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pAWHNSHOPpIMP

Really disappointed with how you acquire Abyss Lord.

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I haven't played this game in months. The Abyss Lord made me want to come back to the game because it was something new. I love the game but got bored with the same 4 characters from before. I logged in so excited to try something finally "NEW" in this "NEW" game and imagine my disappointment when I found out my only options where to spend $15 or spend days and days grinding on characters I already am bored with.

I have already spent money on this game. I don't mind buying cosmetics. I don't mind the expensive price of them either. I'm not spending money on a character I'm not even sure I will like to play however. I logged out and I doubt I will ever be logging in again because you don't put paywalls on content and that is exactly what you just did.

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Wholeheartedly agree, I found myself in the same situation today. Haven't played in months and got hyped about the new hero and was really looking forward to playing with him and then I saw the prices and it instantly made me regret paying 30$ for the game.

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I'll agree.

Just looking back to DD1 (Which was a completed product with TONS AND TONS OF DLC), even then - heroes were 4 bucks.

I could splash 4 bucks 20 times over for heroes and be A-OKAY with it, minus Barbarian because I'm not a fan of it. 15 bucks for a hero is a bit steep. That's...the cost of a decent non-huge game. I know it's unimportant, but I could do better for 15 bucks, even if I were to dip into the cancerous pool that is League of Legends, for example. One hero unlock is (not counting grind-bucks) 975RP / $7.50. 


The 15 dollar price tag should be the bundle price, in my opinion. 15 for just the hero is too high... I think it's kind of a stab in the neck too, since the monthly quest present isn't exactly easy - making the hero purchase with dosh the better/quicker option. (Which may be the point, but at least give a feasible goal for the FIRST MONTHLY TOWARDS HERO UNLOCKS! Really? Environmental kills? Even with suppliments from daily wins and such on top of the monthly, it's going to take MONTHS to unlock new content for free! You'll kill the free players who become dissatisfied with core content heroes and leave your whales who'd ride the Trendy Train no matter how many bad stops it'd make.. That's business for you, but a lesser player-base in the making...)



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Agreed. Me and my buddy that I play this with logged in and saw the 12,000 medal requirement.  We immediately logged out.  


The new content is supposed to help get players back in to the game and playing again.  Why would people bored with the same 4 characters in their deck want to spend another 1-3 months grinding (with characters they're bored with) to play the new Abyss Lord?


When the last 3 get released, at least by then you'll have medals saved up and can immediately buy the character to play with them. 


This is just going to cause people to leave for good since they've been bored with their character deck for the last 2-3 months and refuse to grind for another 1-3 months to even touch the new content.

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100-150 per average match = 80-120 matches. So about several months for the average gamer (or a year for the average weekend gamer - may as well pay at that point).

Though I did just make 5% of required sum in a few matches while completing no dailies. If I got some of those done I'd be up to 10%.

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You dont enjoy playing the game, you just want to try out abyss lord.

Fair enogh! Here you go!

Ooum... Thats not how it works, rip the whine haha >;)

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Players should be encouraged to purchase the hero. This is done by making it obviously possible to grind (now the medal price has decreased) but also use a price that is encouraging to buy it. Thinking about 15 dollars I would rather buy an additional game for less money although I like to support DD2.

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I wish I remember sphere prices. Anyway, I'm don't consider myself a hardcore player, and also I play solo - because I like to play with friends, using voice and all, and these days none of my friends play DD2 - and I've had some spare gems, so I've got the full Abyss Lord deal and scratched that itch. So far I've got my AL to lvl 46 (just got to 46), already have 3 of his spheres (Fan of Knights, Steam Powered (actually been meaning to ask if this was a pun with Steam, the store...), and Mana Cap Increase) and I feel it's been a whole lotta fun...


But I do have to give you guys some credit - I do too get sick of the same game after a while, and the AL was one of the reasons that got me playing again. I have no doubts that I'd be joining the rant train with you guys if I hadn't had those spare gems and had to grind my way to get it. Specially since, even though I have one of each hero lvl 50, their iPWR lvl is barely enough to get me on NM1.


