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Initial reactions to Lavamancer?

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Lavamancer has been out for only 2 days now. I know thats not a whole lot of time to form a consensus on the new hero, but... 

What are your guys initial reaction to how well lavamancer is? Is he on par with the rest of the heroes? worse/better? 

Do you think his forte is tower defense building/ DPS? hybrid? 


I'd love to hear from the people who have had a decent amount of playtime with him. 


Also new players who just saved up 12k medals & are reluctant on spending it on lavamancer or another hero can hear from others opinions.

Cheers! 

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Overall a great hero.   Very fun to play and I especially like his walls.  It's very satisfying seeing enemies firmed to stone and attacked by other enemies.   His other towers are less significant though.


Some changes I would suggest:

-Eruption DP boost should scale off of AP.   Currently doesn't scale off of any stat.  

-Eruption cooldown needs to be increased by 10-15 seconds.   Currently you can easily chain it with 1 mounds great generation. 

-Reduce default heat generation to 35-40 for the mound.   Currently the spheres affecting generation are meaningless because hear generation is often faster than cooldowns, unless you're spamming his first ability. 

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I've got a lavamancer builder up to 50 and decently geared, and it just seems that none of his towers are good enough to include. I REALLY want him to be good, I love the character design and the play style that he brings, but he is just too under-powered.  

I particularly want to use the volcano and maw of the earth drake, as they allow for a slower defense game to be played and less of a burst "kill box" strategy. The DU cost however just doesn't allow for it. I'm going to write up a full review on the volcano in another thread, hopefully get some discussion going on making that tower really fun to use.

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Here are my thoughts on it https://dungeondefenders.com/2/topic/138643/lavamancer-discussion-vid


After playing some more and really gearing out the volcano side of things. I think the volcano is pretty good and usable without playing lava active. The maw is good but very niche due to the high DU cost. And the rest really require a active lamancer to be useful. So as a tower builder hes not amazing. 


My suggestions for trendy:

Buff oil geyser to where its useful without lavamancer.

Reduce Maw DU cost to 60 and nerf it slightly to make up for it.

Limit fissures to 2 per map. Change the crit scaling on it and increase the dps to 50% of LA (either that or change to 10 DU. Right now these are a wasted tower builder slot)

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Am I the only one who thinks Eruption and Volcano seems insane? Eruption literally resets the entire map on use and his Volcano is global range AoE damage with pretty sick passives. I really think they might need to nerf Eruption going forward because of how good it and it's sphere, is. I don't need a DPS if I hit eruption and the turrets do a couple million DPS during it's duration.

Oil Geyser seems underpowered unless you are using a crit damage Lavamancer (and boosting). Maw seems too expensive and not effective enough to be useful. Fissures seem exploitable but I wouldn't waste my time with it.

All in all, I love the hero and I'm glad they released him a little undertuned as opposed to overtuned. A couple tweaks and Lavamancer can be really useful.

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i dislike how huge his towers are ...cant squeeze volcano on buff beam if theres 1 tower on it already, with buff beam and aura it costs 200du, which is only useful on big maps. the other 3towers are meh...

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His towers are pretty insane when used correctly. I'm still new-ish to NM4 myself, (Can only really handle life root and the first few areas solo) But wooow, the maw and the Volcano changed all that. With the maw's sphere and the volcano + eruption, you almost don't need anything else, it does so much damage and I'm not even greatly geared yet. (620 iPwr with little/no Lavamancer passives) 

Maw doesn't petrify ogre for long, but it does petrify all other bosses for a pretty long time. It does, however, frequently petrify ogre, enough to slow him down by a ton. Especially when it's been erupted. I haven't found a use for oil geysers, they're way too small and don't do enough damage even when you use erupt.

Overall I'm pretty happy with him, was happy enough for me to make a DPS and a Tower builder of em.

