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Murdash

What the game looks like for a newcomer?

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I've stopped playing on pc because of the slow progression back then.  I've just started playing on xbox and I have to say the onslaught progression is just fine, up to floor 7 it's medium difficulty high reward and I've started enjoying the game after all that waiting. 

Then I got to floor 8 where everything broke again.

1. There is still no tower balance, not even close

As most new players would do, I've started trying out all the defenses on the private tavern, trying to figure out what I should stick to since at the start I'm not limited by special enemies. Without shards, only a medallion I've tried out all of the defenses the 4 basic heroes can provide and the results are obvious: aoe is king, single target is useless. The best aoe without shards is flame totem since it cant be destroyed, has a decent range and I had 5k dps with it. The best single target dps tower was the cannonball because it had 12k dps. Now i think its kinda obvious that a tower with 5k aoe dps that cant be destroyed easily beats a single target tower that has 2x dps but half the range and is destroyed in a second by any aoe that is targeted on the wall.

2. We are still extremely limited in towers once special enemies kick in

Once the newbie gets to floor 8 he is facing Cyborks, the dear flame aura is useless, back to single targets. 

that means: 40k dps->12k dps  100% range->70% range 0 maintenance ->constant maintenance 

The gameplay goes into a horrible unenjoyable repairfeast at this point where the towers are clearly too weak against the mobs that drop the exact same medallions they use. After getting used to the variety we have 2 choices basicly: Flamethrowers that has to be placed in front of the walls because they have no range to kill the ranged mobs otherwise or pdts, which lack the range so they may still die from a stomp or whatever.

3. Bugs, tons of them.

All I did was play the game through the campaign and then advance to floor 8 in onslaught. 

In that time I lost about 5 matches because the wall wasnt holding aggro, about 6 matches where a Malthius simply spawned a skeleton behind the wall straight to a crystal, about 10 because my angry nimbus simply stopped working.

All of these bugs were around nearly a year ago when i stopped playing the game on pc.

4. Shard rng

The newbie is at floor 8 thinking 'hmm, maybe I need better shards to progress further'. The easiest possible way to get past the cyborks is getting a range shard that will somewhat increase the efficiency of the terrible towers we can choose from. I did about 20 chaos 3 matches, got 40 shards. Out of those 40 shards about 8 was for the starting heroes (not a single deadly strikes, its not a miracle). It takes 20 minutes to get a chance at one chaos 3 shard and about half of the drop table is for heroes the newbie doesnt even own. Farming that one shard would be bad enough in this rate if we couldnt get shards for heroes we dont even have but this way its pure nightmare, again not enjoyable for a starter.

5. Win streak bonus is like its not even here

In those 20 runs I only got 1 shard as a bonus. This system is pure garbage. One run takes 20 minutes for a newbie with building, this way it takes 60 minutes just to be able to activate the system. Thanks to the above mentioned bugs it is nearly impossible to get 3 or 4 succesful runs in a row. Even If we didnt have any bugs, do you expect a newbie to stay entertained by farming one game mode for more than an hour without a 10 minute break? If I go to make a sandwich by the times I'm back I'm disconnected and my win streak is reset to 0, this is terrible.

6. Onslaught monster buffs

Imagine a newbie advancing through floor 7 with barely enough knowledge of the game and a half decent leveling gear. Not that scary. Someone had the nice idea to make an enemy modifier that heals the monsters on that row when they deal dmg, this might be a fun modifier for a end game player but do you expect newcomers to kill a boss before it could take 10 steps to the barricade? I think my boss had like 6 mill dmg, I had about 100k dps back then. It's impossible to kill before and after it reaches the barricade since it heals for about 20% a second.

7. I'm sure the other players could write many more problems, as they did already in other topics.


In the end I'm not surprised when I look at the player count of the game, the dev is not changing, they still do not listen to the community, they still do not spend enough time fixing game breaking bugs. They had a great idea of a game, they have a great community that's full of neverending ideas and solutions for the problems yet the developers do nothing. It's sad how a great game like this can go down because of ignorance.


