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Am I the only one enjoying the update so far ?


I can clear maps (chaos I&II for now) with multiple builds, no more PDT/glitches, siege roller is finally ok, and maps bring a lot more challenge + active play + strategic planning.

Was the end-game update supposed to be cleared in one day with no stuff/optimization with any towers/placement ?


I mean, I lost multiple times in chaos I at first trying to figure out how to deal with treats, but nothing overwhelming once you start learning the new content, at least from my experience. Hell I didn't even get a single usefull shard. Can't wait to be fully geared to see how strong builds can become.

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No mate I am spending time currently doing C1 for shards making sure I rotate my active hero come the end game chest to get a better chance of the shard I'm looking for.

Will be then moving onto C2 to do the same before hopefully having a good idea what to build for C3.

Baby steps to avoid frustration, I know I should be in C3 but I'm not in any hurry I have lots of heroes to fully shard and test.

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@NeedtoDie quote:

Am I the only one enjoying the update so far ?


I can clear maps (chaos I&II for now) with multiple builds, no more PDT/glitches, siege roller is finally ok, and maps bring a lot more challenge + active play + strategic planning.

Was the end-game update supposed to be cleared in one day with no stuff/optimization with any towers/placement ?


I mean, I lost multiple times in chaos I at first trying to figure out how to deal with treats, but nothing overwhelming once you start learning the new content, at least from my experience. Hell I didn't even get a single usefull shard. Can't wait to be fully geared to see how strong builds can become.

  • Our current stuff should let us play Chaos IV, not Chaos I.
  • Farming the same 5 maps over and over is the most abnoxious feeling ever.
  • There is so many new bugs and still old ones not fixed which is expected because "alpha" but still not enjoyable.
  • The gold drops are absolutely awful giving a huge problem on the long term.
  • The game is unplayable for anyone "new" to the game or at least just exiting the campaign (way too hard with campaign stuff and the gold given).
  • Really odd UI design choices (Hero deck and bags in particular)
  • Some heroes are really bad and some others are way too strong (Abyss Lord left click is absurdly strong for an attack that is obviously meant to be the weakest in the game; Squire as builder is pretty useless)
  • The new monsters counter way too hard some defenses making them completely unreliable (if these enemies spawned only on certain lanes or not all 5 at the same time but only 2 of the 5 per lane it would be ok). This alone makes the old PDT meta more enjoyable which is sad.

I'd really love to enjoy the update, but farming a way too easy game is not fun  (Chaos I and II) and from Chaos III and forward I can't clear any map in solo play because of how randomly overwhelming enemies are and defenses need a huge babysit at all time. Bring back the old lane system with only one lane being intense per active players in the game  (or X + 1 I don't know but not ALL) and I'd be ok.

But having to destroy 6 geodes, burrowers, cyborcs plus special enemies (and that's just Chaos III) is not feasible in a healthy and FUN way on soloplay, period.


On top of that playing multiplayer is really unfairly much easier and stacking walls only is way too effective for how stupid the strategy is.


So you may not be the only one to enjoy the update, but having a very small portion of the players simply enjoying a new update (which normally is enjoyable because new stuff to do) is quite worrying.

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I think saying our current stuff should suffice for Chaos IV isn't correct.

Yeah, we have base gear from essentially chaos IV.  But we started with shards/ascension of a campaign player


If power were a equations it'd be something like gear + ascension + shards = power

and we're lopsided coming into the fresh patch by being overtuned in one of those variables and undertuned in the other two


I think the difficulty is fair for endgame players who came into the patch with NM4 gear



I like the lane schedules btw.  The old system was kind of dumb, imo.  One lane was tough and the rest were trash goblins, not fun - and it sucked having to upgrade every lane because it randomize.

Idk if it changes in group play (I exclusively solo) but I'm seeing a lot of the patterns that were easy to see in onslaught's horde waves.  First few seconds of a wave is kind of random, with big clumps of units coming down at the same time.  But then the later 2/3 of the wave is like... gigantic clumps from a single lane, and once that lane is done pooping out endless minions the next one starts.  So, I'm still getting the feeling that as a solo player I'm able to always be assisting the lane that needs it most 

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@NeedtoDie quote:

no more PDT

Everyone keeps saying this yet i keep clearing chaos 3 and early 4 with PDTs because they still do 200k dps buffed (far more than anything else). 

