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Hom-Sha-Bom

#1 issue that needs be fixed before anything else?

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What is it, for you?


For me it is how stale the game gets when each chaos tier is locked to the same 4-5 maps. I can't even imagine any other possible change that would get me back into the game, knowing I will still be locked into repeating the same 4-5 maps on shuffle.


Obviously bugs and connectivity issues are huge. But I'm talking about design decisions that need to be changed, not bugs that need to be squashed.

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TBH, I find that the lack of choices is the thing that drives me up the wall.  As you said, being locked to the same 4-5 maps is quite annoying.  That being said, I am working my way through all the chaos tiers still, so the maps change occasionally for me.  Once I get C7 though, having only 4 maps to play, and not being able to choose which one I want to do, would get insanely frustrating I think.

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Will try to say this again. Chaos trials are not end game. So we will get Onslaught 2.0. Which hopefully TE can deliver properly on. Take your time on that one. 

Chaos Trials having a set map pool per difficulty makes sense to me. 

They are Trials , something you have to push through to hopefully get to a proper endgame.

So yes. #1 Issue for me. Is the lack of a true end game.

Chaos Trials are there to teach you about the threats. They are even too hard for some.

I wonder what the response they will give when we get a true end game released..(Stop typing now before you make a rant. Thank you me! ) 

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The lack of choices are horrendous. From random map selection of trials to the few Hard-counter mobs that show up in every chaos level forcing us to have to use a few specific towers, sometimes even heroes.

And i kinda hope to the GODS that onslaught isnt going to be our endgame. In no way should what Onslaught use to be be our endgame. The idea of our only choice of endgame being, make a match and stay in it forever until you have to leave for life. No, just no. I hate that. Yeah it's fun to do sometimes, but I want to be able to do a run, get a chest, go back to tavern, see what people are doing, decide what I wanna do, then do another run. Not, go into onslaught, spend next X amount of hours doing this and only this with no break and no way to go from solo to seeing people or tired of these people to solo without completely abandoning my progress.

Also, old Onslaught rewards sucked royal arse. All that effort for usually a worthless green or some worthless pile of coin that cant even buy a round of drinks from the tavernkeeper in this game.


I want Defense mode back. With no hard-counters in them.

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@PandynatorDD quote:

Chaos Trials having a set map pool per difficulty makes sense to me. 

They are Trials , something you have to push through to hopefully get to a proper endgame.

[...]

Chaos Trials are there to teach you about the threats. They are even too hard for some.

Why do you think that makes sense? What's the reasoning behind it?

Trials could still accomplish pushing through to end game, gearing up, acquiring shards, and teaching you about the threats without limiting the map pool.

Before you can even get into trials you have to finish the Campaign, right? And every map is available in the campaign. So by the time you do trials, you've already experienced every map, but then for arbitrary reasons you're restricted to a small set of maps.

I ask because you don't sound like you're just "ok" with having a limited map pool, it seems like you agree with having a limited map pool and actually want it to stay that way. But I haven't heard any reason (from anyone, not just singling you out) for why it could be considered a good thing to have such severely limited map availability. Especially when you already have to play every map to get to Chaos. So it's not even like you're unlocking maps as you progress through Chaos. You've already played and beaten them all. And then suddenly you only get to play a small percentage of the maps.

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I'd like to be able to know I can log in when I try to play the game.

Then when I eventually get in I don't freeze or get dashboarded non stop 

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:


@PandynatorDD quote:

Chaos Trials having a set map pool per difficulty makes sense to me. 

They are Trials , something you have to push through to hopefully get to a proper endgame.

[...]

Chaos Trials are there to teach you about the threats. They are even too hard for some.

Why do you think that makes sense? What's the reasoning behind it?

Trials could still accomplish pushing through to end game, gearing up, acquiring shards, and teaching you about the threats without limiting the map pool.

Before you can even get into trials you have to finish the Campaign, right? And every map is available in the campaign. So by the time you do trials, you've already experienced every map, but then for arbitrary reasons you're restricted to a small set of maps.