So, yeah, I do think it's ranting and all, but I agree with you guys that the $15 tag is a bit too steep, specially comparing with DD1 and it's cache of DLCs, and the alpha x complete game comparison.


But all I saw here was people dissing out, no constructive criticism. Why the hell do you waste your time just complaining, folks? =p Why not make a simple suggestion, like, "Hey, Trendy guys, you should give us a day for playing Abyss Lord for free, so we can see if we like it!" - no? Too much to ask for? I know I'd pitch behind an idea like that. Even better: wait for the new sleeve of heroes to finish coming up, we've got at least Series EV2.0 and one other incoming ~at least~, and THEN Trendy could give us a day to play with them all for free. Not necessarily a single day, or not even a full day - hell know, usually I can't play more than 2h a day; so make it that each user has 2 free hours of each of the new heroes. How's that sound? "Disposable heroes", you get them, you play with them, you lose them after. Didn't they had implemented a way that could be used for this in that Carnival map? What, with normalizing levels and inventory? There you go.

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I agree with the Original poster.

I also quit this game cause it became boring. and came back to try the new hero.

Like the rest i was super disappointed when the first screen showed wanna play the new hero? better buy it.
When i found out how long i had to grind to get it it put me off. for some1 who is already bored with the game and to ask them to grind for weeks (for some months) is a no go.

For trying to get gamers back into the game this coins system is an utter failure.
Doesnt mean the whole system is bad. I have since bought the abyss lord and am now happily playing the game again and saving up the coins i get playing this new hero for the next one. It works for a continues stream of new hero releases just not for the very first one.


Also cant help but add that this made a little alarm bell go off in the back of my head. there are some shady developers that use constructions like this to (nearly) force people to pay by making the free way impossibly hard/long/unattractive. I hope Trendy doesn't continue on this path.

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I don't have a problem having to grind for an in-game currency to unlock new content. That system works fine in other free to play games and it can work here too. The problem is 12k is absurdly high, even 10k when it gets lowered after a couple weeks is too high. You get a mere 200ish from a daily quest, something like 2k from the monthly quest, and a pittance when you win a map (Even a high difficulty NM4 map).

This is just a balance issue right now, at the moment the grind is way too high. It can and should be adjusted, this is the kind of thing I expect Trendy to mess up during an alpha/beta/whatever we are. I just hope they make it right sooner rather than later.

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Personally, I got 8k gems sitting in my pouch, but this alleged "grind" for AL is just so laughably short that I decided to save my gems for another occasion and get medals instead.

I got 5760 medals to go, and I spent... zero effort in getting the current medals I have. A couple of dailies and a monthly. Sure, things are getting interesting now, as I'll only get around 250 medals a day from dailies. I could play for few hours to get that to 500 medals per day, and then be done in about 12 more days. Or just daily it for the next 24 days. Eitherway, it's pretty easy.

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@proveisso quote:

I wish I remember sphere prices. Anyway, I'm don't consider myself a hardcore player, and also I play solo - because I like to play with friends, using voice and all, and these days none of my friends play DD2 - and I've had some spare gems, so I've got the full Abyss Lord deal and scratched that itch. So far I've got my AL to lvl 46 (just got to 46), already have 3 of his spheres (Fan of Knights, Steam Powered (actually been meaning to ask if this was a pun with Steam, the store...), and Mana Cap Increase) and I feel it's been a whole lotta fun...


But I do have to give you guys some credit - I do too get sick of the same game after a while, and the AL was one of the reasons that got me playing again. I have no doubts that I'd be joining the rant train with you guys if I hadn't had those spare gems and had to grind my way to get it. Specially since, even though I have one of each hero lvl 50, their iPWR lvl is barely enough to get me on NM1.


So, yeah, I do think it's ranting and all, but I agree with you guys that the $15 tag is a bit too steep, specially comparing with DD1 and it's cache of DLCs, and the alpha x complete game comparison.


