.  There is no way to protect hyper-shards from resets such as gilding.  They cost so much to level.  Personally I upgrade only two of them and then only half-way on each reset.  But It doesn't make me feel good.

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