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@Sombrero quote:
  • Our current stuff should let us play Chaos IV, not Chaos I.
  • Farming the same 5 maps over and over is the most abnoxious feeling ever.
  • There is so many new bugs and still old ones not fixed which is expected because "alpha" but still not enjoyable.
  • The gold drops are absolutely awful giving a huge problem on the long term.
  • The game is unplayable for anyone "new" to the game or at least just exiting the campaign (way too hard with campaign stuff and the gold given).
  • Really odd UI design choices (Hero deck and bags in particular)
  • Some heroes are really bad and some others are way too strong (Abyss Lord left click is absurdly strong for an attack that is obviously meant to be the weakest in the game; Squire as builder is pretty useless)
  • The new monsters counter way too hard some defenses making them completely unreliable (if these enemies spawned only on certain lanes or not all 5 at the same time but only 2 of the 5 per lane it would be ok). This alone makes the old PDT meta more enjoyable which is sad.

I'd really love to enjoy the update, but farming a way too easy game is not fun  (Chaos I and II) and from Chaos III and forward I can't clear any map in solo play because of how randomly overwhelming enemies are and defenses need a huge babysit at all time. Bring back the old lane system with only one lane being intense per active players in the game  (or X + 1 I don't know but not ALL) and I'd be ok.

But having to destroy 6 geodes, burrowers, cyborcs plus special enemies (and that's just Chaos III) is not feasible in a healthy and FUN way on soloplay, period.


On top of that playing multiplayer is really unfairly much easier and stacking walls only is way too effective for how stupid the strategy is.


So you may not be the only one to enjoy the update, but having a very small portion of the players simply enjoying a new update (which normally is enjoyable because new stuff to do) is quite worrying.


You are 2 days in the end game content you'd like to be clearing chaos 5 already. That's probably why you seem so frustrated.

Once you have optimized stuff, you should probably be able to clear chaos III & IV solo.

I don't get it, this difficulty is called Chaos. More than difficult. Why should new players be able to clear it easely ? Let's call it normal + or easy² and let us all win afk with ***ty stuff, optimization, placement and tower choices so we can have the best game in the world...

This game has been ridiculously easy for a long period of time. It was harder back when the resistant lanes were in place, but wasn't particularly fun.

I think that we are going in the right direction, especially when we consider the substantial number of changes.

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I'd probably be enjoying it a lot more if not for the UI.

It's my one major gripe about the patch.

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I think a lot of people are enjoying it, but there are a few major issues that eclipse the good parts of the update.

The new UI is horrendous. I struggle to come up with 1 redeeming quality of the new UI/Inventory.

Hero selection carousel is terrible.

Inventory management is impossible.

Auto collect filters are broken.

You can't tell if a new item drop is better than your currently equipped upgraded item.

All towers range is a joke due to Range being implemented as a relic stat, but then removed from relics, and nobody went back to restore the towers range.

The purpose of the update was to make it so you didn't need multiple of the same hero for each defense, but that was a total failure with the addition of the Ascension system. You do still need 1 builder for each defense because of Ascension.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

I think a lot of people are enjoying it, but there are a few major issues that eclipse the good parts of the update.

Indeed. I just... I don't understand how we went from an actually usable menu that was a bit inconvenient, to something that looks far more convenient but is actually even more inconvenient and weird than before. Someone actually built this thinking it was better. That amazes me.

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@Tyroki quote:
@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

I think a lot of people are enjoying it, but there are a few major issues that eclipse the good parts of the update.

Indeed. I just... I don't understand how we went from an actually usable menu that was a bit inconvenient, to something that looks far more convenient but is actually even more inconvenient and weird than before. Someone actually built this thinking it was better. That amazes me.

Agreed. The new inventory UI is one of the worst changes ever made to this game.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:
@Tyroki quote:
@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

I think a lot of people are enjoying it, but there are a few major issues that eclipse the good parts of the update.

