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pApA^LeGBa

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Ok lets put it this way  regardless of player base.. Take away onslaught can you do C5 map with current gear and heroes?. Yes then you should be able to clear Floor 15 in about 20 to 30 mins ( not even C5 mob level at floor 15 yet , i don't think assassins even come into play until Floor 20? ) No then you need to go do some lower floors and gear up your heroes or go do c1-4 and get shards for your hero just like everyone did before onslaught.

Onslaught was not meant  to go floor 1 to 65 (55 to 65 is C7 , solo farm c7 level not just got carried to c7 and have no shards) in steady progression you still need gear and shards for at least 4 base heroes ( which takes time ( again the flaw of onslaught and new players ). I believe it was even stated way back when if you can't get a floor done you need to get stronger not put a save feature in as a save feature wont help you beat the floor with no gear.

I think it took me 2 months to get enough shards for 4 heroes and then bought 2 more ev and abyss lord then another month to get shards for them. It takes time and save floor feature won't fix that.

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@uzar quote:

Ok lets put it this way  regardless of player base.. Take away onslaught can you do C5 map with current gear and heroes?. Yes then you should be able to clear Floor 15 in about 20 to 30 mins ( not even C5 mob level at floor 15 yet , i don't think assassins even come into play until Floor 20? ) No then you need to go do some lower floors and gear up your heroes or go do c1-4 and get shards for your hero just like everyone did before onslaught.

Onslaught was not meant  to go floor 1 to 65 (55 to 65 is C7 , solo farm c7 level not just got carried to c7 and have no shards) in steady progression you still need gear and shards for at least 4 base heroes ( which takes time ( again the flaw of onslaught and new players ). I believe it was even stated way back when if you can't get a floor done you need to get stronger not put a save feature in as a save feature wont help you beat the floor with no gear.

I think it took me 2 months to get enough shards for 4 heroes and then bought 2 more ev and abyss lord then another month to get shards for them. It takes time and save floor feature won't fix that.

I'm confused by your argument.  The save feature in no way has to do with gear, it has to do with the time commitment to complete a three map floor.  Even gearing is a joke.  I went from C3 to the end tier of C7 in a week (only about 6-8 hours) before the loot revamp, Mastery, or Onslaught were ever released.

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Again if you don't have the gear to do a c5 map , its going to take you hours , if not ever. Getting the gear putting in the time to develop your heros and understand the defenses , hours turns to 20 mins for the same floor. how does a save feature fix that? You made my point for me , there is no way you got enough shards for all your heroes to use all the defenses.

@gotrunks712 quote:


@uzar quote:

Ok lets put it this way  regardless of player base.. Take away onslaught can you do C5 map with current gear and heroes?. Yes then you should be able to clear Floor 15 in about 20 to 30 mins ( not even C5 mob level at floor 15 yet , i don't think assassins even come into play until Floor 20? ) No then you need to go do some lower floors and gear up your heroes or go do c1-4 and get shards for your hero just like everyone did before onslaught.

Onslaught was not meant  to go floor 1 to 65 (55 to 65 is C7 , solo farm c7 level not just got carried to c7 and have no shards) in steady progression you still need gear and shards for at least 4 base heroes ( which takes time ( again the flaw of onslaught and new players ). I believe it was even stated way back when if you can't get a floor done you need to get stronger not put a save feature in as a save feature wont help you beat the floor with no gear.

I think it took me 2 months to get enough shards for 4 heroes and then bought 2 more ev and abyss lord then another month to get shards for them. It takes time and save floor feature won't fix that.

I'm confused by your argument.  The save feature in no way has to do with gear, it has to do with the time commitment to complete a three map floor.  Even gearing is a joke.  I went from C3 to the end tier of C7 in a week (only about 6-8 hours) before the loot revamp, Mastery, or Onslaught were ever released.


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The argument is: The reason maps are taking too long, and hence the reason for the save is because they are unprepared for that content. 


But maybe it'd be fair to split the discussion around endgame vs early onslaught. Who knows though. I bet if there is something in the works then none of this discussion will weigh in on it. (Guess it'd be in 2.4 which seems close for some reason)

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on ps4, when ur game crashes, u can send a report, with a record of ur last seconds in game. So it shoud be possible for developers to handle with it.

I have only the time for one floor with max one retry at once, so its not the problem with going back to tavern.

The crash yesterday happend when starting build phase in lost temple, no reroll. Last time the game freezes at second retry on lost temple. Last week unplayable laggy for to days (nothing with my wifi connection, 120 mbit working fine at this time, also other games on ps4). Maybe this things happens sometimes, but i had too many failes the last time without my fault, and for that a save option would be very helpfull.

i cannot understand why this is not enough reason to implement that feature.