I ask because you don't sound like you're just "ok" with having a limited map pool, it seems like you agree with having a limited map pool and actually want it to stay that way. But I haven't heard any reason (from anyone, not just singling you out) for why it could be considered a good thing to have such severely limited map availability. Especially when you already have to play every map to get to Chaos. So it's not even like you're unlocking maps as you progress through Chaos. You've already played and beaten them all. And then suddenly you only get to play a small percentage of the maps.

The thing is that if we had multiple game modes instead of just trials then the way it works now wouldn't be that much of an issue. Onslaught, Defense, all Incursions, etc. Because all we have are Trials and 1 end-game incursion, it the whole limited map thing feels super stale. That being said, I would have greatly preferred if every chaos trial level was across all the maps and not just the 5/4 maps in the pools (and some maps are repeated while others are never used.)

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Just speaking for myself, I don't think an "end game" would be enough. I stopped playing in C6. If "end game" is what you play after you're done with C7 (or C8 or C9 or C10), I don't think that would be enough to get me to sit through the map limitations on all remaining chaos tiers. It seriously just makes the game incredibly boring to me.

Over a year ago I had the option to play like 13 maps (spooky maps went away after the first halloween event, ramparts siege, assault on throne room, harbringer didn't exist) and I don't remember how many incursions there were.

Today there are like 20 maps and more incursions than ever but the majority of them are practically unplayable. There are only FOUR maps out of 20 and ZERO incursions out of 9 or 10 or however many there are, that I can play to progress and I'm assigned one randomly. It's entirely possible (and has happened many times to me already) to play for an hour and only see the same map on repeat.


I don't get it. All these maps exist but we can't play them. What do the Diaz bros and Collins think about all the work they put into all these maps and people don't even have the option to play them now?

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Yeah it would be the map situation for sure, 4 maps to play gets really boring fast. But it is also something else thats missing, because now you have nothing to play for. No leaderboards, no progress, no fat loot to get, no pets to farm nothing. There is nothing at all in the game that makes you want to grind those hours.


So even if they add 10 maps to c7 it would still get boring really fast if there is nothing to grind for. 

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The developers' mentality. They don't give a flying duck about player's feedback and can close a topic just because there is criticism in it. Like the one below.


Just look at the forums. 

There are tons of topics about broken tower balance, crazy slow and confusing gear progression, server issues, too much rng, immersion-breaking tower limitations, no class balance, hidden ipwr when everything depends on it, etc..

Why can't they listen to the community for once? Why do they have to make decisions that clearly make the game more unfair, confusing, and much less fun and newbie-friendly?

This game is based on a great idea yet on pc they have 1000 player peaks in a free to play game that doesn't have a crap pay to win model. Why do they have to make unlogical decisions again and again? 

They have a small fanatic playerbase that doesn't care about most problems since they've put so much time into the game that they don't even feel them (with 1000+ asc progression difficulty is at 0, every tower is usable because of the crazy stat boosts, etc.). But once a newcomer hits chaos they instantly get confused and/or bored of it. All of my friends have stopped playing it because you can't use the towers you like, you have to farm 4 maps like 100 times to get into the next tier, you have basically 2 heroes you can use against hard bosses, you can't even see the ipwr of your items anymore.. One of my friends is at 250 asc without a single deadly strikes drop, and the list goes on..


Every one of these problems had at least 5 topics on this forum, yet they are making the game less and less newbie-friendly despite the already negative feedback on steam, on the forums, on basically everywhere. They don't even care anymore.

Ever since this new chaos update the game is a mess mostly. They had some great ideas and they made them a reality in a crapcoat. People keep making great suggestions as to how to remove this coat, Trendy comments something like "great ideas, we'll definitely think about it!" and then in the next update they remove ipwr. Then people start complaining about the loss of ipwr, they make statements as to why it was really important, like this way we can only measure gear by it's stats, then Trendy again comments something like "good points, we'll definitely think about it!" and then in the next update they make the stats random. This was only one of the many many cases out there.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

It's entirely possible (and has happened many times to me already) to play for an hour and only see the same map on repeat.

The incredible irony in trying to force variety onto people. Hard counters and no map selection was obviously an attempt to force diversity on us but it's ultimately failed and only made the game tedious.

