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russman

Drops missing key stats

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I couldn't find a discussion on this using google (I can't get the forum search to work) but I'm guessing it's already been discussed over the years.  I'm not sure where the CDT and current community members stand on it.  I really like this game and the randomness of things like the core 10 stats where you randomly get 8 of the 10 on a weapon/armor.  But over the past couple of weeks I've run into a couple of head scratchers and would like a little insight.

1. Armor missing a resists.  I kind of understand this being a thing in the early game but I can't really speak to that.  But I don't really understand it happening on Supreme pieces.  Quite a few nice DPS pieces have dropped on Moonbase that are useless because of a missing resists. It's not like the resists lost out to some other stat.  It's just missing.  The only purpose seems to be to make good items slightly more rare.  Thoughts? Strangely I don't remember ever seeing a missing resists on Ultimate or above.  Is that intentional?

2. Staff weapons missing the additional projectiles.  I got a great 53K bone staff last night except it was missing the additional projectiles stat.  Is the only purpose to make good items a little more rare?  

In my opinion, it seems like we get trolled enough with missing or negative key stats (hero/tower stats) without these additional oddities.

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Was it intentional?  Probably so in order to keep in line with many things being random.  Although when the game was first created they didnt have myth, sup and ults from what I understand.  So it may have not been planned that far out when looking at the resists.

Can some things be changed?  Of course, but that is up for the community to decide.  However with something like changing how armor spawns, you may have a hard time gaining a consensus.  Forcing an item to always spawn with extra projectiles might be an easier sell.

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Gonna through my etherial hat into the ring and say that this is not a thing i will never be behind.  There are lots of items that spawn with projectiles on items at all times. All marrago staffs and other staffs that are map specific core drops have the projectile thing to my knowledge due to them being considered a core item so they follow similar rules to a core drop besides a stats boost. 

In terms of armour if you want 4 res on every item run lab not moonbase.

As mayham put it is RNG the game could have item like in DD2... should be happy we don't have that.

(Also on the marrago staffs to declare bias i have around 1.2 mill survival kills and have farmed 3 60k bloods. Along with a 450^ blood without proj and a 423^ without proj. Yet i am still not in favor of changing items.)

please leave old item and item spawns alone and focus on new items. Maybe on the new dessert map in patch 4 it drops marrago staffs also on survival with no missing proj but is harder.....

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Seeing my hundreds (or more like thousands) of labruns backwards i dropped few ult++ armors out of the lab- 2 of them where dps AND had only 2-3 resistances. Such trolls happen to everyone, I personally dont think this has to be changed. 

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Sounds like a case of "too lazy to farm" to put it bluntly.
RNG has been like this since ages. No point in changing it "now".
Don't like floor drops? Farm some other map. Better yet, trade for it.
People like me and others have farmed a map 100s of times to get 1 usable item.
That's the whole point of this game. A core mechanic, better keep away from such changes.

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@Black Mamba quote:

Sounds like a case of "too lazy to farm" to put it bluntly.

Right to the insults again.  Nice.  And you wonder why many people on the forums think you're a d.o.u.c.h.e.  Hahahaha.  Too funny.

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To the rest of you who are against this change:  Can we first agree that the end result of the changes would boil down to higher quality loot in less farming time?  If you say "yes" to that then please keep reading.

Where do you stand on these fixes then:

1. Unsticking stuck mobs

2. Loot quality filter and highlighted beams

At the end of the day, those changes both just boil down to higher quality loot in less farming time.  If you are against my idea and these two, then at least you are consistent.  If you are against mine but for one or both of these, please explain.

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I think that ult+ and ult++ should always have all the 4 resists. Travence  has a point on this, these items are pretty rare and it's a shame that there is often a missing resist, but it should be applied only on the ult+/++ not below.

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Missing resists are a natural consequence of how the items in DD are generated.  The higher the quality of the item, the less likely you'll have a missing resist.  That means that resists are least likely to be missing on armor from end-of-map rewards on maps like Moonbase, Lab Assault, and Tinkerer's Lab, and relatively unlikely to be missing on armor from survival chests.  They're more likely to be missing on survival armor that drops on the ground.

It would be easy to change this behavior if the community wants it.  But in the past, when people brought up changing RNG for ult++ items, it was shot down by community members who didn't want it to happen, and I don't think we'll see consensus on this one either.

I think we should just leave the RNG alone, personally.

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@russman quote:

To the rest of you who are against this change:  Can we first agree that the end result of the changes would boil down to higher quality loot in less farming time?  If you say "yes" to that then please keep reading.

Where do you stand on these fixes then:

1. Unsticking stuck mobs

2. Loot quality filter and highlighted beams

At the end of the day, those changes both just boil down to higher quality loot in less farming time.  If you are against my idea and these two, then at least you are consistent.  If you are against mine but for one or both of these, please explain.

Stuck mobs are a bug and should be fixed if possible. Loot filter is already in the game and is just a QoL improvement, I farmed most of my stuff before it was added and never had any problem finding stuff. Random drops are not going to be good every time but that is not a bug nor does it need "fixing".

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There's a difference between the loot generation system, an ai hiccup (stuck enemies) and the loot quality filter.

The loot generation system has always been like this, and is just a natural occurence as Plane mentioned due to the quality.

Stuck enemies is a fault in the game itself, as enemies shouldn't be getting stuck in the first place. While fixing this may speed up farming, it wasn't intended to be a part of this game as far as I know.

The loot quality filter is a quality of life change that doesn't even affect the speed you farm at. Anyone can pick up an armour piece at the end of a survival wave before the build phase hits, nothing is stopping you from doing that. The filter just makes it easier to spot what you're looking for, so you can get BACK to doing the survival and farming again.


TL;DR, loot generation =/= bug or a QOL change like the other 2 points; it would be affecting the grinding aspect of the game itself, which as a grinding game may not be such a good idea after so long.


Personally, I wouldn't mind the changes if it happened to staves and ult+/++ only, but I wouldn't support it outright.

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@Travence ツ quote:

I Dropped couple of Ult And even ult+ Pieces which didnt Had all 4 resists which made them not useable so i Sold literally all of them.

It's just an unfortunate thing when it comes to survival drops. they have FAR worse quality than end game camp rewards. which is the main reason why missing stats are so rare on armor in those places unless they roll blessed unfortunately in places like lab etc. It's been like this since the old days, it's only really become noticeable on armor again cause moonbase made survival armor popular again. Before lab was the defacto place to go for armor.

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