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This game lacks rare loot and long-term content such as the Diamond pet in DD1.

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For a looting game, DD2 is seriously lacking some long-term content and ultra-rare loot. The devs mentioned that there is rare loot, but personally, I haven't seen any. If I have, it either didn't stand out enough or it wasn't of any use to me. Honestly, long-term content like the diamond pet in DD1 would change everything. I know I'd play a lot more. I know my friends would as well. I'd grind my life into this game. While I'm sure Trendy has things planned in mind, I don't think it should come months or years down the dev roadmap. Little things like the diamond pet and a coal-dropping map shouldn't take that long to develop, I'd imagine. Maybe even the Yeti map should've had that. It should come now because players want more incentive to farm now. We love this game, and we want to do fun things while you work on new content. All of the easy-to-get stuff can come later. We have enough of it now.

Diamond Pet context:

In DD1, you could farm a map known as Winter Wonderland to get coal. After gathering 88 coal pieces which would take days or weeks of farming, you could exchange it for a diamond pet. Diamond pets could be seen as builder pets because they had super high stats and were practically stat sticks, and no diamond pet was the same in appearance. Diamonds spawned in different shapes, sizes, and colors. It made the game feel so dynamic, and when you got a cool sky-blue or aqua diamond, it'd make you flutter because it was special and rare, on top of already taking a lot of time to get. And that made you want to farm more and play the game even more. In combination with pet trading, it made it that much better.

While I'm aware that you can farm for defender medals to buy pets like Betsy, that just isn't what I had in mind. The pets aren't dynamic in any way, and they lack rare traits. Plus they suck, and I don't think the pet revamp will appropriately address that issue, either. And never underestimate the powers of pet trading and coal-like currency trading.

The current state of the game:

I've nagged on the forums for years now. But unfortunately, at the moment, it seems like Trendy wants to avoid adding in aforementioned content and even pet or gear trading because they don't want to have to deal the tedious issue of balancing the game. To me, it seems like Trendy has no plans for ANYTHING that could potentially even hinder the balance of the game slightly, perhaps because it could lose them revenue or make things "messy". That's why 90% of the shards suck right now, and that's why 90% of the incursion weapons suck. But honestly, I feel like focusing on balance so much results in an unbalanced mess in and of itself. I personally, and many others, want higher item tiers -- ultra rare items like that don't drop every game, but every 20 games. Crazy, dynamic pets that take weeks to get and don't ever look like any other player's pet. Pets you can get from being a top 10 player on the leaderboard. Contrary to popular belief, such content does not have to ruin it for the casual players. The casual players can play the game casually and play campaign mode over and over for all they want, but let us hardcore players farm endgame boss maps with epic gear that takes months to get. We want items that would make your cannonball towers shoot like a mini-gun. Remove the speed cap and critical chance cap off of items. If you feel that's too OP, focus on the items then. Not the cap. The cap already makes things some confusing as it is.

Also, in reality, ignoring a wound and infection doesn't make it go away. And something that stays infected for too long will eventually die, which I mean to use as a metaphor for this game. And I speak as a maxed out C7 player who's been around forever in both games. I personally have no incentive to farm for anything on DD2 anymore aside from ascenion levels. And ascenion levels are just dull and arbitrary. Please share your thoughts.

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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Unique pets that mean something and add value, special weapons that can out-dps a blue bow with 4s shots and upgrades levels that make weapons and armor mean something again. I have said it a million times as well, we want to keep playing this game but we need something to chase after and farm, which we don't have at all right now. 

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The loot in this game is very bland. I would like there to be pieces of armor that dropped "ultra rare" of course- that had special passives that made them truly unique. I would also like more variety among the weapons. I would like to see some usage for water damage and earth damage weapons.

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Indeed. I'm ok with this game being easy, as long as i have reasons to farm or pursue something. But atm we have nothing. Despite the rng, useful shards are too easy to obtain, legendary items far too common, and randomized stats on items don't matter that much.

I know most people will disagree with me, but we need more random in this game.

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@enigma007 quote:

Indeed. I'm ok with this game being easy, as long as i have reasons to farm or pursue something. But atm we have nothing. Despite the rng, useful shards are too easy to obtain, legendary items far too common, and randomized stats on items don't matter that much.

I know most people will disagree with me, but we need more random in this game.

I'd love to see the Jester hero return.

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@enigma007 quote:

I know most people will disagree with me, but we need more random in this game.

