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Tang

Blaze Balloon Fixed and now op - Ramparts Solo

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Skip to 5:55 if you do not wish to see building phase

Just saying victory smell finally works like intended and work surprisingly well, so worth consider using now.

Also recently did duo run of ramparts with Naxtilian (link) we have now completed doing solo runs.  If interested you can check his version of his solo run at his post in the following link https://dungeondefenders.com/2/topic/130709/nm4-incursion-ramparts-solo

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Blaze balloons are pretty awesome now; it's just they require a lot more farming for perfect passives, while anyone can leech a couple games of NM4 incursion, equip some green gear, and all of a sudden have traps that can clear most NM4 content.

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

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@gigazelle quote:

Blaze balloons are pretty awesome now; it's just they require a lot more farming for perfect passives, while anyone can leech a couple games of NM4 incursion, equip some green gear, and all of a sudden have traps that can clear most NM4 content.

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

And so can Lightning auras ;) 4x attack rate and same crit dmg + higher base dmg = chaos traps go home.

But yeah blaze is also build by huntress so they can work for solo builds :)

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@DKperfection quote:


@gigazelle quote:

Blaze balloons are pretty awesome now; it's just they require a lot more farming for perfect passives, while anyone can leech a couple games of NM4 incursion, equip some green gear, and all of a sudden have traps that can clear most NM4 content.

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

And so can Lightning auras ;) 4x attack rate and same crit dmg + higher base dmg = chaos traps go home.

But yeah blaze is also build by huntress so they can work for solo builds :)

Due to fact that traps still dominate magical lanes its hard to see people look at balloons which is a shame and I have to admit I was one of them people, but with victory smell finally working I decided to try them out and with the extra burn rate I certainly feel they are very effective, the sheer amount of area they can cover especially at higher tiers is so good especially great for covering multiple lanes.

Personally I find the elementals great with dealing with kobalds, but balloon lacks that burst to deal with kobalds before they start charging until higher tiers. However I personally feel there damage output towards other enemies is generally greater even without the perfect balloon gear, In  group play combine with a geyser and a la I believe they could be deadly.

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@dwade123 quote:

It's not that balloon got way better. It's just that NM4 is a kid joke now.

Yet we don't see you running around solo'ing NM4 incursions....




@Tang quote:


@DKperfection quote:


@gigazelle quote:

Blaze balloons are pretty awesome now; it's just they require a lot more farming for perfect passives, while anyone can leech a couple games of NM4 incursion, equip some green gear, and all of a sudden have traps that can clear most NM4 content.

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

And so can Lightning auras ;) 4x attack rate and same crit dmg + higher base dmg = chaos traps go home.

But yeah blaze is also build by huntress so they can work for solo builds :)

Due to fact that traps still dominate magical lanes its hard to see people look at balloons which is a shame and I have to admit I was one of them people, but with victory smell finally working I decided to try them out and with the extra burn rate I certainly feel they are very effective, the sheer amount of area they can cover especially at higher tiers is so good especially great for covering multiple lanes.

Personally I find the elementals great with dealing with kobalds, but balloon lacks that burst to deal with kobalds before they start charging until higher tiers. However I personally feel there damage output towards other enemies is generally greater even without the perfect balloon gear, In  group play combine with a geyser and a la I believe they could be deadly.

Now i exclusively play in group or with at least 1 other guy (solo = yawn) and blaze balloon was extremely good even before this patch. We tossed out chaos traps long time ago when i got my monk geared for LA because even LA has way higher dmg than chaos traps....

But in solo play you don't have the flexibility to test out that stuff because you NEED explosive traps for magic lanes :/

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Which brings a problem: we keep getting upgrades for a tower in particular, so instead of making a "builder" character, you make a "X tower" char, unless you want to farm the peeeeerrrrfect gear for two towers + tower crit chance, which is such a slim chance you can spend over 50 hours of farming without even getting a "good" piece.