Indeed. I just... I don't understand how we went from an actually usable menu that was a bit inconvenient, to something that looks far more convenient but is actually even more inconvenient and weird than before. Someone actually built this thinking it was better. That amazes me.

Agreed. The new inventory UI is one of the worst changes ever made to this game.

See, normally I'd say "That's a bit of a stretch. One of the worst changes EVER? Really?" but in this case, you're absolutely right.

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Besides the hero selection I actually like this more >_>;;  


The "FILTER BY..." actually has functionality the previous UI didn't because it sorts stuff from ALL BAGS.  I like that a lot, as I've always had like 90% of my bags full of *** I'm collecting on the off chance it finds use on a new hero or something.  


I was literally dreading eventually having to scroll through (scrolling was a buggy mess for me, too) all of those bags one by one to find what's useful and what's not.  Now I just "FILTER BY..." and mouse through all armor, relics, etc 

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I feel ok with update...
exept some bugs...
(and scrolling heroes thing - HATE IT)
Especially one that kicks me from all games at random latewave moment...
Can't complete any map cause of it.

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@Tyroki quote:


@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

I think a lot of people are enjoying it, but there are a few major issues that eclipse the good parts of the update.

Indeed. I just... I don't understand how we went from an actually usable menu that was a bit inconvenient, to something that looks far more convenient but is actually even more inconvenient and weird than before. Someone actually built this thinking it was better. That amazes me.

GUIs are a pain in the butt - you often don't know how well it works to it is all done, and after you have been using it while making it you may not realize something is awkward.

Good news is I think it will be a lot better with a couple of changes. Allow moving bags around. Allow dragging to other bags. Pet and shard boxes need to move to designated pet and shard bags. If I set up a shard bag, give me a "autofill from other bags" option. Allow autosorting like the old system with some options. The Hero Carousal could have up/down buttons that allow moving down a whole group, and have a char type button that lets me filter to just a certain hero type or all of them (ie I want a Dryad so I click the Dryad button, and instead of 64 chars I only see my 7 Dryads).

So hopefully they will spend the next month polishing up a couple of things so will be the improvement they wanted.

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Hello defenders !

I wanted to share my experience for now :p i agree to say that the update is a good one, but sadly just for a little part of the community, some of us can play in chaos with a little bit of strategy cause we have been farming NM4 before the patch, which is my case, i have some decent gear and if i'm carefull enough i can pass C1 maps.

But, now just think about new players, for exemple, 2 friends of mine just began the game with this patch, and they clearly struggle with C1 cause the campaign gear is underpowered and shards droping from campaign are mostly useless, i farmed Harbringer ship with them all the day expecting usefull shard and guess what ? Not a single usefull shard droped.

It's not a crybaby post, i agree that the game needed some changes, but i think some of them are not very balanced. I think making C1 more affordable and rewarding for new players or less stuffed players could be a great idea while C2/C3/etc should not be changed. This way new players could prepare themselves for higher difficulty while not finding themselves in front of a big wall when they just finish the campaign.

Also some towers needs to be reworked to fit to the new monsters we face in Chaos, for exemple: balista ... they were not great towers before the patch compared to PDT but now they are even more useless with those shield goblins, What's the point of a tower defence where some of the defences are just useless :s i find that's too bad.

PS: excuse my english, not a native speaker and long time without practicing, i'm hoping is understandable :p

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@Tyroki quote:

I'd probably be enjoying it a lot more if not for the UI.

It's my one major gripe about the patch.

We spoke about all of the UI feedback we've received so far in our community feedback meeting today. It's a big priority for us to improve these pain points.

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I am enjoying it, but it is tough i feel all the old synergy is gone with the revamps. right now im stuck in Flamethrower towers with blockades and ramsters on chaos two farming. hoping to find the passives im after. All the gear i find is trash only the shards are worth keeping atm since my pre update gear is so much better.

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@iamisom quote:


@Tyroki quote:

I'd probably be enjoying it a lot more if not for the UI.

It's my one major gripe about the patch.

We spoke about all of the UI feedback we've received so far in our community feedback meeting today. It's a big priority for us to improve these pain points.

Phew. Thank goodness =)

Thanks for the update on that Isom.

