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Yeah you heard me, walls in this game make so lil sense its stupid.

Piercing from javelins, kobold explosion and nearly any big mob's swing bypass the walls hitting stuff behind it completely destroy the real purpose of a barricade : PROTECTING THINGS BEHIND IT.

Seriously this is the main reason why towers are near useless in nightmare, because the walls don't do what they're supposed to do, again, protect things.

The only thing the walls do in this game is stop the mobs from advancing, nothing else.

If a wall stand between a mob and a tower or player or core we shouldn't get damaged.

Walls really need a fixing to improved the "protection" issue and maybe towers would become a little more usefull, gaining a bit of range by placing towers directly behind the barricades.

If Trendy cant change that maybe they should change the cades name to : "an annoying bush" or "something that prevent you to pass thingy".

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Just watch the apprentice towers... they just walk past... and if the wall damage them they can walk through it... the wall is to small, please do something here too!

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@alexstonge25 quote:

Trendy, please give us the reflection beam from dd1!

You are now my new BFF just because you said that.   :O


I hope TE sees this thread and thinks about it, I mean yes there was the walk over wall bug which been partially resolved but I really think if they're was not any spread damage behind the walls it would solved a lot of builds problems especially with towers.

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No offense, but I don't agree with the OP or anyone else agreeing with this poorly worded rant. Walls are designed to halt mob movement, not act as an end all be all solution to damage. It's bad enough several design choices have made leaving your defensive huddle very frowned upon unlike in dd1. IMO, them not stopping every ounce of damage coming in is a good thing. It promotes strategy and not camping behind them with console startfire enabled. Need more things like this truthfully. More reasons to build differently and more reasons to not hide behind walls. IMO towers need more range, not baras soaking up everything to alleviate this issue. This game needs reasons to leave the turtle shell and be active within the match too.

tl;dr quit crying. This is as intended.

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Hmm I had wall issues when I first started using them what with towers behind them dying but I very quickly realized what was happening & how I could fix it. Put towers a bit to the side & a bit further behind the wall & voila towers are safe, well safe from everything besides a ogre butt slam.

Also I feel the need to say that this isn't the reason why towers aren't used in nm4. Towers aren't used because they don't combo good with frosty power.

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@roboticaust quote:

No offense, but I don't agree with the OP or anyone else agreeing with this poorly worded rant. Walls are designed to halt mob movement, not act as an end all be all solution to damage. It's bad enough several design choices have made leaving your defensive huddle very frowned upon unlike in dd1. IMO, them not stopping every ounce of damage coming in is a good thing. It promotes strategy and not camping behind them with console startfire enabled. Need more things like this truthfully. More reasons to build differently and more reasons to not hide behind walls. IMO towers need more range, not baras soaking up everything to alleviate this issue. This game needs reasons to leave the turtle shell and be active within the match too.

tl;dr quit crying. This is as intended.

Walls are meant to hide behind, not just halt movement.

Build differently and more strategies?????

99.9% people in nm4 only use frosty and traps so yea I don't understand what you mean by other strategies and if using only like 4 defenses on 16 is really intended than this is complete fail.

Believe me I tried different stuff, really wanted new poison towers to work, and I saw couple of other guys trying new builds too and nothing works.

So what's your strat?  Poison towers + earthshatters + canons and mage walls??

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Another thread complaining about a non-existant issue....If i remember correctly, the squire "walls" are actually named "blockades" or "barricades" whatever, they are for sure not called walls.

The purpose of a blockade/barricade is not to stop all incoming damage from the enemy, they were meant as protection and thats exactly how they work in DD2.

Also towers do have enough range to be useful quite far behind barricades, Vector corrector goes up to 18% which is A LOT. Flameburst and Cannon towers are the towers with shortest range, yet they can reach javelins even when placed behind walls in a safe distance (mages are still out of range, but ballista/erathshatter cover that range easily).

Towers are not used on nm4 because the damage and utility is simply too low, not because they die or because they can't reach the enemy.

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@DKperfection quote:

Another thread complaining about a non-existant issue....If i remember correctly, the squire "walls" are actually named "blockades" or "barricades" whatever, they are for sure not called walls.

The purpose of a blockade/barricade is not to stop all incoming damage from the enemy, they were meant as protection and thats exactly how they work in DD2.

Also towers do have enough range to be useful quite far behind barricades, Vector corrector goes up to 18% which is A LOT. Flameburst and Cannon towers are the towers with shortest range, yet they can reach javelins even when placed behind walls in a safe distance (mages are still out of range, but ballista/erathshatter cover that range easily).

Towers are not used on nm4 because the damage and utility is simply too low, not because they die or because they can't reach the enemy.

Exactly, but without full vector you're kinda at the mercy of the range being low even with range invested in stats.  Kinda the point I was trying to make especially since people stop using towers long before they itemize properly.

With the changes to boost, It's becoming a more valid solution in tower builds but I can see it being made better to bring this back in a good way.  Can we change empowered passive please?  I'd like to see this passive split up and spread on gear like other passives have been and it to be changed to something more useful like a tower buffer.  Range and defense speed that only work on towers is a good start. I don't see 15% as too gamebreaking when fully itemized.  Could shake things up without breaking things.  Just my two cents.