But all I saw here was people dissing out, no constructive criticism. Why the hell do you waste your time just complaining, folks? =p Why not make a simple suggestion, like, "Hey, Trendy guys, you should give us a day for playing Abyss Lord for free, so we can see if we like it!" - no? Too much to ask for? I know I'd pitch behind an idea like that. Even better: wait for the new sleeve of heroes to finish coming up, we've got at least Series EV2.0 and one other incoming ~at least~, and THEN Trendy could give us a day to play with them all for free. Not necessarily a single day, or not even a full day - hell know, usually I can't play more than 2h a day; so make it that each user has 2 free hours of each of the new heroes. How's that sound? "Disposable heroes", you get them, you play with them, you lose them after. Didn't they had implemented a way that could be used for this in that Carnival map? What, with normalizing levels and inventory? There you go.

I do agree with the OP, did that same thing today, first time since ~2 hours after the Harbinger update.  however, i agree with proveisso here, and if he hasn't already, will make a suggestion thread for it.  It's not enough to complain about a problem, but suggest how it could possibly be changed.  me, i like this idea proveisso said, like a rent-a-hero booth.  

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Now, that the update had been here for some days, I think the medal price is not that bad. Main problem is all of us started with zero medals. Later on a lot of us have already hoarded defender medals just like wyvern tokens while new players can check out the basic heroes first and gather some medals at the same time.

If I felt like not grinding for defender medals I'd gladly spend 5 to 8 bucks for a new hero. As it is now I'd just prefer the grind. For me the price is no problem because I can choose to grind for medals - I just think it is sad for Trendy that hey lose some potential customers whose amount may make up for the lower price.

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Still no change I see. Just uninstalled the game. Learned my lesson. Won't ever be installing it again. Good job devs, you just lost a customer that's willing to pay for cosmetics just not content. That is how you run a successful F2P game.

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@pAWHNSHOPpIMP quote:

Still no change I see. Just uninstalled the game. Learned my lesson. Won't ever be installing it again. Good job devs, you just lost a customer that's willing to pay for cosmetics just not content. That is how you run a successful F2P game.

Are you justgoibg to copypasta this same response on every thread? 

This is just silly..  What kind of f2p games do you play that doesnt pay/playwall new content?


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^ The kind who wants everything for nothing. I have found most F2P games with micro transactions are a hit and miss. Some games are more easier to manage for free than others. You just have to put in extra work. Others, just rip you off at every corner they can, like Game of War or Clash of Clans do. Or throw a catch 22, like how the official Ragnarok Online won't let you do Tier 3 classes unless you join their pay servers or get lucky and find someone who is willing to trade you for the upgrade item in exchange for in-game currency. I think this game isn't super game-breaking with the Gems. However, this is also coming from the fact I joined on Day 1 Pre-Alpha, so I get many helpful things like all my bags are max size and about 3000+ in start up Gems.


The Hero Medal grind doesn't bother me at all. 1 week in and I have more than half of the 10000 medals for next week. From what I seen, those who are grinding for Medals are roughly where I am as well. I decided to earn it the hard way as I was planning to overhaul some characters and pets for the future patches anyways, so I might as well kill a couple of Goblins with 1 stone.


As I have brought up in many threads, just simply do your Daily Wins and reroll your Daily Mission to the highest possible Medal score, balancing it with the secondary rewards as well (I have been going for Pet stuff myself since the Affection Candy helps a LOT). The monthly is also easy if you use Onslaught maps Siphon Site D or Liferoot Forest (which have instant kill traps), especially if you roll Horde. It also helps to have knockback capabilities yourself, like the Monk or Squire, so you can push non-Grounded off the map while the traps are on Cooldown. 


For players who at least have time each day to play this game, this isn't a big deal. You should have the medals ready when the cost drops to 10000 next week. For weekenders, it might be an issue, especially since you can only have 3 Daily jobs and you just wasted 2 of them by not coming online. You can also wait until the game goes Beta or Official and pay attention to any sales or Hero Medal savings that happen and steal it from a sale. In other words: Be smart with your wallet and don't purchase on impulse unless you are willing to do the necessary work.


@pAWHNSHOPpIMP quote:

Still no change I see. Just uninstalled the game. Learned my lesson. Won't ever be installing it again. Good job devs, you just lost a customer that's willing to pay for cosmetics just not content. That is how you run a successful F2P game.