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Retry is buggy for me on PC. Reroll is safer I think something in the code needs looking at.

Once you have done hours upon hours at > floor 55 I am sure it gets like C7 where you can pretty much slam down the meta and crack on with slight deviations for mutators.

When you haven't done hours upon hours at that level setting up takes longer and adjusting between waves can be needed.

It's not gear or skill based at all the reason a save after each map is a no brainer it is accessibility and the hook to keep people playing as they know they can progress, even in small steps.

Losing your progress through disconnects, bugs or RL time constraints, is still losing progress and we all can agree the feeling of wasted time is not fun, and we play games for fun.

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@uzar quote:

Because with proper gear floor 15 is 20 mins max.Proper gear and understanding removes the time constraint. Mobs at floor 15 have 7 mil Hps , Floor 115 they have 120 mil  proper gear and understanding is everything to remove the time.

@Chappyy quote:

and to what point? If someone doesn't have time to do 3 floors at a low floor what makes you think they can find more time to do it at a higher floor?


again this is you with the 20mins max. not everyone else. also the higher the floors the more it´s likely that you have to do a map more than once. and we are at 2 hours per floor. again, you can make it faster, a lot of others not. or don´t want to stress themselves out while building just to be able to make it in time. It´s no fun at all if you have to play as fast as possible. That´s more like in work then.

and this mechanic is taking away players. every friend of mine, including me stopped due to that.


oh and pls stop comparing wow an MMORPG with a huge world that is not roundbased to a small roundbased tower defense. that´s comparing a car with a horse.


also no, playing chaos trials is not an alternative. onslaught is where the fun would be, with no map beeing the same, due to changing lanes all the time.

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old folks used to say, there is no replacement for displacement.

And there is a saying where I come from. To the short ***, it is the long hairs fault.

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Telling us to go do trials is again ridiculous. Most of us quit the game because we didn't like trials. Onslaught came out and yes contrary to your explanation onslaught is meant to bridge the gap between chaos tiers. it is a slower loot progression that lets you chip away levels and eventually get a better item set that you can then comfortably go into trials. Mostly because of the way loot actually drops. So I came back and tried Onslaught and it is a very nice laid out game and more fun to play right up until I hit 3 maps. 

I don't want to play trials it is a horrible game mode. There is no reason to play it once onslaught came out short of it is a faster path to c7.  And your assumption of how long it should take someone that has never reached AP is way out of reality for the average player. 

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how many onslaught floors are there btw? i see everyone babbling about endgame. but i know there is at least 120 floors. if there is even more than endgame doesn´t start before 100.

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a thx. well then endgame starts around like 200. not at 65. or 100. go and make everything after 150 or 200 how ever you want. but talking about a endgame for everything under 150 is just utter BS

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@pApA^LeGBa quote:

a thx. well then endgame starts around like 200. not at 65. or 100. go and make everything after 150 or 200 how ever you want. but talking about a endgame for everything under 150 is just utter BS

nah end game is after 65. After 65 is how you farm talent cap increasee, the end game activity. Every floor above 65 gives you 1 more point each prestige. 

Also onslaught difficulty scales down with more AP and talent caps you get, so if people can get to 200 before slowing down alot with 140 talent caps (2800 more stats) then at 999 talent caps (19980 more stats) they will fly past it. Im seeing this right now pushing up some floors to increase my talent caps more, the 150s feel as hard as 65-70 did my first floor push

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Crash report in ps4 that is a good point , maybe trendy can let us know if they get that report or if it is just reported to sony.

It may not be your wifi specifically but some where in between you and the game servers did you try another server location?

2nd retry as i stated before and someone else retry is causing some issues.

@ColobelSpike82 quote:

on ps4, when ur game crashes, u can send a report, with a record of ur last seconds in game. So it should be possible for developers to handle with it.

I have only the time for one floor with max one retry at once, so its not the problem with going back to tavern.

The crash yesterday happend when starting build phase in lost temple, no reroll. Last time the game freezes at second retry on lost temple. Last week unplayable laggy for to days (nothing with my wifi connection, 120 mbit working fine at this time, also other games on ps4). Maybe this things happens sometimes, but i had too many failes the last time without my fault, and for that a save option would be very helpfull.

i cannot understand why this is not enough reason to implement that feature.



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@pApA^LeGBa quote:

a thx. well then endgame starts around like 200. not at 65. or 100. go and make everything after 150 or 200 how ever you want. but talking about a endgame for everything under 150 is just utter BS

Well I agree with Toro here. Fundamentally and currently, endgame is post-C7/Floor 65 and beyond plus AP (Ancient Power).

And....to surface casuals, Post-campaign might just be endgame to them.