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@gigazelle quote:

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

I'd submit that there's no such thing as perfect blaze balloons. There are too many passives to collect. You cannot get full Phoenix Call, Phoenix's Luck, Phoenix Flame, Victory Smell, Volatile Schematics, and Defense Crit Chance because we're limited to 3 passives per item.

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@Nefhith quote:

unless you want to farm the peeeeerrrrfect gear for two towers + tower crit chance, which is such a slim chance you can spend over 50 hours of farming without even getting a "good" piece.

I don't think it is even possible. 2 towers have more passives than you can possibly get. Frostbite/Flamethrower might be the only exception, but you'd still have to sacrifice something. On your weapon you would not be able to get Frost Fire, Snowstorm, Pyromania, and Defense Crit Chance, and you'd have to skip Vector Corrector on everything in order to get Frosty Power, Pyromania, and Defense Crit Chance on other gear.

For Squire towers you'd need: Defense Power, Defense Crit Damage, and Defense Health (for Splody Harpoon) then for passives you'd need Black Arrow, Speedy Harpoon, Splody Harpoon, Shellshock, Iron Core, Vector Corrector, Defense Crit Chance. It's just not possible.

For Huntress traps, PDTs and blaze balloons you'd need: Defense Power, Defense Crit Damage, Defense Health, Phoenix Call, Phoenix's Luck, Phoenix Flame, Victory Smell, Tripwire, Volatile Schematics, Exploding Poison, Towering Poison, Envenom, Vector Correct, Defense Crit Chance. That's 11 different passives, pick any 2 of the 3 and you still can't do it.

For Monk it's actually impossible to use his 2 best defenses because Purge Evil and the harbinger LSA passive are mutually exclusive.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:
@gigazelle quote:

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

I'd submit that there's no such thing as perfect blaze balloons. There are too many passives to collect. You cannot get full Phoenix Call, Phoenix's Luck, Phoenix Flame, Victory Smell, Volatile Schematics, and Defense Crit Chance because we're limited to 3 passives per item.

Phoenix Call, Victory Smell and Defense Crit chance on the weapon
Phoenix Flame, Phoenix Luck, and Defense Crit Chance on all gear

If you had that combination of gear on legendaries, I could see T1 blaze balloons easily achieving 15K DPS. You'd have close to 100% crit chance with defense crit chance + phoenix luck, and your crit damage would be amazing with phoenix flame.

It would take an ungodly amount of time to farm for that, though.

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@gigazelle quote:


@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:
@gigazelle quote:

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

I'd submit that there's no such thing as perfect blaze balloons. There are too many passives to collect. You cannot get full Phoenix Call, Phoenix's Luck, Phoenix Flame, Victory Smell, Volatile Schematics, and Defense Crit Chance because we're limited to 3 passives per item.

Phoenix Call, Victory Smell and Defense Crit chance on the weapon
Phoenix Flame, Phoenix Luck, and Defense Crit Chance on all gear

If you had that combination of gear on legendaries, I could see T1 blaze balloons easily achieving 15K DPS. You'd have close to 100% crit chance with defense crit chance + phoenix luck, and your crit damage would be amazing with phoenix flame.

It would take an ungodly amount of time to farm for that, though.

Or just have ungodly luck :D

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@DKperfection quote:


@dwade123 quote:

It's not that balloon got way better. It's just that NM4 is a kid joke now.

Yet we don't see you running around solo'ing NM4 incursions....




@Tang quote:


@DKperfection quote:


@gigazelle quote:

Blaze balloons are pretty awesome now; it's just they require a lot more farming for perfect passives, while anyone can leech a couple games of NM4 incursion, equip some green gear, and all of a sudden have traps that can clear most NM4 content.

I'd submit that perfect blaze balloons can outperform perfect elemental chaos traps.

And so can Lightning auras ;) 4x attack rate and same crit dmg + higher base dmg = chaos traps go home.