Actually a lot of people miss the hardcore grind from DD1.  Look at games like Diablo 3 which have been supporting hardcore grinders for many years now so it's clear this type of game play is popular. The challenge is that DD2 needs to give both casual and hardcore players a rewarding experience.  

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I was just thinking about this earlier today. Implementing features that made DD1 so much fun would bring DD2 out of the monotony it's currently in. Features such as:

  • What op said.
  • Soft caps on gear and defense stat values (as well as ascension skills) as opposed to the hard caps currently in place.
  • Unique map rewards worth farming for.
  • A Survival mode that actually rewards players with gradually better gear drops and exp each wave as well as a pet after a certain wave is completed.
  • Pets with passive abilities.
  • Freedom to choose any map (and incursion) on any difficulty.
  • Trading (even if it were as limited as Diablo 3's).

Until Trials, we had a few of these features in the game:

  • Forest Biome had the same concept as farming coal for Diamonds. It wasn't for pets but it gave us unique weapons to farm toward.
  • Different maps had unique rewards worth farming for like the Storm set.
  • Survival mode, albeit faulty with the gear drops and exp, rewarded us with golden pets.
  • The freedom to choose any map and incursion we wanted on any difficulty.

I'm not sure why these features were removed but if we had them back, the game would be a lot more enjoyable. We need features that make the game more dynamic like it was before Trials. New heroes and incursions are great and all but being limited to the same static content greatly diminishes their value. This type of content can be added after the dynamic, game-changing content already exists in the game.

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I think all of the following would increase player retention rates massively:

  • Trading of everything with no limits, like in DD1.
  • Return of dynamic diamond pets and perhaps other types of dynamic pets that vary in color.
  • More ultra-rare stuff that glows, which includes player titles for being a top leaderboard player. Everyone would love glowing titles and farm like hell to get on the top of the leaderboard, trust me. These small things do make a large impact.
  • More ultra-rare stuff that exceeds the current hard cap and lets you wreck maps and shoot your harpoons like crazy. I bet Trendy's idea of that will be some 5-10 second temporary buff to your defense.  Again, not what I had in mind!

Stop focusing on loot progression so much. Focus purely on endgame, and not the road to get there. Everything else is irrelevant and can be seen as "training". If someone wants to skip training, let them. Look at RuneScape as well. It's a looting MMO that has been around for 15 years, and hundreds of thousands of players still play it every day. You could play daily for a decade and still not max out. There is massive room for both casual players and hardcore competitive players. And it's been successful for that long because of ultra-rare items and trading. There are items with drop rates of 1 / 5,000. You could go weeks without ever seeing such a rare item, but if you ever got it, you could make bank for your character. And even sell it in real life for $3,000, NOT that you should or that I'm supportive of that. But if bots infest this game, that means there IS a game, and that the player community is large enough to handle it; otherwise, no one would spend that much. It's what we all want.

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Although I agree with you in principle, farming in DD1 got to be a bit too much for most players.

I remember farming for that chainsaw weapon for an entire week. Probably had around 100 completions and not one good saw to show for it. The RNG in that game was horrible, and extremely unrewarding. (I even had a controller mod, farming 4 at once. It was absolutely ridiculous.) Also, coal farming got extremely time consuming, I am all for giving the dedicated playing something to strive for, but you can go to far on that aspect as well.

With that, I think DD2 may have gone a little bit to far in the opposite direction. I would like to see something in between what we have now, and what we had in DD1.

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Remember diamond pets didn't come out immediately in DD1. So where DD2 is now, compared to where DD1 was when they came out aren't the same, but I'm confident that you'll see some longer term goals and such when we are.

You'll be pleased (we hope) with what we're cooking right now.

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@Dani quote:

Remember diamond pets didn't come out immediately in DD1. So where DD2 is now, compared to where DD1 was when they came out aren't the same, but I'm confident that you'll see some longer term goals and such when we are.

You'll be pleased (we hope) with what we're cooking right now.

Yes, that is very true. However, DD1 launched in late 2010. You guys should have learned a GREAT deal of what people liked playing and what made them keep coming back. DD2 has absolutely zero resemblance of any long term end-game content or exciting rare loot.

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@WavingHat quote:


@Dani quote:

Remember diamond pets didn't come out immediately in DD1. So where DD2 is now, compared to where DD1 was when they came out aren't the same, but I'm confident that you'll see some longer term goals and such when we are.

You'll be pleased (we hope) with what we're cooking right now.