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no more passives pls


that idea is a bandaid for unoptimized content, imo.  If there's a problem and the solution is a passive I'd rather just fix the underlying problem

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@Pachipachio quote:

no more passives pls


that idea is a bandaid for unoptimized content, imo.  If there's a problem and the solution is a passive I'd rather just fix the underlying problem

Fix it how?  The only suggestion I've seen you give is "remove this, remove that".  I offered a valid solution to keep frosty valid and make boost and towers valid.  Quit poo poo-ing on everything that isn't your own agenda.  It's kinda depressing to see in 600 of your 672 posts.

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@roboticaust quote:


@Pachipachio quote:

no more passives pls


that idea is a bandaid for unoptimized content, imo.  If there's a problem and the solution is a passive I'd rather just fix the underlying problem

Fix it how?  The only suggestion I've seen you give is "remove this, remove that".  I offered a valid solution to keep frosty valid and make boost and towers valid.  Quit poo poo-ing on everything that isn't your own agenda.  It's kinda depressing to see in 600 of your 672 posts.

That's exactly what a fix is though.  The boost tower is extremely viable with that passive and not viable without it.  Why not just make the boost tower viable from the get-go?


No idea where all that hostility came from though.  Complete with exaggerated hyperbole.  What am I, the illuminati with an agenda?  Upset I don't have useless posts just +1ing good ideas?  lol, get over yourself.  Adding things with the intent to fix content is dumb, developmentally.  At the end of a several month process with a philosophy like that you're left with a couple dozen mechanics/rules/etc whose only purpose is to make the game playable.  And anyone new looking at it would see it for the convoluted mess it would be

Sorry it isn't what you wanted to hear on this tuesday in the DD2 forum.  And I apologize further for it hurting your feelings

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Dude, every other post of yours is remove this, do that.  You don't add to any conversation, you just whine about the same 3 things demanding to have it your way.  We get it, the game isn't dd1.  But on the same token, do you even remember how AWFUL balance was in dd1?  Most players seem to forget it was atrocious and eventually became an out of control powercreep of epic proportions.  My best advice is, if you don't like it so much and want things changed, go apply for RQA and make a difference.  Come up with something other than "i hate hero deck, i hate imbalance, i hate passives" in every single post and maybe the community would take you seriously instead of you becoming a very frequent meme to laugh about in game.

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Literally am at a loss for words at how badly you've misunderstood my posts and have taken them so personally

I just spend a couple minutes on a post and go on about my day.  No idea why you all of a sudden want to attribute me with feverish whining about things I don't even talk about.  DD1? I've never posted anything about wanting to port over dd1 ideas into dd2 - the opposite, actually.  Passives?  This is literally the first time I talked about them so idk how you figure that


don't understand why you're so upset with me

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The bigger issue for me isn't the walls; its the maps. There aren't enough viable places to put towers other than directly behind the walls.

About tower range to fix the problem: Often my ballistas can cover plenty of distance, too much, even. I run into issues trying to get them to shoot at only the intended lane, instead of at mobs behind a wall, or in the closely adjacent physical resist lane.

I like to try to get creative and put them in different spots. Places where I can get use of the width of the firing cone and not just the length. It usually backfires. Mobs from a whole different lane will stop and take them out. Or stop and throw javelins that clip terrain and don't even hit, but it still delays clearing the wave. 


I think adjusting enemy speed down and health as necessary, to give the towers more time on target before they get to the walls, would reward good tower placement, and give us a reason to try to shoot an area other than directly ahead of the wall.

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[[93175,users]] I'd not go down on enemy speed, I'd go up on tower speed. As you mentioned tower targeting and hitting intervening map furniture makes a tower at even more of a disadvantage to traps or auras. So this is another reason why people go for walls and traps, even though walls now are just for the very odd one that gets through if you have Dragoliches in play.

So instead of the walls how about Idle Flow is actually made to work, it is in the game as a passive but got ubergimped after they f'ed it up the first time.

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Sheesh, never seen so much bickering at times. 

I'm on the fence about everything. I get the point the OP was making, but at the same time, if enemies couldn't hit through the wall, we'd be back in DD1 and just spammed defenses behind them, which didn't leave much strategy I guess. But I'm not going to say a whole lot, because there isn't much strategy to begin with as it is lol, throwing down a wall at the same damned place every time, lining your lane with frosts and traps, and if you have it the monk serenity aura, to say that there's "strategy" right now is kind of funny. Until there are dynamic waves, and enemies that can do things like adapt to defenses, throw that word out the window.

Honestly what they should do, is bring back another form of the reflective wall. This is what the apprentice wall should have always been, in my opinion. After it absorbs so many hits, it disappears a short time, etc. The apprentice wall as it stands, is bad, and they should have just altered it, to become a magical reflective wall that only reflects ranged projectiles. [[4370,users]]

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I think an all blocking wall would be abit to strong. Really absolut savety behind it would make it alot easier. Currently you need to work at last abit around on your placement with your towers so they don't get destroyed. Don't take away every tiny aspect of the game which would just provide the player an easier way to do maps.

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