But yeah blaze is also build by huntress so they can work for solo builds :)

Due to fact that traps still dominate magical lanes its hard to see people look at balloons which is a shame and I have to admit I was one of them people, but with victory smell finally working I decided to try them out and with the extra burn rate I certainly feel they are very effective, the sheer amount of area they can cover especially at higher tiers is so good especially great for covering multiple lanes.

Personally I find the elementals great with dealing with kobalds, but balloon lacks that burst to deal with kobalds before they start charging until higher tiers. However I personally feel there damage output towards other enemies is generally greater even without the perfect balloon gear, In  group play combine with a geyser and a la I believe they could be deadly.

Now i exclusively play in group or with at least 1 other guy (solo = yawn) and blaze balloon was extremely good even before this patch. We tossed out chaos traps long time ago when i got my monk geared for LA because even LA has way higher dmg than chaos traps....

But in solo play you don't have the flexibility to test out that stuff because you NEED explosive traps for magic lanes :/

eh so wrong, you dont need them in solo @.@. You can do with LA too or flames. I used LA before they got strong for solo already, and using flames now too for solo and group play as you know. Flames and cannons all the way in solo xD.

But yeah blaze finaly joining the ranks of the 3 top magic defenses. Though flames is probably still the best, followed by LA and blaze now, and lowest is traps. Kinda happy alot are just to lazy to switch over to the better defenses, with that we will at last always have some variations in builds now XD.

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[[94093,users]] he isn't wrong.  He said explosive traps in magic resist lanes.  

Magic damage is in a nice place.  Flamethrower was always best magic damage with crit... just have to deal with kobold fliers and the purple lightning bug things since they can always/usually 'see' the flamethrowers 

LA either was always really good or had its crit damage scaling fixed in that crit dmg patch, not sure - but now it's pretty good because at maxish gear crit damage is twice its attack damage

Flameburst is really good too.  Unsure if they changed the way crits work on its aoe since the last patch that they did stuff with crit spread but afaik its AoE splash still gets full crit damage... so that's a lot of 'free' damage

Geyser is 'ok' as a one-of for support

And now balloon seems to be very competitive now that the passives were fixed


Now if only we had that kind of diversity in physical damage :(  it's basically only cannons or traps and you don't want both out in the same map.  We don't even have very many physical damage towers to think of it..

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@Pachipachio quote:

dreamanime he isn't wrong.  He said explosive traps in magic resist lanes.  

Magic damage is in a nice place.  Flamethrower was always best magic damage with crit... just have to deal with kobold fliers and the purple lightning bug things since they can always/usually 'see' the flamethrowers 

LA either was always really good or had its crit damage scaling fixed in that crit dmg patch, not sure - but now it's pretty good because at maxish gear crit damage is twice its attack damage

Flameburst is really good too.  Unsure if they changed the way crits work on its aoe since the last patch that they did stuff with crit spread but afaik its AoE splash still gets full crit damage... so that's a lot of 'free' damage

Geyser is 'ok' as a one-of for support

And now balloon seems to be very competitive now that the passives were fixed


Now if only we had that kind of diversity in physical damage :(  it's basically only cannons or traps and you don't want both out in the same map.  We don't even have very many physical damage towers to think of it..

Totally agree I would like to see some physical defence diversity in the next coming hero's and not to be bound by the hero deck to use them. I also believe as someone mention that Phoenix luck is actually unavailable on armours capping at 56% crit if the sphere is used for balloons . I do like the fact balloons can cover a large area potentially saving mana on double lanes in maps like ramps and Betsy and verymana efficient in terms of upgrading defenses. I'd be looking forward to the ballista buff coming aswell as I do have all 3 passives on a sword ready to try it out. Jedi swords FTW :)

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@Pachipachio quote:

dreamanime he isn't wrong.  He said explosive traps in magic resist lanes.  