Yes, that is very true. However, DD1 launched in late 2010. You guys should have learned a GREAT deal of what people liked playing and what made them keep coming back. DD2 has absolutely zero resemblance of any long term end-game content or exciting rare loot.

Well, I think they wanted to go a different way. And I think they wanted new players to come too, not just the old players. Which is fine by me.

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continue responding like this... you'll get extra love from the community Emoji_WarBoar.png

@Dani quote:

Remember diamond pets didn't come out immediately in DD1. So where DD2 is now, compared to where DD1 was when they came out aren't the same, but I'm confident that you'll see some longer term goals and such when we are.

You'll be pleased (we hope) with what we're cooking right now.


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@Dani quote:

You'll be pleased (we hope) with what we're cooking right now.

I hope whatever you have planned is coming soon and by soon, I mean before year's end. It would be rather disappointing if the only remaining content we get this year are gender swap heroes.

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Grinding 88 coal on Winter Wonderland or Silent Night was a challenge, whether it was fun depends on whether you did it with like minded or geared people or tried in public.

Then again to get lvl 100 you did need to play a bit and even decent mythical gear could give you fairly decent stats, and mythicals dropped like confetti.

I liked challenges and eternia shard maps more you got your cube or you got access to CD and it didn't take forever.

So having the set of eternia shard maps re skinned and then the CD run would be very welcome.

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I agree. I've been wanting a reason to continue playing the xbox one version. I've reached chaos 6 and could complete it but I see no reason to continue since there aren't really any unique weapons or armor that I could farm. I miss the grinding from DD1

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@super_slayan quote:

I agree. I've been wanting a reason to continue playing the xbox one version. I've reached chaos 6 and could complete it but I see no reason to continue since there aren't really any unique weapons or armor that I could farm. I miss the grinding from DD1

Same boat i was in. I stopped once i beat C7 once but have recently come back to max a few DPS heroes and max all my builders gear while farming medals/dailies. 

My advice would be to do those things and then wait patiently. I was skeptical at first of the direction this game was heading, but the Dev's have turned me around and i now believe the end-game is going to make the C1-7 grind worth it and do justice to DD1. What made the game more interesting for my was testing out all of the different DPS heroes. Different towers and builds is cool for a bit, but playing as a new DPS makes it feel like a different game altogether. Give that a try and wait for onslaught and the new mystery end-game that is hopefully coming soon. 

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@Derek564 quote:


@super_slayan quote:

I agree. I've been wanting a reason to continue playing the xbox one version. I've reached chaos 6 and could complete it but I see no reason to continue since there aren't really any unique weapons or armor that I could farm. I miss the grinding from DD1

Same boat i was in. I stopped once i beat C7 once but have recently come back to max a few DPS heroes and max all my builders gear while farming medals/dailies. 

My advice would be to do those things and then wait patiently. I was skeptical at first of the direction this game was heading, but the Dev's have turned me around and i now believe the end-game is going to make the C1-7 grind worth it and do justice to DD1. What made the game more interesting for my was testing out all of the different DPS heroes. Different towers and builds is cool for a bit, but playing as a new DPS makes it feel like a different game altogether. Give that a try and wait for onslaught and the new mystery end-game that is hopefully coming soon. 

the mystery end game is going to be like onslaught.

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Trendy already has Onslaught created and they have indicated that this new game mode is something completely different. 

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@super_slayan quote:


@Derek564 quote:


@super_slayan quote:

I agree. I've been wanting a reason to continue playing the xbox one version. I've reached chaos 6 and could complete it but I see no reason to continue since there aren't really any unique weapons or armor that I could farm. I miss the grinding from DD1

Same boat i was in. I stopped once i beat C7 once but have recently come back to max a few DPS heroes and max all my builders gear while farming medals/dailies. 

My advice would be to do those things and then wait patiently. I was skeptical at first of the direction this game was heading, but the Dev's have turned me around and i now believe the end-game is going to make the C1-7 grind worth it and do justice to DD1. What made the game more interesting for my was testing out all of the different DPS heroes. Different towers and builds is cool for a bit, but playing as a new DPS makes it feel like a different game altogether. Give that a try and wait for onslaught and the new mystery end-game that is hopefully coming soon. 

the mystery end game is going to be like onslaught.

How's it gonna be like Onslaught? As the Devs did say that Onslaught will not be the Endgame.

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They never said that as far as I know. It should be endgame mode....

