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Fozzie

Strategic revamp a few things i'd like to see

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Build timer

Death in wave means no respawn in combat

Sub objective loss reduces DU, so if you lose the sub objective some of your towers become cursed to the value of the DU lost.

Heroes are much more aggressively targeted, at the moment you can stand around in mobs shooting at them, which makes no sense. I'd sure as hell hit someone if they were hitting me.

Dark Elf Warrior, please

Spiders, please

Mini Ogre mobs from the carni map, please

Fire Mages from the carni map, please

Environmental traps work both ways, so they can damage heroes too if activated by the mobs.

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@Fozzie quote:

Build timer

That would make things more interesting, but probably best to leave it out from easier difficulties.

Death in wave means no respawn in combat

As an optional hardcore mode sure.

Sub objective loss reduces DU, so if you lose the sub objective some of your towers become cursed to the value of the DU lost.

Only if the maps are redesigned.  At the moment some maps have sub-objectives that force building in very particular spots if you want to keep them, and in general letting sub-objects fall is one of the very few ways to introduce variety.

Spiders, please

Ugh, no.  At least not spawning everywhere like they did in DD1.

Environmental traps work both ways, so they can damage heroes too if activated by the mobs.

Why not, although given the static hitboxes they would be ridiculously easy to avoid.  Not many maps currently have environmental traps where enemies can get to them either.

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First of all i would like to apologise in advance for not using my main account. at present, it is not working.


Hey man! love your ideas for this update, but i would like to suggest some things~


Spiders

I've got to say, love the idea of bringing back spiders from Dungeon Defenders 1, however, if the spawns were to remain like they were in Dungeon Defenders 1, dropping by crystals, even if they won't damage it, can still cripple defenses to an astronomical point with the webs, and in Dungeon Defenders 2, I honestly feel that currently too many factors are lacking.


For instance, on Dungeon Defenders 2, while some people do have heavily insane damage per second characters, it still doesn't compare (in a ratio) to how it worked in Dungeon Defenders 1. in Dungeon Defenders 1, we could afford to have spiders spawn where they did because of several factors~

* The aura sizes in dungeon defenders 1 scaled much, much better (auras were the prime method for spider killing incase someone reading this does not know)

* Our damage per second characters were far enough developed

For some people this may make no sense, but if you think about it, in Dungeon Defenders 2, our auras still are not very big comparing to Dungeon Defenders 1, even without the buff beams, you still can't compare the two.

And for the second point, in Dungeon Defenders 1, we could afford to build auras close to our crystals and at spider spawns on completely peculiar parts of the map, specifically, parts that take away from the battle, mainly because of~

*The scaling size of the auras were big enough to cover the crystals and A LARGE portion of the map, and even without buff beams (I am aware we will get nodes coming soon, and quite possibly similar to Dungeon Defender 1's Ev towers) they were still pretty big.

*Our damage per second characters were developed enough to the point where we could afford to lose building towers on the front lines and instead build in the back, because if we lost towers, our damage per second characters were so good, that we could just run into a lane, and solo hold it.

Just my thoughts on the spider, but i'd love to see it come back.


The sub objectives


I have to say, tbd has said it all. On the overwhelming majority of maps with sub objectives, you have to really know what you are doing to defend them. I do not care who you are, on some maps, you simply can't defend the sub objective as things stand.


Heros are much more aggressively targeted

yeah, i think this has to happen.

It is a great idea, and defenses in Dungeon Defenders 2 fall fast enough as it is if the mobs aren't focused on you.

in Dungeon Defenders 1, part of the whole success of the map depended on this, especially on the heavy maps, such as Akatiti Jungle nightmare mode. most people cannot build this map on nightmare mode. and the tragic part about this is because it is because peoples builds got overloaded. No one new the map knew how to play it, and the harsh thing about this is that new player generally hadn't the stats to take on this map, he was done. And so, the strategy for these players, who could, but couldn't do it, was to dps the mobs, and to distract them to lets say, buy time for the aura to cause damage (remember, a good tower boost with a proper buff beam and aura did 60k damage per attack burst, and a good aura can hit over 3 times a second.


But of course, we do not have tower boost, i apologise for Dungeon Defenders 1 comparisons, but i felt that hey, they are both the same game, so it would be worth comparing, especially considering how much of a fun game Dungeon Defenders 1 was for the people that played after the first 2 or 3 game sessions :).


nice suggestions again.