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there is 250 levels. and you say 65 starts the endgame? wow. a little math here: 250:65 = 3,85. So Level 65 is just a bit over a quarter of the whole levels. How in the world is this endgame?


level 150 ok. still a bit early but meh, can live with that.

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Depends on your goals.

Campaign easy - endgame

Campaign hard - end game

C1-C7 -endgame ( no better gear )

C1-C7 + Incursions - endgame

C1-C7 + incursions + Mastery - Endgame

Onslaught 1-65 ( c7 no better Gear ) Endgame

Onslaught 92, 114 extra flair - endgame

Onslaught to infinity and beyond with no AP - endgame

AP resets pick a number after 250 asc and floor 65 - endgame

Max AP , Max Talent Caps - endgame

Max Ascension with or without AP - endgame


You pick what your end game is

@pApA^LeGBa quote:

there is 250 levels. and you say 65 starts the endgame? wow. a little math here: 250:65 = 3,85. So Level 65 is just a bit over a quarter of the whole levels. How in the world is this endgame?


level 150 ok. still a bit early but meh, can live with that.


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@pApA^LeGBa quote:

there is 250 levels. and you say 65 starts the endgame? wow. a little math here: 250:65 = 3,85. So Level 65 is just a bit over a quarter of the whole levels. How in the world is this endgame?


level 150 ok. still a bit early but meh, can live with that.

There is no floor limit.  Only hardware, sanity, or stat-scaling will limit you from pushing further.  Gear drops max out at floor 65. Thus, the beginning of the end-game where only skill and ascension talent caps are supposed to get you further.  There are certain floors where the difficulty increases based on mutator and schedules allowed, and I believe by floor 114 its as hard as it is going to get in terms of combinations.  But stats will continue to increase every floor until you can't take it anymore.

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Man, you got 2 options to progress. Either beat 15 or beat c5. It sounds like you want to play the slow route, but it takes too long. You gotta learn something to progress. Either learn to play faster, or learn to beat c5. I'm not telling you this, the game is.

If you spent all the time you spend complaining on the forums trying to figure out the game, you'd be a lot further ahead. 

@Chappyy quote:

Telling us to go do trials is again ridiculous. Most of us quit the game because we didn't like trials. Onslaught came out and yes contrary to your explanation onslaught is meant to bridge the gap between chaos tiers. it is a slower loot progression that lets you chip away levels and eventually get a better item set that you can then comfortably go into trials. Mostly because of the way loot actually drops. So I came back and tried Onslaught and it is a very nice laid out game and more fun to play right up until I hit 3 maps. 

I don't want to play trials it is a horrible game mode. There is no reason to play it once onslaught came out short of it is a faster path to c7.  And your assumption of how long it should take someone that has never reached AP is way out of reality for the average player. 


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@pApA^LeGBa quote:

there is 250 levels. and you say 65 starts the endgame? wow. a little math here: 250:65 = 3,85. So Level 65 is just a bit over a quarter of the whole levels. How in the world is this endgame?


level 150 ok. still a bit early but meh, can live with that.

Theres not 250 levels. This is what you are not understanding,

The highest person reset again at 250 he could have gone to 251, if he had the stats he  could have gone to 400 or 900 etc

Its a treadmill with less the 1% difficulty increase each time. Its also just doing the same small subset of levels over and over. Its supposed to be used in conjunction with the AP system so the more AP you get the higher theoretical floor you can get to.

But really the last reward currently in game is at foor 114, and the only reason to go higher then that is talent cap and starting acension increase for AP resets. Onslaught floor is only half of the end game system.

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Dude, you have no idea what you're talking about. There are infinite onslaught levels. 

We should disregard all your opinions about the endgame because you have no clue


I'll include the other main endgame leaderboard: https://leaderboard.dungeondefenders2.com/ap.html

@pApA^LeGBa quote:

there is 250 levels. and you say 65 starts the endgame? wow. a little math here: 250:65 = 3,85. So Level 65 is just a bit over a quarter of the whole levels. How in the world is this endgame?


level 150 ok. still a bit early but meh, can live with that.


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@BeerGoggles quote:

Dude, you have no idea what you're talking about. There are infinite onslaught levels. 

We should disregard all your opinions about the endgame because you have no clue


I'll include the other main endgame leaderboard: https://leaderboard.dungeondefenders2.com/ap.html

@pApA^LeGBa quote:

there is 250 levels. and you say 65 starts the endgame? wow. a little math here: 250:65 = 3,85. So Level 65 is just a bit over a quarter of the whole levels. How in the world is this endgame?


level 150 ok. still a bit early but meh, can live with that.


i just saw that. makes it even worse that 65 is already considered endgame.

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