Lols. One less player to bother us then. It is kind of funny how you complain about how you aren't willing to do whatever it takes to get the Abyss Lord, despite the fact the Hero Medals are actually EXTREMELY easy to amass quickly.

It is also kind of sad you have this attitude and I have put down maybe about 4000-5000 gems worth of Cosmetics and 2 bags and I am willing to do this. Lazy much?

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[quote=Chrisdyan;368542585859041185]https://trendyent.zendesk.com/hc/en-us/articles/203703010-Will-Dungeon-Defenders-II-ever-be-pay-to-win-Quick-answer-No-not-ever-and it even says it again:

Dungeon Defenders II will never be pay-to-win. One more time: DD2 will never, ever be pay-to-win. Players will never be able to pay for gameplay ADVANTAGE..Well at least the new heroes are op compared to old, and can be only obtained with money. So they should change that in the FAQ.Have joined group also before christmas but still no galactic weapons, not in the chest under the christmas tree, not from the board next to knight commander(asked to join the group even had joined, now its not there anymore) or from harbringer.

[/quote]

As far as I know the galactic wepons are suppose to be droped in some kind of map, sorry didn't check again. Have to agree that Trendy is being to vague about these weapons.

1) The hero's can be earned with gameplay, through coin rewards for each match. The option to buy is for the impatient.

2) Trendy only has the dungeon defenders games to keep them afloat, with the first and eternity not really sells a lot of coppies and now DD2 being free to play, you really can't blame them for making THINGS THAT CAN BE UNLOCKED, also purchasable.


P.S. Your post is wasted here unfortunately, post this on the dungeon defenders 2 page.

There it'll come under the eyes of the developers and they can explain/ do something about your complaint. I will add this on the forum myself to help get the exposure needed.


^This is a discussion between me and one other player on the steam FAQ ^ would love it if the devs could reply there but all in all just wanted to let people know

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League of legends and Hearthstone both successful games have this setup, Either you grind it out for a long time and dont pay a penny, or you pay some cash upfront and you can spend all the other currencies on something else.

Are you saying that this model doesnt work? haha get out, you know where the door is.


This business model has been proven successful and is one of the biggest at this current time, Most good F2P Games work likes this, But I guess there is always someone that is going to complain.


Those of you that think this is a scam, You probably just dont like the game anyway, Then piss off, we dont want you here and you probably dont want to be here anyway.


They are trying to make money to pay their employees, They have families to feed, house to pay for, rents, Car gas, You name it.


And then you sitting there like a spoiled brat "BUT I WANT IT FOR FREE INSTANTLY BUUU!!"


Ugh you guys make me sick.


Get a job.

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The only issue I have is the cost to buy the hero. I was going to buy the AL but since there are so many heroes coming out and I wont be spending 15 dollars for all of them I now need to wait to see what the other heroes can do. I don't want to get buyers remorse when say EV comes out and I wish I had not bought AL. The bad part is this will go on for a long time since there are so many heroes coming out.  5 bucks to me seems reasonable and an amount I could be happy spending on multiple heroes.


as far as the grinding part goes I like the fact that they reduce the grind after what 2 weeks? Most companies  keep the elevated price until the next new hero comes out which could be over a month.

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@ZirzoR quote:

League of legends and Hearthstone both successful games have this setup, Either you grind it out for a long time and dont pay a penny, or you pay some cash upfront and you can spend all the other currencies on something else.

Are you saying that this model doesnt work? haha get out, you know where the door is.


This business model has been proven successful and is one of the biggest at this current time, Most good F2P Games work likes this, But I guess there is always someone that is going to complain.


Those of you that think this is a scam, You probably just dont like the game anyway, Then piss off, we dont want you here and you probably dont want to be here anyway.


They are trying to make money to pay their employees, They have families to feed, house to pay for, rents, Car gas, You name it.


And then you sitting there like a spoiled brat "BUT I WANT IT FOR FREE INSTANTLY BUUU!!"


Ugh you guys make me sick.


Get a job.

