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Black Mamba

Rainbow Unicorn, can something be done with it?

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Title.
Right now its just a trophy pet, with no real practical use coz its pretty low level, even on NMHC Assault Pack. Find ways to make it better please! :D

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Most pets are useless. Why pick this super annoying one?


But if for some reason this one does get buffed, then every other pet that is useless also needs to be buffed.

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@mayhem_zero quote:

Most pets are useless. Why pick this super annoying one?


But if for some reason this one does get buffed, then every other pet that is useless also needs to be buffed.

Wrong...


The Unicorn pet along one more pet (which I don't remember right now [was it the cupid?] - it's not the Prop Cat, this one is working as intended) never received a buff on Nightmare like all other pets. Instead it receives a nerf on NM just like any hero (weapon) received.


With other words... and if I still remember correct... the unicorn only does 15.5% damage on NM which it deals on Insane.


I may could find one of my older posts when I've requested a boost/fix of these two pets.

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@mayhem_zero quote:

Most pets are useless. Why pick this super annoying one?

But if for some reason this one does get buffed, then every other pet that is useless also needs to be buffed.

So when was the last time you saw a dps pet other than MegaChicken, cat, monkey, seahorse or dragon?

Wait what? Have you actually played Assault Pack on NMHC to get the Rainbow Unicorns? They don't even roll over 120-150^ and 50-70 stats dude. Its like... ridiculously low-level pet. Can't even use them on Insane or Hard difficulties coz they are so low level.


And your argument is really wrong when you say other pets will get useless if this is buffed, like how? LOL. 

FYI -- I actively use a 19k Donkey(Moraggo) with my Monk. Its a pretty nice pet, slightly less damage yes, but very underrated. I also actively use 17k Goblin Cupid and Djinletts on my characters. Along with the 3 new pets - Ember Pony, Fenix and Parrot. Now just becasue the mainstream player-base is unaware of certain pets doesn't make them "useless".


Please don't talk about stuff when you have no idea how this pet is in the current stats. As for whether the pet itself is annoying or not is a different issue and a highly subjective one at that. I could possibly sum it up with this -- you don't like the pet? Fine, don't use it & don't whine about it, there are plenty of us who like it and who would love using it.


Buffing something doesn't necessarily mean making everything else as underpowered, LOL. 


I really have to say this -- your comments really just feels very prejudiced coz you don't like Rainbow Unicorns, which is fine by me, but don't make rubbish points based on your prejudice, please.

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@EagleOne quote:The Unicorn pet along one more pet (which I don't remember right now [was it the cupid?] - it's not the Prop Cat, this one is working as intended) never received a buff on Nightmare like all other pets. Instead it receives a nerf on NM just like any hero (weapon) received.


With other words... and if I still remember correct... the unicorn only does 15.5% damage on NM which it deals on Insane.


I may could find one of my older posts when I've requested a boost/fix of these two pets.

Laser bots do less damage on NM than insane.  By the way, laser bots are my favorite favorite pet <3

Battle droids and animi both receive a buff on NM, so I don't know why laser bots get worse :(

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Battle droids look identical to laser bots, but they're a different pet. 

Laser bots: "Attacks your opponents with laserbeams shot from its eyes."
Battle droids: "This is the droid you're looking for and it weakens enemies too".

Laser bots shoot faster and always shoot red lasers.
Battle droids do significantly more damage (with the same damage stat) and alternate green and red lasers.

You can get battle droids from TL or MB survival on wave 25.

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@Black Mamba quote:


@mayhem_zero quote:

Most pets are useless. Why pick this super annoying one?

But if for some reason this one does get buffed, then every other pet that is useless also needs to be buffed.

So when was the last time you saw a dps pet other than MegaChicken, cat, monkey, seahorse or dragon?

Wait what? Have you actually played Assault Pack on NMHC to get the Rainbow Unicorns? They don't even roll over 120-150^ and 50-70 stats dude. Its like... ridiculously low-level pet. Can't even use them on Insane or Hard difficulties coz they are so low level.


And your argument is really wrong when you say other pets will get useless if this is buffed, like how? LOL. 

FYI -- I actively use a 19k Donkey(Moraggo) with my Monk. Its a pretty nice pet, slightly less damage yes, but very underrated. I also actively use 17k Goblin Cupid and Djinletts on my characters. Along with the 3 new pets - Ember Pony, Fenix and Parrot. Now just becasue the mainstream player-base is unaware of certain pets doesn't make them "useless".


Please don't talk about stuff when you have no idea how this pet is in the current stats. As for whether the pet itself is annoying or not is a different issue and a highly subjective one at that. I could possibly sum it up with this -- you don't like the pet? Fine, don't use it & don't whine about it, there are plenty of us who like it and who would love using it.


Buffing something doesn't necessarily mean making everything else as underpowered, LOL. 


I really have to say this -- your comments really just feels very prejudiced coz you don't like Rainbow Unicorns, which is fine by me, but don't make rubbish points based on your prejudice, please.

Could you please stop replying to my posts? It is quite obvious you don't read them completely or else you just don't understand what I posted ( I apologize if this is due to a language barrier). Thank you for your understanding.