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@Pegazul quote:

Limit fissures to 2 per map. Change the crit scaling on it and increase the dps to 50% of LA (either that or change to 10 DU. Right now these are a wasted tower builder slot)

u re crazy enought to make lavamancer not worth to be dps ? the Fissures are his main resource now u cant place more than 2 i feel Scammed by the Desc and Dev stream

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Going to give my honest opinion about LM.

Cool and interesting character. 

However what do we have him for atm? to shine shoes?

Gameplay could be beat before him and after him.

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New hero release isnt about giving us a way to beat something we couldnt beat before. The purpose for new heroes is nothing more than new things to play with, new ways to build, new dps heroes to play with.


As for my thoughts, i read that hybrid thing, and, you cant do it. Ive been grinding gear on mine and ive yet t osee any hybrid gear drop at all. It seems liek trendy freaking Loot 2.0'd the lavamancer, and it feels stupid. They didnt bother Loot 2.0'ing the last released heroes, but suddenly decide to listen to all these carbon copy players who do nothing but the exact same thing every other player is doing and making chars strictly only 1 thing, the same thing every one else is doing, so i know im a minority here cause i wanan be unique and make different brands of chars work.


But Loot 2.0, a broken system, on the lavamancer? an active builder, a char designed to be able to be hybrid, and yet we cant get loot that drops hybrid for him. Honestly, it crushed my hype for him and has rather depressed me. I had my heart set on making a DP/AP build LM, cause he really doesnt seem like he needs defense health for any of his towers really ,cept maybe the maw if you actually want to make it some wall, which, any functional build would probably never do that mostly because of it's crazy DU cost. So to me, my LM coulda really shined, if i coulda place high dp towers, and had the AP to be rocking eruption or core ball for some pretty awesome hero dmg ontop of my pretty awesome towers. But no, since im a rare breed that likes to do things different, im on the losing side, cause tredny has to do what the masses want, and slap the broken loot 2.0 on him so all the carbon copies can be happy and get this fake "easy grinding" off an outdated system for their precious carbon copy gear.


Because of that, I'm simply not gonna have as much fun with LM and he is probably gonna end up like apprentice, everyone has one, i have one, but, i never really use him cause i cant give him a build that would really make him shine, stand out, be super fun, simply because of broken Loot2.0.


/vent

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@Pegazul quote:Limit fissures to 2 per map. Change the crit scaling on it and increase the dps to 50% of LA (either that or change to 10 DU. Right now these are a wasted tower builder slot)

DU cost on Fissures is a horrible idea.  Requiring DU for a DPS build is something that should never be done, otherwise you would be making a DPS hero only viable in niche cases where you have enough DU to build the extra defenses to generate heat.

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@gotrunks712 quote:


@Pegazul quote:Limit fissures to 2 per map. Change the crit scaling on it and increase the dps to 50% of LA (either that or change to 10 DU. Right now these are a wasted tower builder slot)

DU cost on Fissures is a horrible idea.  Requiring DU for a DPS build is something that should never be done, otherwise you would be making a DPS hero only viable in niche cases where you have enough DU to build the extra defenses to generate heat.

Yeah i agree making them cost DU isn't the best idea. But currently, for the 90% or so of people who don't plan on only playing lavamancer active for the rest of DD2s life time, he only has 3 towers.

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@Jojozityjo quote:

-snip-

I played DD1 with mostly hyrbid characters. But with DD2's gear system in general, the level you have to gimp yourself in order to do it is beyond reasonable for any of the real content. Plus, the lavamancer has really nothing to be gained from building DP/AP. Erruption currently has 0 scalings of any kind. And no tower/ability actualy encourages hybridization. Even with EV2 and AL, it still ends up being fairly subpar to hybridize them. Hopefully after the revamp, the gear overhaul they've mentioned a time or two will become the center focus, and finaly fix the crappy progression/diversity options that currently exist.

