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Fozzie

Dungeon Defenders 2 is failing

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You can see it in the Steam charts

December/January a small take up due to the Power of the Ancients update, but immediate fall off

March a small take up for the Barbarian, then an immediate fall off.

Why is this Trendy guys, very very simple you introduced nothing new to do.

Long term you need to give people something to do.

The answer was given to you on a platter in DD1.

Unique weapons that are a cut above the normal loot on each map. You have to farm these maps to get the best stats.

You had this with incursions then you nuked yourself with the stupidity that is the Wayfarer. In the NM4 Inc days we used to run and run the maps over and over until we got the stats we wanted.

Open ALL maps to all tiers and dump the feckin Wayfarer and put the weapons on the maps.

Bring back Betsy to all tiers put flair chests on her map alongside the normal chest as an extra reward for the difficulty of the map.

You have to look at map choice and replayability.

This last update was a disaster, great vaults for the few players who are still here but people might sign in to get a vault but there is nothing new to do.

Maps and heroes boost numbers

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You did leave out the small fact that DD1 has even less players actively playing it than DD2 so there is a possibility that making it more like DD1 isn't the answer. The closest copy game to DD2 would probably be orcs must die 1 and 2, and both of those games are doing even worse playerbase wise than DD2 on PC alone. I would like more content and something different as well but I can't ignore the plain fact that just counting PC alone DD2 is doing better than all Tower Defense based games. I would say its more about the genre of Tower Defenses that is keeping numbers low and there is nothing Trendy can do to change that. 

Before Forknife is brought in as an example of a game that is doing better remember that its very hard to find anyone not doing the battle royal mode on streams which means their "Tower Defense" isn't the game mode people want and I would very much hate if DD2 went with this phase of gaming that wasn't popular until recently.

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Could not agree more with Fozzie.  Balancing needs to be addressed.  Also, catering to die-hards only was a terribly choice (repeatedly).  We all understand the game is F2P and they need to edge you toward buying over farming (characters) but the gameplay has suffered greatly - not because it is F2P, they do not know how to run a F2P model.

DD1 has less numbers but you have to consider attrition simply due to aging.

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Uhm you left out ps4 and xbox platforms....i heard a rumor xbox had the highest population base. Always people in town in console in all 3 servers.

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Yes, i would love to see farming weapons come back!!!!!! Much of the joy in the replayability of DD1 was this facet. Not being able to play any level, and especially any incursion level on any difficulty is a big misfire. I would already be farming some stages if i had this ability. Instead, we only have two Incursion maps at C7, and all the rest produce gear you cannot use in end game. Please let us at least play any incursion on any difficulty. Then we can at least farm those legenadries. Same with campaign. Why have a legendary Harbinger shield....at campaign strength only??? Plus i would love to fight the big bosses at full strength. I miss the big boss battles from DD1 and all of its DLC. The lane bosses are just nowhere near the same. Yes, they do give us more drops, which i am grateful for, but i miss the big epic scale challenge of lobbing harpoons at a dragon. 

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Some really good examples about DD2's problems.

Sadly the playerbase had been pointing this out since ~2015. Some of the huge problems haven't changed. TE says that balance will be reworked since 2016 and it HAS been reworked several times. Sadly it never turned out how it should be. Otherwise the talk about balancing stuff would have been stopped.


Actually... who is surprised about players losing hope when stuff like that is unresolved for such a long time. DD2 is supposed to be an online game, yet people have to play solo or with friends to prevent randoms come in and destroy their games.

Some of the new maps feel like a mobile version of a tower defense game. The subcore placement sometimes is a bad joke that's only preventing creative building instead of adding depth.  

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A game that Trendy could take note of is Warframe.  Not necessarily for the mechanics, but because they know how to do a F2P model.  A big note is that Warframe did not shy away from, long ago or now, that they made something that was not working for the community they would fix it and sometimes even completely remove it.  Not that it wasn't working for them, but the focus was the player base.  When something was removed they would give something else back or in it's place.  Again, the focus being the player base.  They always tried to make sure they were doing the right thing, the right way.  Was it negative both ways?  In some cases yes.  But it wasn't really about taking responsibility, it was about doing the right thing for the player base.  

I believe Trendy is more than capable of this.

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The patch this past week was not an update, just a patch that introduced a new feature.

Our very big update coming out this Summer is going to check some of your boxes listed above. We are going to be getting info over time leading up to it. Alongside this is some greater foundational changes that allows us to make additional rewards in the future more meaningful. There's a lot coming, and we're really excited to share! :)

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@Lawlta quote:

The patch this past week was not an update, just a patch that introduced a new feature.

Our very big update coming out this Summer is going to check some of your boxes listed above. We are going to be getting info over time leading up to it. Alongside this is some greater foundational changes that allows us to make additional rewards in the future more meaningful. There's a lot coming, and we're really excited to share! :)

I can't wait to see what is coming. Sharkman_insane.png

Shark pets and The Prisoner, right? Right? LOL... i can dream...  Jester_Forum_icon2.png

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@Lawlta quote:

The patch this past week was not an update, just a patch that introduced a new feature.