It's not like it's hard to get people to play those more difficult/annoying maps - simply make those maps give better rewards. It's hardly rocket science and it makes sense.

Going into C5 the only map I found I could clear/enjoyed was sewers - so I spent more time  creating and leaving games than I did actually playing. so much fun.

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make it possible that u can choose all incursions at any difficulty once u beat all of them once
+ at least making players get loot in them   not getting defender medals is enough but nothing except petfood and the chest at the end is a joke (its a waste of nice designed challenges since u only play them once for the wayfarer unlock// i would play the bloodmoon incursion all the time when it would be c7 with loot since the boss would be fun to fight)

some endgame content
i dont get how they can launch a game whith 0 endgame content
while still in beta it was excusable
now it is not

generally changing their limiting choices/forcing players to do what they want mentality
its not fun that the only time u can choose ur map is in campaign and thats only on normal/hard
so once u reached 50 its not challenging whatsoever
and then we go into : we say what defenses u should build and what map u play

the idea of trials as actual trials are okay
for progression  or maybe for quests/other loot
but not as an only play trials with hard counter enemys and random maps all the time

all special legendary weapons should be possible getting with end game stats
no sense in a cool legendary that u can only use for 1-2 maps until u find a better one and never be able to find that cool legendary again

maybe again adding higher difficulties for campaign
i want to play the betsy map on a level thats difficult
also more bossmaps in general
right now we only have betsy(does not count cause instakill with c1 gear) harbinger (still does not count cause again no challenge with c1 gear) and the terraria eye (only in c3 and also instakill with c4 gear)
i mean why have some cool bosses if u can only fight them once or twice and after that they insta die to a mean look cause u cant raise the difficulty ...

also current daylies are really fun when even after u reroll once none of the maps is in ur current chaos tier


so to sum this up what this game needs is: actual endgame content  and more player choices

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The number one fix for me is geodes.

If they made the shield absorb instead of reflect all would be good with the whole game.

You could use, without any fear of reflected damage, any tower at any Chaos tier, simple fix to change the game entirely.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:


@PandynatorDD quote:

Chaos Trials having a set map pool per difficulty makes sense to me. 

They are Trials , something you have to push through to hopefully get to a proper endgame.

[...]

Chaos Trials are there to teach you about the threats. They are even too hard for some.

Why do you think that makes sense? What's the reasoning behind it?

Trials could still accomplish pushing through to end game, gearing up, acquiring shards, and teaching you about the threats without limiting the map pool.

Before you can even get into trials you have to finish the Campaign, right? And every map is available in the campaign. So by the time you do trials, you've already experienced every map, but then for arbitrary reasons you're restricted to a small set of maps.

I ask because you don't sound like you're just "ok" with having a limited map pool, it seems like you agree with having a limited map pool and actually want it to stay that way. But I haven't heard any reason (from anyone, not just singling you out) for why it could be considered a good thing to have such severely limited map availability. Especially when you already have to play every map to get to Chaos. So it's not even like you're unlocking maps as you progress through Chaos. You've already played and beaten them all. And then suddenly you only get to play a small percentage of the maps.

Up and through chaos 1-4. They have 20 unique maps. Which is all the maps except a few. After that the rest of the trials only have four maps. Which if it were five, I think it would of been better.

Also I think they should of implemented a weekly rotation on the last chaos difficulty until we get a proper end game where we have more choices.

I want more choice, I do. But if TE has something in mind for other game modes that will serve that purpose I don't think the solution is to make every other game mode serve that purpose as well.

Progressing through one chaos trial does not take "that" long that it becomes a huge issue while you are progressing. It is a issue when you hit chaos 7 and have to play only that on repeat. But personally I don't think its an issue while progressing.

Some maps are plainly easier than others as well. So that is another reason as well. While I would want them to balance that with number of enemies spawned etc, I don't think they have the time to fully test that on all the difficulties across all the maps. 

Limiting it to fewer maps lets them push out more content with their small team. You will probably call it less content:P But we can disagree on that. 


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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

What is it, for you?


For me it is how stale the game gets when each chaos tier is locked to the same 4-5 maps. I can't even imagine any other possible change that would get me back into the game, knowing I will still be locked into repeating the same 4-5 maps on shuffle.