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Nah buddy, its the other way around. Could you please stop posting on my thread? its quite obvious you don't have anything valuable to bring in here rather than rhetoric and non-facts. Thank you for not understanding the point of this thread. Bye now!

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Can I just take a moment to ask:

Is there something wrong with ultimately balancing out every pet?  Is it a bad thing that there wouldn't be one single end-all build path?  Considering pets themselves are one of the three cosmetic things we can actually utilize (pets,weapons,skins, not counting accessories), is it wrong to reach towards a balance for all of them?

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Valthejean

  1. Is there something wrong with ultimately balancing out every pet? 
    No, nothing wrong. A few pets are absolutely terrible in terms of rolling, not even going to their damage becasue without DDDK you can't even test them properly. Mainly Rainbow Unicorn, Goblin Cupids, Djinnlets, Laser Bots and Presidential Pets are the ones that suffer from poor NM scaling in terms of damage. The Unicorn isn't even worth testing because you'd be real lucky to roll it above 100-120^s. Most just roll <100 and can go upto 6k damage at most. That's not even scratching the Goblins and Orcs.

  2. Is it a bad thing that there wouldn't be one single end-all build path?
    Absolutely not. In fact the game right now suffers with this, where in anything other than a Mega Chicken or a Seahorse/Cavalry on Monk(or any other DPS Character) is not acceptable and often frowned upon by the community.

  3. Considering pets themselves are one of the three cosmetic things we can actually utilize (pets,weapons,skins, not counting accessories), is it wrong to reach towards a balance for all of them?
    Same as point #1, nothing wrong. Most vanilla(generic) pets are pretty well balanced as you can find them in higher qualities. While they may not be as OP as Chickens and Cavalries, they can be a good alternate for those that don't have them. There are however a few that still suffer from being extremely low-level and not rolling even beyond Trans qualities.

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Balancing out every pet will be a nightmare since so many pets scale differently, have different ways to attack and what not. Putting all of that into consideration when adjusting their growth (and how high they can roll) sounds like a mammoth project

There are so many vanilla pets and then the shards add so many more. And then there are even more from challenges and lost quests. It's a nice idea, making all pets viable for something, but I don't think that's going to happen just because there is too much work involved in it.

Contrary to the whole "4 people wave system" you suggested I think THIS is actually a really good and worthwhile use of the CDT time usage. Just imagine how much it would revitalize old maps if the pets suddenly had their own little niche to shine in.

An totally alternative way would be to allow a cosmetic override of a pet. Retain the stats, and whatever and just apply another pet "over" it, making it look like something else. (If a mega chicken only has 3 projectiles, whatever is layered over it would also only have 3, for example)

I would prefer the pet rebalancing in general though

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Ult Elemental Vanilla pets are pretty good though(if only people would actually use them they'd know they are good). Even the Ult Laser Bot and Ult Steam-Bots are pretty good. And you can find them consistently from WW, ToL, GTH2, Akatiti, Ember, Moonbase, Buc Bay, Lab Assault, Tinkerer's Lab.
IMO, most of them are kinda well balanced, granted nothing crazy OP like Mega Chickens & Cavalries, but they are definitely usable as good alternatives. The problem is with a few DLC and Bonus content pets that are just too low level, stats and upgrade-level wise that make them rather unusable for most. Mainly Goblin Cupids, Djinnlets and Rainbow Unicorns.

Old maps shouldn't be touched, and this has been discussed with a few from CDT simply becasue having old maps drop high-end pets would break progression for those that don't exploit Lab Assault for progression. Rather we can simply have some old pets drop on new higher level maps without breaking too much of the game's lore and theme.
Other than that, I'm totally okay with how pets are right now. Vanilla pets are a part of early game progression on NMHC. And any buff to them to make them at the levels of Seahorses and Chickens would be terrible. They are pretty good as it is, barring a few.

_______________________________________________________________

Mayhem Zero here accuses me of not understanding his points, but what he doesn't understand is that the best of Rainbow Unicorns are still no where near usable even on Insane, the reason is that its pretty damn low level in terms of rolling. Here is an example of an average Rainbow Unicorn after 20 runs of Assault Pack NMHC:
oklS8S1.png
Zero Unicorn in 20 runs that was over 100^, only one guy got a 101^ Unicorn.
So gotta be kidding me when he says "buffing this pet would make others unusable", like really?

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@Black Mamba quote:

Zero Unicorn in 20 runs that was over 100^, only one guy got a 101^ Unicorn.
So gotta be kidding me when he says "buffing this pet would make others unusable", like really?

There you go saying things that I did not say yet again. Can you seriously not read or something? If you want to misquote or misunderstand things, do it with your own posts, it is getting really annoying. Again I apologize if this is due to a language barrier, but whatever the reason, since you cannot seem to comprehend, please stop misquoting and making up things I did not say.

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By the way, I would be in favor of changing the laser bot so it receives a small buff on NM like other pets, but I have to point out that laser bots do have a niche.  They're already the single best pet for certain purposes.  Of course they do much less damage than a mega chicken, but they shine because of their attack pattern.  There's more to choosing a pet than just comparing raw damage numbers.