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Lavamancer seems pretty cool so far. The volcano is definitely an interesting tower, the maws are super neat, and the oil geysers seem like a solid slow (especially with i think 40%? max increase on slow rate). Oil geysers + flamebursts sounds like it would be a very viable setup (I don't have a tower apprentice right now to test that).

HOWEVER, the volcano seems to only be worthwhile when you're using eruption on it, which means you can't use a dps hero to help distract kobolds, or dps a boss down, or cc a lane that one of the maws died on, which brings me to the next point. Maws take a TON of mana to repair. I could just be resummoning spike blockades for the amount of mana it takes to repair the maws, and be much more effective at it. The stone effect takes way too long to actually stone enemies (unless you erupt the tower, in which case it's almost fast enough to stone enemies), especially if it targets a small enemy which dies before the stone effect finishes, which gives time for bigger enemies to walk up to the maw and beat on it.

He seems like a much better dps hero than a tower hero, overall. He tanks really well, especially with the harden short buff. Eruption is surprisingly good aoe damage, along with buffing towers, especially with the Floor is Lava passive. He seemed to hit very hard as well, though I don't think enflame actually did anything as far as i could tell?

I was really hoping his maws were going to be a lot better than they are. Right now they just aren't worth it to maintain, and take up way too much du if the map has more than 3 lanes that need to be covered (which is pretty much all of the maps)

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@xArcAngel quote:

I played DD1 with mostly hyrbid characters. But with DD2's gear system in general, the level you have to gimp yourself in order to do it is beyond reasonable for any of the real content. Plus, the lavamancer has really nothing to be gained from building DP/AP. Erruption currently has 0 scalings of any kind. And no tower/ability actualy encourages hybridization. Even with EV2 and AL, it still ends up being fairly subpar to hybridize them. Hopefully after the revamp, the gear overhaul they've mentioned a time or two will become the center focus, and finaly fix the crappy progression/diversity options that currently exist.

just wan to point out, LM, eruption dmg scales off AP, higher AP equals more dmg to mobs when you use it, plus it effects the lava pool if you got the Floor on Fire passives. Not to mention the molten ball move. So i coulda gone DP/AP and rock the volcano while erupting on mobs and punching balls at their face, or DP/HD so i can be up in their face with optimum swing dmg and bonus toward things like storm gloves.


EV2, none of her stuff has no use fo DH really, i dont like crit dmg and it's not THAT important, protons with DP only do pretty decent dmg, especially considering they can cover a rather long or large area. So my EV2, actually rocks DP/HD, for powerful beams and best buff beam, while being able to pelt things from afar with her atk and storm gloves i got going for her. Or could even go DP/AP on her so her proton cannon does even higher dmg if you dont mind the down time, or rocking dummy fun.


AL, his orcs, no good really, high hit box, dmg vulnerable, so not many use orcs, that just leaves archers or ramsters, msot do archers, I do archers, almsot only archer, all archers need, are DP, nothing else. So I could be going DP/AP on AL so i can rock strong archers and be a true active builder by actually using the AL and rocking a good Direct Command or watching my abyss stones just munch enemies.


Ive had experience with hybrid chars and they arent nearly as so weak or subpar as every one thinks they are, they are still highly functional chars, and my god the card space i save with them. All I need, is 1 EV, 1 AL, while all you people who focus use up, 2, 3, sometimes even 4 slots, and all that extra time leveling them, gearing them, etc. Yet i can do any and every map you can do just fine, i can dps just as fine any "focused" char.


I have a rahter deep love, and deep sense of fun, with hybrid chars, and so far in this game they dont feel lacking at all, they feel just as effective as any other char. Which is why im really bummed they robbed me of the hybrid action i could have done with LM. I could still hybrid, in a way, if i farm gear on AL and hope to god i get more general passives like Superconductor or Crit Chance, or Constructor, Regnerate, etc, but id still be losing out on some nice LM passives that any build, hybrid or otherwise, need to shine the best.