Obviously bugs and connectivity issues are huge. But I'm talking about design decisions that need to be changed, not bugs that need to be squashed.

you can thank trendy they sold us out and made a deal with xb1. we have been grinding the same maps for years we should have gotten the map, and really we should have gotten a lot more since we have been supporting this game. however trendy saw fit to sell us out. GG dd2 wont last this way trendy as you see the players are pissed but i guess they dont care since microsoft will pay for thier homes and food. gl with that trendy

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@Arruzaki quote:

make it possible that u can choose all incursions at any difficulty once u beat all of them once
+ at least making players get loot in them   not getting defender medals is enough but nothing except petfood and the chest at the end is a joke (its a waste of nice designed challenges since u only play them once for the wayfarer unlock// i would play the bloodmoon incursion all the time when it would be c7 with loot since the boss would be fun to fight)

some endgame content
i dont get how they can launch a game whith 0 endgame content
while still in beta it was excusable
now it is not

generally changing their limiting choices/forcing players to do what they want mentality
its not fun that the only time u can choose ur map is in campaign and thats only on normal/hard
so once u reached 50 its not challenging whatsoever
and then we go into : we say what defenses u should build and what map u play

the idea of trials as actual trials are okay
for progression  or maybe for quests/other loot
but not as an only play trials with hard counter enemys and random maps all the time

all special legendary weapons should be possible getting with end game stats
no sense in a cool legendary that u can only use for 1-2 maps until u find a better one and never be able to find that cool legendary again

maybe again adding higher difficulties for campaign
i want to play the betsy map on a level thats difficult
also more bossmaps in general
right now we only have betsy(does not count cause instakill with c1 gear) harbinger (still does not count cause again no challenge with c1 gear) and the terraria eye (only in c3 and also instakill with c4 gear)
i mean why have some cool bosses if u can only fight them once or twice and after that they insta die to a mean look cause u cant raise the difficulty ...

also current daylies are really fun when even after u reroll once none of the maps is in ur current chaos tier


so to sum this up what this game needs is: actual endgame content  and more player choices

trendy had plenty of time to think this over. they choose to reward microsoft. plain and simple they dont care about us. if they did they could have atleast the very very minimum give us c8 or c8-10 they had time remember that. they just chose to reward people who havent even proven thier loyalty to the game. in other words "thanks for the money, we dont need you"

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Today playing C5 I got the sewer map 11x in a row....  11.  Why?  5 maps in the pool, that means 20% chance of that map...  Yet I get it 11x in a row.  I easily farm it and all, so difficulty of the map didn't matter, just kinda sucked doing the same map so many times.  So yea...my issue is still the lack of options when it comes to what maps we can play while doing these trials. 

That being said, the hard counters are still just annoying...having gotten out of C4, I did not think I would see geodes for at least a tier (also thought C5 was specifically Assassins, Berserkers and Cyborks), however it seems I was wrong, at one point a couple geodes spawned and insta-gibbed all my Skeletal Archers, literally instantly wiped them all out.  So yea hard counters would be a close second for my issue in the game currently that needs fixed.  I guess though you could say hard counters also limit your options...so yea, guess limited options overall, lol.

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hard counters arent the main issue i have, but i do understand what you mean. trendy has got a huge problem and the refuse to even talk with us about it. seems like they have thier tail between thier legs. or maybe on thier knees in the microsoft office. either way they are ruining the game one patch at a time.

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Ok, i wonder if you know that we are getting the revenge of the yeti map in week or less, [[49129,users]]? Trendy did not, "abandon" all other players to go make love to Microsoft, they made it an exclusive map to help boost release on the xbox. 


Also you know what needs to be fixed first? The darned back button on this website, as well as the meta description :P Also the signin popup on mobile. 

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@Argonias quote:

Today playing C5 I got the sewer map 11x in a row....  11.  Why?  5 maps in the pool, that means 20% chance of that map...  Yet I get it 11x in a row.  I easily farm it and all, so difficulty of the map didn't matter, just kinda sucked doing the same map so many times.  So yea...my issue is still the lack of options when it comes to what maps we can play while doing these trials. 