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But if for some reason this one does get buffed, then every other pet that is useless also needs to be buffed.

Let's try this again.
Other pets are already pretty much buffed, apart from 3 total. All the 3 which I've mentioned in my posts previously are definitely low level in terms of actual rolling and damage-wise, but not quite as much as the Rainbow Unicorn. And literally a couple of posts ago I've mentioned that those must be balanced as well.

Your entire argument starts off with "Rainbow Unicorns are annoying", which is a highly subjective opinion. You don't like the pet then don't use it. If you think these other so-called "useless pets" should be buffed then you have full liberty to make a thread about them. Don't derail this thread with your prejudice and non-facts. Its quite clear you have no idea how the stat rolling is/was on this pet. So now you are just beating the bush with unnecessary stuff.

If the Unicorns even rolled close to how the Cupids and Djinnlet's roll, then I probably wouldn't have made this thread. 

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Allowing exclusive sources of some pets (shard campaign survival, challenges) to drop those pets up to Ult++ (like regular pets can drop) doesn't mean those will always drop at that quality. 

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Oh, of course not, however if their stat rolling(upgrades) is around the levels of Donkeys / Seahorses / Ember Ponies / Fenix / Parrot / Monkey, and such, then by default they(Unicorn, Cupid, Djinnlet, Shroomite) get a decent buff. Try DDDK and spawn a 25-30k Djinnlet or for that matter a 25k Unicorn and you'll see the difference. These numbers are fairly reachable if they have higher upgrade levels(250-300+), which is still very much under the range of Trans and Sup quality.

What you guys are failing to understand is that -- a buff doesn't necessarily mean making a pet drop as Ult++ 9/10 times, I don't even know why you are thinking that was my suggestion, never said that.
Moreover, when I say adding them to other maps, what I mean is giving them a slight RNG bias so they roll relatively better as compared to their current rolling. This is easily achievable and that alone fixes 90% of the imbalance problem. In a game like DD, there is always bound to be something that is "absolutely top-end, best there is", and this thread, in no way or form implies that the Unicorn should be that top-end pet.

My only argument is -- before bring critical on this topic(for whatever reason), please farm a few Unicorns, then farm and few Djinnlets(which most consider as useless) then compare the rolling between the two and tell me whether the Unicorn needs a buff in terms of rolling or not.

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@Black Mamba quote:

Oh, of course not, however if their stat rolling(upgrades) is around the levels of Donkeys / Seahorses / Ember Ponies / Fenix / Parrot / Monkey, and such, then by default they(Unicorn, Cupid, Djinnlet, Shroomite) get a decent buff. Try DDDK and spawn a 25-30k Djinnlet or for that matter a 25k Unicorn and you'll see the difference. These numbers are fairly reachable if they have higher upgrade levels(250-300+), which is still very much under the range of Trans and Sup quality.

What you guys are failing to understand is that -- a buff doesn't necessarily mean making a pet drop as Ult++ 9/10 times, I don't even know why you are thinking that was my suggestion, never said that.
Moreover, when I say adding them to other maps, what I mean is giving them a slight RNG bias so they roll relatively better as compared to their current rolling. This is easily achievable and that alone fixes 90% of the imbalance problem. In a game like DD, there is always bound to be something that is "absolutely top-end, best there is", and this thread, in no way or form implies that the Unicorn should be that top-end pet.

My only argument is -- before bring critical on this topic(for whatever reason), please farm a few Unicorns, then farm and few Djinnlets(which most consider as useless) then compare the rolling between the two and tell me whether the Unicorn needs a buff in terms of rolling or not.

On this one we agree :P :)

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[[70526,users]] Mamba quote:

Other pets are already pretty much buffed, apart from 3 total. All the 3 which I've mentioned in my posts previously are definitely low level in terms of actual rolling and damage-wise, but not quite as much as the Rainbow Unicorn. And literally a couple of posts ago I've mentioned that those must be balanced as well.

Your entire argument starts off with "Rainbow Unicorns are annoying", which is a highly subjective opinion. You don't like the pet then don't use it. If you think these other so-called "useless pets" should be buffed then you have full liberty to make a thread about them. Don't derail this thread with your prejudice and non-facts. Its quite clear you have no idea how the stat rolling is/was on this pet. So now you are just beating the bush with unnecessary stuff.

If the Unicorns even rolled close to how the Cupids and Djinnlet's roll, then I probably wouldn't have made this thread. 

Where exactly did I post anything about the stats of any of the pets in this thread? Do you still not understand the point about not making stuff up?

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You didn't, but I'm telling you that when you say "why pick up this pet over others", its becasue of how Unicorns roll atm, and reading from your response, it was clear you didn't knew how low they roll. The only reason I made this thread is becasue of they roll, if they rolled like even the Goblin Cupids or Djinnlets, then as I said before I wouldn't have made this thread.

So lets just call it a day. No point in arguing assuming we are more or less on the same page that "other useless pets" should be re-balanced.

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