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@Jojozityjo quote:

just wan to point out, LM, eruption dmg scales off AP, higher AP equals more dmg to mobs when you use it, plus it effects the lava pool if you got the Floor on Fire passives. Not to mention the molten ball move. So i coulda gone DP/AP and rock the volcano while erupting on mobs and punching balls at their face, or DP/HD so i can be up in their face with optimum swing dmg and bonus toward things like storm gloves.

Doesn't scale for me at all. Tested it with full DP, full AP, full HD, zero points etc. and the dmg boost was the same...

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@zsolesz79 quote:

Doesn't scale for me at all. Tested it with full DP, full AP, full HD, zero points etc. and the dmg boost was the same...

Took me a minute to realize what he meant... I didn't even realize it did AOE damage around the lavamancer until I accidently launched myself off a catapult lol. He means the damage portion, not the boost.

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at zsoles...

no i meant the Damage it deals to mobs, when you use erupt, it does dmg to nearby mobs, with with almost full gear AP, i was doing 450k dmg to all mobs around me when i use it, not to mention the 30k dmg a second for 5 seconds for my Floor Is Fire passives on weapon and ring


at Arca...

arca, cant help but point out, "she" XD

im one of those girls who keeps b*tching at trendy to add alt genders,either as costumes or heroes, dont care, long as i can represent and/or feel more immersed into my chars lol

And yeah it's pretty strong dmg too, scales off AP and can be as good as the Huntressess piercing shot, better if you stack on the 5 second burn time with the passives.

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[[72087,users]]

Appologies, near impossible to tell genders, so I generally assume the most likely when it comes to the internet lol.

As far as the "alt" genders... I think Trendy prefers to create immersion by creating a true personality to each character through the long awaited story, animations, appearances,, sounds, postures, and etc. Different people have different artistic oppinions around creating immersion, and that seems to be Trendys. It seems they prefer to create the "alt" genders as seperate characters entirely this time (see the DD2 countess art/concepts that are still around) so that people that do desire characters of their gender (a lot of us don't care if its a cool design - hence my inflatuation with gunwitch) have those options available, while still creating immersive character designs that feel more uniquely assigned then a gender bending character.

Least thats what it seems like to me... Personally I like that approach, but can understand some prefering different artistic choices.

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I know it can be hard to tell gender on internet, hence why i usually avoid terms like he/she him/hers and just be like, "that person" XD


like i said, idc how they do it, long as i get alt genders, i really want the countess back though, she was my favorite, i love the .. how to say ... castle themed towers, Ballista, Cannons Barricades, they were my fav in DD1 and they still are here, i just hate having to use Squire to use them, i cannot immerse into him, he is, the most, ugh, char for me to use, at least wit happrentice or monk, or especially AL, they dont look so horrendously manly that i just feel all levels of wrong playing that char lol

but yeah, like i said, idc if they do alt gender with costumes, or alternative chars like Countess was to Squire. Personally idc too much for char backstory, yeah, it's cool for the lore, like reading a book, but when IM playing those chars, i make them into my own chars, add my own char, my own lore behind them, hence all my chars have special names instead of generic names such as "DefSquire" "Pain Knight" etc lol


and to try to keep this on topic, on the gender thing, ive kinda been okay with LM, cause i named him after a fusion of 2 chars, Pyro and Gaia, Pyrogaia, and im okay with using him, cause i have the lava gaurdian outfit, and Pyro and Gaia are genderless elemental beings, they could look male or female, their bodies are pretty .. morphable. So Pyrogaia is the fire and earth elemental people fused together into a weapon of mass volcanic destruction. So I can get behind that and kinda immerse, since it's a genderless elemental being. Granted Pyrogaia is essentially evil and wants their element to rule the world, but my excuse for them working with Etheria is, how can they rule with their element if the forces of the old ones are allowed to destroy the world? XD

(also it probably helps that LM in the lava guardian outfit has a REALLY nice ass to look at, ive never been like that before, but, dayum, dat ass of his >,> ) XD

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