That being said, the hard counters are still just annoying...having gotten out of C4, I did not think I would see geodes for at least a tier (also thought C5 was specifically Assassins, Berserkers and Cyborks), however it seems I was wrong, at one point a couple geodes spawned and insta-gibbed all my Skeletal Archers, literally instantly wiped them all out.  So yea hard counters would be a close second for my issue in the game currently that needs fixed.  I guess though you could say hard counters also limit your options...so yea, guess limited options overall, lol.

I could build all the c5 maps with a blindfold on, slow progression and small map pool is a joke really. The geodes are intended, so you can't afk.

@Unicorn808 quote:

Ok, i wonder if you know that we are getting the revenge of the yeti map in week or less, dd304? Trendy did not, "abandon" all other players to go make love to Microsoft, they made it an exclusive map to help boost release on the xbox.

Yeah, because xbox players really needed that one more map, the other 20+ maps that are totally new to them weren't enough.

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@Murdash quote:
@Unicorn808 quote:

Ok, i wonder if you know that we are getting the revenge of the yeti map in week or less, dd304? Trendy did not, "abandon" all other players to go make love to Microsoft, they made it an exclusive map to help boost release on the xbox.

Yeah, because xbox players really needed that one more map, the other 20+ maps that are totally new to them weren't enough.

Well to me, waiting a few days isn't that big of a deal. We can be patient, and having that Exclusive Xbox Map! tag probably does help with the advertising.

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@Murdash quote:


@Unicorn808 quote:

Ok, i wonder if you know that we are getting the revenge of the yeti map in week or less, dd304? Trendy did not, "abandon" all other players to go make love to Microsoft, they made it an exclusive map to help boost release on the xbox.

Yeah, because xbox players really needed that one more map, the other 20+ maps that are totally new to them wasn't enough.

dude why is it every post you make on the forums is just you being salty as a block of salt in the dead sea. like i really dont get it.


For me what would make this place better is the silencing of murdash for the past idk 4 days its salty post after salty post demanding devs do what he wants when he wants where he wants. Because apparently he holds the majorty shares of stock for trendy and basically owns the company now.


But no all jokes aside tbh id like a better way to earn medals. because as it sits.. getting medals is well.. trash. you get a daily once a day that gives 300ish and the other i think that gives like 600? thats 900 a day if you dont grind out maps. so thats roughly 11 days to unlock a hero. while yes i understand you want players to stay! and not have all the content in under a week. but for me. 25 medals a run just seems well.. idk un rewarding. after doing a grind since i get up till i go to sleep i just dont feel rewarded. most of them just go into upgrades or shards.  just so i can get to the next trial. i guess once youre c7 end game gear this isnt really much of a problem since you can just got put a FA infront of a spawn in C1 and just sit untill a roller comes and just 1 shot it with an auto.

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@Murdash quote:


@Murdash quote:

(I was simply going by your stupid logic, I guess you'll tell me now that If someone else criticises it's crying, but if you are the one doing it it's constructive and helping.. stop being a total moron)

Guess who was right? Now start flaming here too.

Man i legit dont get it with you or dd304. youre both like unreachable. if something isnt perfect or going your way instant upsetti with no spaghetti. Like cool bud you insulted me back and now are trying to play the oh im a nice guy youre a bully meme "start flaming here too", cute but lets be real here who just went on flaming back? you buddo.

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Just shut up. Yo guys obviously can't have a constructive forum discussion so stop responding to each other. If you do respond, talk about the Issue that needs to be fixed, not about how flamey each person is. IMO, dd304 is the only unreachable one here.



@Murdash quote:

Go on.

@MentyPlz quote:


@Murdash quote:


@Murdash quote:

(I was simply going by your stupid logic, I guess you'll tell me now that If someone else criticises it's crying, but if you are the one doing it it's constructive and helping.. stop being a total moron)

Guess who was right? Now start flaming here too.

Man i legit dont get it with you or dd304. youre both like unreachable. if something isnt perfect or going your way instant upsetti with no spaghetti. Like cool bud you insulted me back and now are trying to play the oh im a nice guy youre a bully meme "start flaming here too", cute but lets be real here who just went on flaming back? you buddo.


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