Magic damage is in a nice place.  Flamethrower was always best magic damage with crit... just have to deal with kobold fliers and the purple lightning bug things since they can always/usually 'see' the flamethrowers 

LA either was always really good or had its crit damage scaling fixed in that crit dmg patch, not sure - but now it's pretty good because at maxish gear crit damage is twice its attack damage

Flameburst is really good too.  Unsure if they changed the way crits work on its aoe since the last patch that they did stuff with crit spread but afaik its AoE splash still gets full crit damage... so that's a lot of 'free' damage

Geyser is 'ok' as a one-of for support

And now balloon seems to be very competitive now that the passives were fixed


Now if only we had that kind of diversity in physical damage :(  it's basically only cannons or traps and you don't want both out in the same map.  We don't even have very many physical damage towers to think of it..

oh yep, still wrong though. Cannons are way better. High damage, high boss burst, clears the air on it's own, if you put in a freeze it even instant kills high health targets or random charger/bomber get killed by them easily too. I love them in solo and group play for that.

But like anything it's probably more what people love to play with.

The ballista on the other hand is still kinda lacking, the damage ain't that bad though but it misses still abit more punch somehow.

More diversity in physical damage defenses would be nice like you said =). Would love to see that too. Maybe on one of the new heroes.

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@Tang quote:

 I also believe as someone mention that Phoenix luck is actually unavailable on armours capping at 56% crit if the sphere is used for balloons .

Hhmm.... I don't think that's correct though unless you mean a hard cap....

The max amount of crit chance you can get from gear for blaze is 5%x4 from Chest, Boots, Helm, Gloves and then 13%x2 from Weapon and Relic that max out to 46%, now with just the large sphere designed for blaze it does indeed land on 56%... But you can get another 10% from small and medium spheres :) I personally only go for +3% crit chance on small sphere so my personal max would be 59% but the total amount of crit chance you can get from all spheres + gear + the base of 3% from just being lvl 50 would in absolute total end at 69% :) 

Just fyi xD

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@DKperfection quote:


@Tang quote:

 I also believe as someone mention that Phoenix luck is actually unavailable on armours capping at 56% crit if the sphere is used for balloons .

Hhmm.... I don't think that's correct though unless you mean a hard cap....

The max amount of crit chance you can get from gear for blaze is 5%x4 from Chest, Boots, Helm, Gloves and then 13%x2 from Weapon and Relic that max out to 46%, now with just the large sphere designed for blaze it does indeed land on 56%... But you can get another 10% from small and medium spheres :) I personally only go for +3% crit chance on small sphere so my personal max would be 59% but the total amount of crit chance you can get from all spheres + gear + the base of 3% from just being lvl 50 would in absolute total end at 69% :) 

Just fyi xD

*whispers with a faint voice* b but the standart def crit(from gear and spheres) is hard capped even for them on 30% :d the special passiv and spheres are what can raise it further. isn't it like that?

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@dreamanime quote:


@DKperfection quote:


@Tang quote:

 I also believe as someone mention that Phoenix luck is actually unavailable on armours capping at 56% crit if the sphere is used for balloons .

Hhmm.... I don't think that's correct though unless you mean a hard cap....

The max amount of crit chance you can get from gear for blaze is 5%x4 from Chest, Boots, Helm, Gloves and then 13%x2 from Weapon and Relic that max out to 46%, now with just the large sphere designed for blaze it does indeed land on 56%... But you can get another 10% from small and medium spheres :) I personally only go for +3% crit chance on small sphere so my personal max would be 59% but the total amount of crit chance you can get from all spheres + gear + the base of 3% from just being lvl 50 would in absolute total end at 69% :) 

Just fyi xD

*whispers with a faint voice* b but the standart def crit(from gear and spheres) is hard capped even for them on 30% :d the special passiv and spheres are what can raise it further. isn't it like that?

Who knows... it's capped on tooltip only, not in the stat sheet xD
So for all we know Hero crit chance might be capped at 30% too... We have no idea rly :/

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@DKperfection quote:


@Tang quote:

 I also believe as someone mention that Phoenix luck is actually unavailable on armours capping at 56% crit if the sphere is used for balloons .