You sound like the guy with the balls to charge premium dollar for a product in alpha (ie sux) and then say it's to feed your families because you never secured investors to fund the project while it was being developed (like is normally done) because you're a maverick 


jobs be damned, we need more people like you in leadership positions as it seems you have a really good idea of what it takes to be super successful :^)

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I'm honestly a little concerned about the price model. Not because I wouldn't spend money on the game, but because they're, in my opinion, using the wrong kind of approach.

This game was originally intended to be a Moba/Tower Defense hybrid monster child from the abyss. Well, they booted the Moba aspect of it, something I'm not too sad about. However, they appear to be keeping the same selling method as a moba.

I don't think this will work in their favor for the reason following. In a Moba, there was a reason to own every single character. It gives you an opportunity to learn them, thus giving you a competitive edge. Mobas are a competition, and knowing what you're playing against often means playing it yourself. Also, mobas are all about the next new competitive character that's released, incentivizing tons of people to buy the character right out the gate with the hopes of learning how it works, hopefully mastering it and developing the next big game strategy for that character.

Well, DD2 doesn't have that. There's no competition. If you get a new character, it's the same experience every time, just with a slightly different play style. This is a problem! The value of a character in DD2 will not be held up to the standards of a character in an everyday Moba as a result.

If players find a set strategy that works, they're going to stick to it. Farming tokens is really no big deal in DD2, and why spend money on a character when you won't even be able to use them immediately anyhow? You'll be stuck leveling someone from 1-50 and getting them geared up for the time you actually unite them with your roster. The payout of a new character isn't quite the same as it is in a moba.

I admit, I spent some of my founders gems on mister summoner C'thulhu, and I love him, to the point that I haven't even bothered to play any other character. The value of their next release is minimal, simply because I could just play as my favorite character and use him to farm tokens. Why spend money on a character I'm probably going to rotate out for the next release anyhow? This game just isn't the moba it was intended to be, which makes me question their choice in price model.

But hey, if it does work for the game, more power to the dev team. Mobas make a lot of money with their methods. Maybe DD2 will, too.

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@Pachipachio quote:


@ZirzoR quote:

League of legends and Hearthstone both successful games have this setup, Either you grind it out for a long time and dont pay a penny, or you pay some cash upfront and you can spend all the other currencies on something else.

Are you saying that this model doesnt work? haha get out, you know where the door is.


This business model has been proven successful and is one of the biggest at this current time, Most good F2P Games work likes this, But I guess there is always someone that is going to complain.


Those of you that think this is a scam, You probably just dont like the game anyway, Then piss off, we dont want you here and you probably dont want to be here anyway.


They are trying to make money to pay their employees, They have families to feed, house to pay for, rents, Car gas, You name it.


And then you sitting there like a spoiled brat "BUT I WANT IT FOR FREE INSTANTLY BUUU!!"


Ugh you guys make me sick.


Get a job.

You sound like the guy with the balls to charge premium dollar for a product in alpha (ie sux) and then say it's to feed your families because you never secured investors to fund the project while it was being developed (like is normally done) because you're a maverick 


jobs be damned, we need more people like you in leadership positions as it seems you have a really good idea of what it takes to be super successful :^)

And you sound like the guy that I dont want to talk to, Good day.

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It's a little bit hilarious you post with absolute vitriol,

"haha get out, you know where the door is", 

"spoiled brat",

"ugh you guys make me sick",

about things you can't even draw an accurate metaphor for and then leave when challenged.   Saying hearthstone/LOL is similar to DD2 was especially dumb because you compared two titled that have had full releases and GIANT teams working on them to ensure they're complete titles.  DD2 is in alpha.  Was in pre alpha a few months ago, lol


Many of us don't know what's going on under the hood at trendy but it seems you don't have any idea about the financing of small projects (needing to price your in-development product - AN UNFINISHED PRODUCT - at premium prices so that you can feed your families and pay bills?  lol?  what are investors?  venture capital? kickstarter? loans?) but you have the audacity to come in and lecture people about it?  And to top it all off, just walk away when challenged? 


lmao, good day indeed.  

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