@Paloverde zfogshooterz quote:


@super_slayan quote:


@Derek564 quote:


@super_slayan quote:

I agree. I've been wanting a reason to continue playing the xbox one version. I've reached chaos 6 and could complete it but I see no reason to continue since there aren't really any unique weapons or armor that I could farm. I miss the grinding from DD1

Same boat i was in. I stopped once i beat C7 once but have recently come back to max a few DPS heroes and max all my builders gear while farming medals/dailies. 

My advice would be to do those things and then wait patiently. I was skeptical at first of the direction this game was heading, but the Dev's have turned me around and i now believe the end-game is going to make the C1-7 grind worth it and do justice to DD1. What made the game more interesting for my was testing out all of the different DPS heroes. Different towers and builds is cool for a bit, but playing as a new DPS makes it feel like a different game altogether. Give that a try and wait for onslaught and the new mystery end-game that is hopefully coming soon. 

the mystery end game is going to be like onslaught.

How's it gonna be like Onslaught? As the Devs did say that Onslaught will not be the Endgame.


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@MamaTata quote:

They never said that as far as I know. It should be endgame mode....

@Paloverde zfogshooterz quote:


@super_slayan quote:


@Derek564 quote:


@super_slayan quote:

I agree. I've been wanting a reason to continue playing the xbox one version. I've reached chaos 6 and could complete it but I see no reason to continue since there aren't really any unique weapons or armor that I could farm. I miss the grinding from DD1

Same boat i was in. I stopped once i beat C7 once but have recently come back to max a few DPS heroes and max all my builders gear while farming medals/dailies. 

My advice would be to do those things and then wait patiently. I was skeptical at first of the direction this game was heading, but the Dev's have turned me around and i now believe the end-game is going to make the C1-7 grind worth it and do justice to DD1. What made the game more interesting for my was testing out all of the different DPS heroes. Different towers and builds is cool for a bit, but playing as a new DPS makes it feel like a different game altogether. Give that a try and wait for onslaught and the new mystery end-game that is hopefully coming soon. 

the mystery end game is going to be like onslaught.

How's it gonna be like Onslaught? As the Devs did say that Onslaught will not be the Endgame.


Whoops! I might have exaggerated or phrased it wrongly. (sorry, having a cold, can't think straight.) They said it isn't just one defining game mode but multiple things to do. 

Check this out if you want to make sure : https://dungeondefenders.com/2/topic/147609/kinda-bored-with-endgame?scrollTo=1295315%231295315

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@WavingHat quote:


@Dani quote:

Remember diamond pets didn't come out immediately in DD1. So where DD2 is now, compared to where DD1 was when they came out aren't the same, but I'm confident that you'll see some longer term goals and such when we are.

You'll be pleased (we hope) with what we're cooking right now.

Yes, that is very true. However, DD1 launched in late 2010. You guys should have learned a GREAT deal of what people liked playing and what made them keep coming back. DD2 has absolutely zero resemblance of any long term end-game content or exciting rare loot.

People keep talking about end-game content, and I keep seeing that in quite a few games I play. I don't think people realize that there is no real "end-game content" for games like this, because ideally the game should see continuous content updates as long as the game is alive and healthy. "End-game content" is a phrase that just means, "Stuff to do when I've burned through the other content," and grinding isn't what I'd call end-game.

I'd like to see DD2 reach a point where it's comfortable enough with itself to offer up an open world exploration. Even if it's just a side thing that you download separate and you play with a group of friends. I like to explore, and the Dungeon Defenders lore has teased us with a lot of places that never get fully realized. Is it ever likely to happen? No, I don't think so. Might work as a spin-off game where it's less tower defense and focuses on the heroes and the world, but you never know.

I know, that's not end game either, but if I had the choice between grinding for better gear or pets, and exploring a lore-rich world... I'm gonna take exploration. Because reading the lore is one thing, getting a chance to experience it is quite another.

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Dungeon Defenders end game is grinding up the best gear, best pets, 170 upgrade maxed out everything with the perfect weapon, min-maxxing your gear and relics for maximum hero and tower DPS and taking on bosses/maps/difficulties that can only be beaten by people who have down these things and done them well. That is the only end game acceptable for Dungeon Defenders, as that is the nature of this game. 
Grinding countless waves of survival, difficult maps on the highest difficulty with three like minded people and getting lucky occasionally are the beginning of end-game, beating those final maps/bosses/challenges are the end. 

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