Yep, I'm just another whining noob, you can start flaming if you wish, this is my opinion and probably most of the new players too (thats why there arent many).

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Problem is your trying to beat game to quick you have to grind some or grind alot in some cases / people like Juicebags and other top players have put thousands of hours into the game alot of grinding 

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@playertt quote:

Problem is your trying to beat game to quick you have to grind some or grind alot in some cases / people like Juicebags and other top players have put thousands of hours into the game alot of grinding 

I don't think "thousands of hours" of grinding is a selling point for this game, which i wager is the point of the post. If you cater your game only to the diehards, you will lose a lot of gamers, and revenue. The difficulty should natural upscale with the progression model. [[142711,users]] makes a great point that large upscales in difficulty without the coinciding shard drops to help, makes the game very difficult and that will drive people away. Don't get me wrong, i love to grind in games, but it still needs to be fun. and towers need to work they way they are supposed to. If you introduce a new enemy on 1 floor, then the floor before it should have the relic you need to combat that, and with a decent drop rate. Instead of focusing on strategy and using your brain to defeat waves, it instead becomes mindless grinding for lucky drop rates on those few shards you desperately need. The later waves of Onslaught are too dependent on a few specific shards that do not drop prolifically as you need them. It makes a gamer sort of ultimatum - grind or quit. While i may grind, many may quit. Quitting gamers do not keep TE and DD2 alive. 

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A couple of things:

1)  Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  I'm not surprised that you can't get further than what you already have.  You already mentioned that you don't have the proper shards.  Based on that, I'm assuming you aren't geared enough and don't have many ascension levels.  You also don't have the experience to deal with some of the harder mobs and how to adjust your strategies to compensate.

2)  My recommendation for any new players is to grind through the Chaos levels first.  Here you will gain ascension, gear, and learn the challenges of the different types of enemies.  This will also allow you to focus on those chaos levels where the more powerful shards drop, giving you a better chance of getting what you need.  If you want to test yourself from time to time on Onslaught just to see how far you are going, then fine, but you are going to have a difficult time of it.

Again, Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  It's far from perfect and has some issues with it that need to be addressed, but it's not supposed to be easy, especially for someone new.


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@Rentard quote:

A couple of things:

1)  Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  I'm not surprised that you can't get further than what you already have.  You already mentioned that you don't have the proper shards.  Based on that, I'm assuming you aren't geared enough and don't have many ascension levels.  You also don't have the experience to deal with some of the harder mobs and how to adjust your strategies to compensate.

2)  My recommendation for any new players is to grind through the Chaos levels first.  Here you will gain ascension, gear, and learn the challenges of the different types of enemies.  This will also allow you to focus on those chaos levels where the more powerful shards drop, giving you a better chance of getting what you need.  If you want to test yourself from time to time on Onslaught just to see how far you are going, then fine, but you are going to have a difficult time of it.

Again, Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  It's far from perfect and has some issues with it that need to be addressed, but it's not supposed to be easy, especially for someone new.


I have played this game for a year back then, I just started anew on xbox now and I believe this is how the game looks from a beginners perspective. I believe onslaught is actually faster, at least farming chaos back then was much slower than onslaught progression is now. But well, thanks to that faster gearing there is absolutely no way to get the shards by the time they are needed. (not that we can get range shards before clearing cyborks in chaos 2 anyway). Back then I've grinded a lot and got everything I needed so that wouldnt be too big a problem now. 