Hhmm.... I don't think that's correct though unless you mean a hard cap....

The max amount of crit chance you can get from gear for blaze is 5%x4 from Chest, Boots, Helm, Gloves and then 13%x2 from Weapon and Relic that max out to 46%, now with just the large sphere designed for blaze it does indeed land on 56%... But you can get another 10% from small and medium spheres :) I personally only go for +3% crit chance on small sphere so my personal max would be 59% but the total amount of crit chance you can get from all spheres + gear + the base of 3% from just being lvl 50 would in absolute total end at 69% :) 

Just fyi xD

Just like dream stated defense seems to cap at 30% on a tooltips and only the special passives and sphere show up on the tooltip bit we all know how reliable the tooltip is :), it would be nice if trendy could clarify for us once and for all crit chance caps and also other caps out there like I hear snowstorm slow caps at 30% out of a possible 40% available, I dunno how much of this is true. 

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@DKperfection quote:

Who knows... it's capped on tooltip only, not in the stat sheet xD
So for all we know Hero crit chance might be capped at 30% too... We have no idea rly :/

Yeah, I wouldn't be convinced until someone runs a long and tedious test where they record a very large number of attacks at 30% crit rate and 45% crit rate (or 50% on squire or whatever % on blaze balloon) and then compare the two tests

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@Pachipachio quote:


@DKperfection quote:

Who knows... it's capped on tooltip only, not in the stat sheet xD
So for all we know Hero crit chance might be capped at 30% too... We have no idea rly :/

Yeah, I wouldn't be convinced until someone runs a long and tedious test where they record a very large number of attacks at 30% crit rate and 45% crit rate (or 50% on squire or whatever % on blaze balloon) and then compare the two tests

that's impossible cause at any percent other then 100 it is up to rng if we crit or not so such results are not valid if trendy would add in to the tooltips the cap % in brackets or something or even in character sheet it would certainly clarify things for veteran players and also new players.


@roboticaust quote:


@Xopo quote:


@gigazelle quote:


@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:
@gigazelle quote:

snip

snip

snip

Or just have ungodly luck :D

Is this where I brag about getting an i695 base Phantom Phoenix with all 3 Blaze Balloon passives available for weapons?

that certainly is a nice find as myself don't seem to get many phantom phoenix drops and if I do always some sucker punch like it rolls with defense hp :<

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Well considering the tooltip on blaze shows more than 30% i just assume on at least blaze there is no hard cap and just a soft cap.... And if that's the case getting all 3 blaze balloon passives isn't the ideal roll :P So i'm not that jealous ;D I'd much rather have the phoenix call (obviously) with 8% blaze crit chance and then 5% normal crit chance.... instead of that blaze crit dmg amplifier :P

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@Tang quote:


snip


that certainly is a nice find as myself don't seem to get many phantom phoenix drops and if I do always some sucker punch like it rolls with defense hp :<

Yeah the burn rate on victory on it is kinda subpar though.  Would like to find one with a fairly moderate call proc and high victory.  I can totally live without the 3rd passive if those other two conditions are met lol

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@DKperfection quote:

Well considering the tooltip on blaze shows more than 30% i just assume on at least blaze there is no hard cap and just a soft cap.... And if that's the case getting all 3 blaze balloon passives isn't the ideal roll :P So i'm not that jealous ;D I'd much rather have the phoenix call (obviously) with 8% blaze crit chance and then 5% normal crit chance.... instead of that blaze crit dmg amplifier :P

To my assumption every defence caps at 30, However on Balloons the Crit does show over 30% but only when phoenix luck is equip or the blaze balloon sphere is equipped. Does these extra %s actually work in game? I do not know.

The crit dmg amplifier aka phoenix flame does not roll on weapon he/she is actually referring to victory smell(burn rate) which only rolls on weapons and is vitally important as its what gives balloons that power spike and has what made balloon very worth using.

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