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What Defense Should You Upgrade First?; More Math Trendy Needs To Look At

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@MushroomCake28 quote:

Ohh wow you're faster then we are. We just had the Dryad left -.- 

Nice job. Btw you should mention the calculation for the stats we see on inspect. Like the majority of attack damage and health is a direct proportion scaling from DH and DP and DCD is usually a function like y = mx + b. For cannonball for example, you should put : 9 * DCD + 4500 

I broke it out into a different sheet and updated it a little: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1npVxN8NL85CO1wqTLl8uv2Ar0raKAJv-trWgrmigj4Q/edit#gid=1432950598


The naked stats columns (G, H, & I) shows the base, so it's: scale value * stat + naked value

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@Ratiasu quote:However, I STRONGLY dissagree they should get better damage scaling.

They should simply cost less to upgrade. Why doesn't every towers upgrade cost equal their initial building cost, multiplied by tier? EG: Cannonball lvl 2 costs 30 mana, lvl 3 costs 60 mana, etc..

You're not the first person to say this. Not even about DD2.

I'm not going to go back and find the post now, but when I was futzing around with my own TD game the suggestion came up and I implemented it in my own code.

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This here I disagree with, as I often (as in almost always) don't have enough mana to upgrade everything if I use even a few cheap towers.

@Ratiasu quote:

 The downside of costing merely a bit of extra mana (mana costs are minor compared to DU cost), which is only a temporary issue until you get plenty of it to upgrade everything, should not be countered by a permanent performance increase.


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@Ratiasu quote:

They should simply cost less to upgrade. Why doesn't every towers upgrade cost equal their initial building cost, multiplied by tier? EG: Cannonball lvl 2 costs 30 mana, lvl 3 costs 60 mana, etc..

I 100% agree with this. Why should towers with varying degrees of upgrade growths and DU costs have the exact same upgrade costs? It just doesn't make sense.

It should cost more to upgrade towers with higher upgrade growths, and it should cost less to upgrade towers with smaller upgrade growths. The DU costs should already be factoring in every aspect of a defense, so they should the most natural place to use as a starting point.

To anyone who brings up the more expensive defenses, such as Nimbus that costs 100 DU, it's important to keep in mind that by using expensive defenses you already have fewer defenses that need mana in the first place.

Not to mention that with the current DU limits, if something costs 100 DU then it needs to be bringing quite a lot to the table. DU costs could certainly use another pass over.

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@JudgeM quote:

This here I disagree with, as I often (as in almost always) don't have enough mana to upgrade everything if I use even a few cheap towers.

@Ratiasu quote:

 The downside of costing merely a bit of extra mana (mana costs are minor compared to DU cost), which is only a temporary issue until you get plenty of it to upgrade everything, should not be countered by a permanent performance increase.


It's simply an inferior method of balancing, how is it better than linking upgrading costs to building costs? Makes no sense from a balancing perspective, especially long term since we're bound to get game modes with more than just 5 rounds (there's onslaught for one) - in which case 30 DU towers should not be objectively better than 40 DU ones.

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@Ratiasu quote:


@JudgeM quote:

This here I disagree with, as I often (as in almost always) don't have enough mana to upgrade everything if I use even a few cheap towers.

@Ratiasu quote:

 The downside of costing merely a bit of extra mana (mana costs are minor compared to DU cost), which is only a temporary issue until you get plenty of it to upgrade everything, should not be countered by a permanent performance increase.


It's simply an inferior method of balancing, how is it better than linking upgrading costs to building costs? Makes no sense from a balancing perspective, especially long term since we're bound to get game modes with more than just 5 rounds (there's onslaught for one) - in which case 30 DU towers should not be objectively better than 40 DU ones.

I'm not disagreeing with you overall. I'm just saying that you claimed it's a temporary issue. It might be that sometime in the future things will be different, but right now I'm in a situation where I'm mostly using tier 1 and 2 towers simply because I'm lacking mana. When the few viable towers I have (I don't have all champions) are all cheap I always end up lacking mana. Especially as a lot of it goes to repairing walls. And balancing a game around future possibilities is a bad idea.

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@JudgeM quote:

And balancing a game around future possibilities is a bad idea.

A good balance is one that works at every level and every type of content, including current and future content. 

Imho, mana costs  for upgrades should be one of the easier things to balance here. The balance team can simply keep in mind how much mana each map gives (including mob drops), and calculate how many upgrades you'll be able to get out of it, and by which wave.

Edit: Reading through everything you said again, you might actually be saying this solution would indeed be fine, but simply disagree with the statement limited mana is a very real factor that lasts throughout the game until the end of the last round. In which case, yes, you're right.



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@Skyaliciouse quote:

Guys I'm a really bad reader, can someone tell me what towers I should be upgrading over others? pretty pleasesquire_small.png

Walls mostly.  Skyguard if it's struggling with flying mobs (eventually wont have to).  Some into Frosty to slow down mobs.

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@Skyaliciouse quote:

Guys I'm a really bad reader, can someone tell me what towers I should be upgrading over others? pretty pleasesquire_small.png

I respect your honesty. Pdt's are pretty good, sky guards also seem to advance quite wel

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