For the last month back then I really didnt enjoy the game, I was hoping they would listen to all the suggestions about gearing, ipwr, fixing things, balance etc but nothing happened. Now when I started anew, played through onslaught till floor 8 I actually enjoyed the game after such a long time. After I figured out how fun the Angry Nimbus is I actually played through 4 maps without stopping for a second, I felt like okay, this actually became a pretty fun game. Then it got bugged 3 times in a row losing me 3 matches. Then I went to check if it was reported, and it was. On 2017 july 19, nearly half a year ago. The developers havent changed at all, this is still a game where the voice of the community doesnt matter, where gamebreaking bugs like the Nimbus or Malthius' spawns can stay bugged for years, where people who got to asc level 2000 get basicly nothing more than those who just got to 250 and floor 65 when ascending, spitting the fans in the face.


There doesnt seem to be light in the tunnel's end.


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@Rentard quote:

A couple of things:

1)  Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  I'm not surprised that you can't get further than what you already have.  You already mentioned that you don't have the proper shards.  Based on that, I'm assuming you aren't geared enough and don't have many ascension levels.  You also don't have the experience to deal with some of the harder mobs and how to adjust your strategies to compensate.

2)  My recommendation for any new players is to grind through the Chaos levels first.  Here you will gain ascension, gear, and learn the challenges of the different types of enemies.  This will also allow you to focus on those chaos levels where the more powerful shards drop, giving you a better chance of getting what you need.  If you want to test yourself from time to time on Onslaught just to see how far you are going, then fine, but you are going to have a difficult time of it.

Again, Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  It's far from perfect and has some issues with it that need to be addressed, but it's not supposed to be easy, especially for someone new.


So-so. On the devs streams it was said by not just Lawlta that onslaught is a potential progression path. Players could chose to do only it, only trials, or a mix of both. Later on when you've gotten to the floors that surpass trials it becomes the end-game content where you don't really "progress" anymore and instead just push floors. If Trendy wants this to be true then a ton of work needs to be done to smooth out the experience, addressing concerns like the OP brings up.

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@Rentard quote:

A couple of things:

1)  Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  I'm not surprised that you can't get further than what you already have.  You already mentioned that you don't have the proper shards.  Based on that, I'm assuming you aren't geared enough and don't have many ascension levels.  You also don't have the experience to deal with some of the harder mobs and how to adjust your strategies to compensate.

2)  My recommendation for any new players is to grind through the Chaos levels first.  Here you will gain ascension, gear, and learn the challenges of the different types of enemies.  This will also allow you to focus on those chaos levels where the more powerful shards drop, giving you a better chance of getting what you need.  If you want to test yourself from time to time on Onslaught just to see how far you are going, then fine, but you are going to have a difficult time of it.

Again, Onslaught is meant to be end-game content.  It's far from perfect and has some issues with it that need to be addressed, but it's not supposed to be easy, especially for someone new.


I don't think the fact that Onslaught is end-game content is in question. The issue here is that by playing the game naturally through - does it provide what you need, and when you need it. Even with some grinding. Issue presented here is that around floor 7 the difficulty scales beyond what has been provided up to that point in a way not friendly to new players, and even returning players. If i have played every stage all the way up through floor 7, i should be somewhat prepared to tackle the next one. Maybe not beat it, but i shouldn't get my butt handled to me right off either. Each floor should be progressively harder then the last, but still doable on some level. Especially when we need to get to at least 65 floors, so the scaling needs to be on a level where i can keep advancing. If i have to put in weeks of play just to move up 1 floor, that is ridiculous. The argument is simply that there is uneven progression in the end-game content, which is very frustrating. That, and the game still has many bugs that limit enjoyment of trying to tackle such hard challenges. 

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Exactly, the problem is that many features in the game are lacking and badly implemented and even if we ignore them the game is just a bugged piece of junk in most cases. And they are not working on fixing the bugs at all. Malthius has been spawning skeletons behind walls since it was implemented, lady orks have been ignoring walls since c4 was put in and I'm sure you can name other bugs that were never fixed. The only solution is to not use the bugged stuff anymore which is terribly disappointing considering that this isn't a ***ty private server running from someone's garage.. It just has the exact same attitude.. Put in new things so some players may stay, never fix the existing ones cuz it takes time.

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