Our very big update coming out this Summer is going to check some of your boxes listed above. We are going to be getting info over time leading up to it. Alongside this is some greater foundational changes that allows us to make additional rewards in the future more meaningful. There's a lot coming, and we're really excited to share! :)

Not trying to be obstinate, but being someone who has been around DD2 since long before your time and seeing these "positive spins and pitches" on what is coming and #hypehypehype time and time again... buuuuut... it may be time for greater transparency.  My wife and I are enjoying our time together in DD2, but even from her perspective she can feel the choke points that "check some of your boxes" may be better for us to know - even if in draft and understand they will change.  It builds trust and openness with a community where #hype in a situation where you're attempting to keep the players around - or better yet grow the player base allow this to become an even greater sustainable profit model, if not more - hype goes less distance.

My two cents.

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@Kambien quote:
it may be time for greater transparency.  My two cents.

This is what my plans are starting over the next couple weeks, leading up to update release.

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@Lawlta quote:


@Kambien quote:
it may be time for greater transparency.  My two cents.

This is what my plans are starting over the next couple weeks, leading up to update release.

That will be an amazing change of pace for Trendy.

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@Kambien quote:


@Lawlta quote:


@Kambien quote:
it may be time for greater transparency.  My two cents.

This is what my plans are starting over the next couple weeks, leading up to update release.

That will be an amazing change of pace for Trendy.

Probably too amazing to be true. After hearing this for months on end, I'm now like the villagers in the story of the boy who cried wolf. Until I actually see a "wolf" (well before the release of an update) I'm not gonna believe it.

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@Lawlta quote:


@Kambien quote:
it may be time for greater transparency.  My two cents.

This is what my plans are starting over the next couple weeks, leading up to update release.

I have to pile on with what [[14552,users]] said. I have been here so long now and have heard this same thing so many times. Always the same super vague snip-it "We have some exciting changes coming up that we think you'll love" But never anything substantial until a dev stream the week before the update.


I have not however heard this from you specifically so I will give you the benefit of the doubt and hope the higher ups don't hang you out to dry. I hope you give us actual informative information and not "teaser" info that eludes to imaginative speculative possible features. Things that I can read and understand how the mechanic will work so I can get excited about it. Not and idea with no clue how you plan to implement it that leaves me with the standard feeling of doubt.

Would also be nice to get this info sooner rather then later since as [[52650,users]] stated the number (at least on PC) are not flat they are in decline and I do believe it is because the player base that has been in the wings waiting are not even doing dailies anymore because they have given up waiting for "that fix" no matter which one it is, that brings the fun back into the game.

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@Lawlta quote:


@Kambien quote:
it may be time for greater transparency.  My two cents.

This is what my plans are starting over the next couple weeks, leading up to update release.

When can we expect some information?  Not a teaser, not #hype, just some material of what is coming with full awareness that it may change? :-)

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Reel that info in [[14552,users]], don't let them of that hook, [[166314,users]]

We really do want to know Emoji_GobHuntress.png Emoji_Apprentice.png Emoji_Monk.png Emoji_Squire.png

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I love this game. It's my fave.

I believe it's not failing and hope it doesn't fail at all. I put my faith in Trendy but i also have faith in this community. It's not even a year old and i hope this game goes on for many years.

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@BeerGoggles quote:

people are just being melodramatic. The number have been stable for the last 2 years.

What do you call stable? Because if you are truly talking about the last 2 years you're crazy. If you are talking a few months, maybe.

If you look at the numbers in the last year, the average has gone from 1k to 800 to 700 to 600 now 500s. So if you are talking a stable descent then yes.

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Ok, last 2 years is pretty bold. But definitely since sept 2017 it's been extremely flat.  http://steamcharts.com/app/236110#All


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To begin, this game has been "out", for some of us, closer to 3-4 years.  We also paid into the alpha.  Paid into the first DLC releases.  Some folks paid into the original shard packs.  Also, I wouldn't necessarily call something melodramatic when those - not even are people really complaining - but are showing the same passion for DD2 as you are by saying, "This is aweful... and here is how you can make it better because I still love and want to continue to love this game".  The same things being said for the previous 3-4 years, not just this week.  I think some of the newer folks are missing this.

I won't get into the past development or what we received when we went from alpha to full release.  Yeah... that sentence says enough on it's own.  This isn't about drama, being melodramatic, or impatient.  This is a response to a very well known track record - while at the same time saying, please do something about this past time that we love.  Truly.

The "stability" is quite questionable and can't really be considered "stable" when you can look up the steam charts and quite easily see where the numbers are consistently dropping.  I get where you are coming from but... the numbers are available for anyone to lookup and you can see the numbers are dropping again from your "stable" 650, to 630, to 620, to... 570?  And thus far... 540?  The numbers say one thing, for PC players, please make this past time we love something we will love in the present to the future.

My two cents...

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And how many of those numbers are just people doing dailies and logging off? That alone counts you as played on that day. I can't imagine that people that log in for dailies is the profit generating target group a company goes for.

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Probably about the same # as 6 months ago. Just guessing though, since I have nothing else to go on. But you're guessing it's higher for some reason. Know something I don't?


@Chappyy quote:

And how many of those numbers are just people doing dailies and logging off? That alone counts you as played on that day. I can't imagine that people that log in for dailies is the profit generating target group a company goes for.


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i don't know how i Still have Hope for this game but one thing i missed the most IS trading... It IS what made private taverne usefull showcasing stuff maiking it a goal and bringed  a lot of interaction between player  discussing about Price and how you got  an item. And so for years noW its Still the same just make dd1 with new Map new graphic and no hacks ...should have been easy Money easy 90% positive on Steam... Problem somebody in the compagny doesnt think it fits f2p model and he's wrong for years noW...

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