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I think the campaign experience is fine.


People who say they can clear C1-2 are doing so with gear that is far superior to what is dropping in C1-2, so that isn't much of an achievement.  The experience would be significantly worse if you are naturally progressing from the campaign without gear from previous versions of this game.  The gear that drops from C1/2 has about half the stats your old converted NM4 gear had.  I recommend you gather up some campaign hard gear and see how your experience is for your transition into Chaos.


Most of the towers are not in a very good state, their range is too short, their damage output is poor for Chaos.  This makes a lot of maps hard to do due to the number of lanes and direction of flying mobs and the tower poor ability to handle the different type of mobs, especially the chaos mobs and particularly for the bigger maps with lots of lanes which is harder for a solo person to cover the lanes.


It is much easier to just place a congo line of walls and a minimum number of PDTs to deal with flying mobs and just run around and shoot everything yourself.  Due to this, it makes multiplayer a lot easier than solo as you can cover the lanes better.


It just seems like less of a tower game now and more of a shooter, I liked the game because it was primarily a tower defence game.


I can understand what the devs are trying to do.  I don't really care if it takes me a long time to be able to do the hardest content and get the best gear, however, if the game particularly punishes solo play or the ability to transition and improve gear with inferior gear then it can be a bit too punishing.  I think people's reaction would have been a lot worse if gear was wiped completely or reduced down to campaign level gear.


Gold reward values also seem on the stingy side, it probably wont hurt those who got 30-80 million for converted spheres, however, I think it would be difficult to accumulate reasonable levels of gold for gear upgrades through normal play.  The sale value of items is also abysmally low.


The biggest challenge it seems is grinding the ascension levels and the shards to improve the hero/towers, defend/chaos maps give a lot less xp than campaign/hard maps, the best way to do that ascension grind is to play campaign maps which aren't any challenge for people who have old NM4 gear.  I think the harder the challenge, the more rewarding it should be in terms of experience and loot.

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I can't honestly tell if I"m enjoying the update or not because I've struggled to complete a stage longer than 3 waves without 'disconnecting from the host' which I guess isn't actually me.  It's hard to enjoy something that you can't play.

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@Vim quote:

The biggest challenge it seems is grinding the ascension levels and the shards to improve the hero/towers, defend/chaos maps give a lot less xp than campaign/hard maps, the best way to do that ascension grind is to play campaign maps which aren't any challenge for people who have old NM4 gear.  I think the harder the challenge, the more rewarding it should be in terms of experience and loot.

Nope not the biggest.) Every trials map give you close to 800k exp and guaranteed rare shard drop sometimes 2 if you win. Did you know?! 

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After being able to play, I have to say, I like it. The update did exactly what I had hoped, breathed fresh air into the game. Makes me want to play again after the initial shock of loosing most of my power.


Now if completing the Trials could feel somehow rewarding it would be perfect. Finnishing a map only to see that the loot is still crap and not upgrade worthy (since I miss the shards to do harder content) and the shards themselfs are a repetition of not used hero shards and nothing to help me progress makes me sometimes question the sense behind the shard changes.

Before I could target farm whatever I needed. Now I have to pray to RNGESUS for a wonder. And there is nothing more that I loathe in games than RNG.

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It's annoying that some of the towers feel worthless, even on as low as chaos 1. They just feel like they don't do enough damage. For instance having a legendary ex-nm4 medallion on flamethrower towers and they barely make it though chaos 1; put the same medallion on my PDT and suddenly i'm breezing through chaos 1 as long as I can take out the shields.


At first it felt very frustrating because some towers were just not good and before finding a good combination it felt almost impossible. It feels better now that i've found a combination that works and I can make progress now. Though I know that PDT strategy won't work at all for chaos 3 but being able to build and beat chaos 1 + 2 is satisfying after getting my butt kicked by it for a little bit. Though a little more compensation for our lost builds would have been nice. Plopping us down from NM4 to post-campaign level was a very jarring change and the loss of our stats (and spheres for dryad) made for a painful experience at first. I don't think a few levels of ascension for free wouldn't be that big of a stretch. Maybe like 6 so you have 2 points in each category.

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