P.S, I apologise for grammar mistakes.


Bye


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Build timer: Not yet.  I want to see how they redevelop the original characters first.  Unless you make it a toggle at the beginning of a map.  I like to experiment with different builds, and people mentioned only at higher difficulties for a build timer.  Well that's where I'll experiment the most, just because a build works in NM3 doesn't mean it will work in NM4.


Sub-Objective: Interesting idea, but instead of a penalty I would like to be rewarded for keeping it.  And experience is not a reward.  Have them drop a chest at the end too (to much), or just up the chance for golden chest/legendary loot at the end.


Mobs targeting hero's: Sounds interesting... ranged ones do at times.  But smaller ones would just try to attack you, while you stay slightly out of their range... you would become the wall (not needing one) because they would aggro you.  Heck, do enough damage to an ogre, and he will just walk beside your wall not attacking it because you are his goal, but he can't get you because of said wall.  I could see a lot of exploits with this if not done correctly.


These are just my opinions.  I like the possibilities and new challenges, but they just need to be well thought out.

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Death in wave means no respawn in combat

I think this should be an option

Sub objective loss reduces DU, so if you lose the sub objective some of your towers become cursed to the value of the DU lost.

I like the basic idea about this but I think to make this working there needs to be a total reconstruction of some maps. At the moment the subcores only prevent creative building by forcing us to build at a specific place. (especially the two first subcores) 


I would love to have a friendly fire mode where heroes can be hurt by their own defenses and damage their defenses if they shoot at them but CANNOT be hurt by other players' defenses or damage other players' defenses. (otherwise this would turn into a trollfest)


The only thing the build timer did for me was:

  • Practicing and repeating a build in normal/hard mode again and again until we memorized it
  • Go to higher difficulty to do the build we repeated again and again and again
  • Restart the map once one of us missclicked because there was not enough time anymore
  • Refuse to play public game on higher difficulties (unless we were beating it easily) because random people + build timer was terrifying 90% from our experience.

All in all I can say the build timer was my (<- subjective opinion!) biggest funkiller in DD1.


If any kind of build timer was introduced then I think it should be like this to take some of the frustration away:

People have a certain amount of time. Once that amount of time has passed, the enemies (who are already waiting behind the doors I guess) are receiving reinforcements over time. The longer the build takes the more enemies come. To prevent abusing those enemies should be marked somehow and give neither xp nor drops.

That way we could still take some time and continue the build without having to do everything perfect.

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I'm fine with Spiders returning, but LOL DEW's.

I don't want to see them when something more threatening is lurking in the shadows. The Dark Assassin is a DEW on steroids. It's so down right scary Trendy are afraid to release him.

Yes to Hardcore mode.

Yes to build timer, but make it optional. Also if you do choose it Loot should roll higher, otherwise what's the point?

How could I forget about mini Ogre mobs? Yes they need to come back as long as they are a threat.

I finally caught a glimpse of Fire Mages in a video, so yes to those as well.

I'm hoping for more unique enemies and a unified NM mode in the strategic map. NMV just sounds dumb to me. Oh look everyone NMV is the bestest. Where will it end? come join me in NMX? no thank you.

If you are going to continue to insult NM mode, than give me a new difficulty which has no stupid sequential numbers added to it.

Hell mode would suffice.

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I'll admit that personally i find build timers to be nothing useful. It adds nothing to the game at all. Its simply memorization and if you mess up restart. That bring no new fun to the game and no actual gameplay. Also agree with a previous poster that the spiders are a bad idea... at the moment, there is too little we know about how the mechanics in this game will go to bring them back yet.

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Eh, I figure, some of the suggestions here could be added as DD1 style difficulty options, y'know, higher risk, higher rewards. 

For DD2, this could be accomplished by moving the lower iPWR limit for a map up for each option (instead of moving the upper / both) So instead of giving over the max iPWR gear, a map would give more of the near max gear. So for example, a 660-700 ipwr range map, with a couple of difficulty options enabled, could become 680-700 ipwr map.

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Basically spiders were horrible annoying at DD1 but that's what they were meant to be - and they did a good job.

I think spiders cannot return like that in DD2 because in DD1 we mostly countered spiders be having defenses facing each other. DD2 wouldn't allow this because of the minimalistic defense range compared to DD1.

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