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DasSaffe

Trendy - y u no listen?

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Seriously, guys?!

I don't get it at all. Like, nothing of it. I had like 1000h in DD1 and I loved it. I loved the idea of DD2 but wow ... you are ruining your franchise.

There are enough threads regarding this topic and I don't blame any developer (since they don't decide what they have to do). They get their tickets to implement/bugfix anything a higher instance tells them..


But I just want to know: WHY do you not even consider listening to the community? There was a time, when the defence council made sense for you. Balancing, Feedback and Ideas in the early ours of the game. After your initial release your playerbase grew. You got even more feedback, implemented new stuff, made ideas and visions come true.


What happend? Why you don't do this anymore? No Community-Manager has balls to tell their bosses what the audience wants? Managers don't even bother reading threads like this? What is the idea?


You see threads once a week, how people complain and lose their interest, people quitting the game and pretty sure the amount of people playin' isn't growing in the last weeks/months.


Also, do give a little satisfaction, you could at least post statements to some of the threads. Have a look at your "defence council" and your interaction with it:


f039c8173e.png

1 (!) answer in a forum, where the community was supposed to disuss ideas and plans. ONE!

Page 2 of the general disucssion forum:
5b2253aa04.png

Unhappy customers, complaints, questions, wishes ... completely ignored. Don't tell me you can't read every topic. We are a small number of people here. Let there be 5 Threads a day in the most visited forums... You have community-managers, board-guys ...

I simply cannot follow your intention. "Lets keep them unhappy. We just add more costumes, they sure will buy them!"
Requests and Problems are repeated so often. Don't tell us you are "working" on it. Since you came up with onslaught, there was a huge discussion. People are bored, even annoyed by playing this mode, since it is not rewarding nor fun... still you add it to your monthly quest, to FORCE players to play that boring mode... instead of investigate the main problem, fix it and make this mode fun to play (again)?!

Out of capacities? Too less programmers? Hire new ones, raise your income with better content and don't worry about paying them. You know how to make games, you already proved it. You are heading in a very wrong direction and every attempt to bring you back to track are ignored. You, as well as all of us know, where this will end, if you don't change your the way it is right now.

Interact with your community, give them the feeling of beeing heard, to be part of your "alpha". If this state goes on, you won't even have to hear out the community anymore, since there will be no one left. Again... you CAN do great games, you just refuse to do so... and nobody knows why?! Financal problems? Make the game fun again and everyone will agree, that your income will raise and people will be ready again to spend money for you.

The content you provide is good. I love the graphic, the animations, the fluid gameplay.. but these are just cosmetic aspects. The relevant stuff is missing or broken since over half a year. No Game Browser (when looking for a game), no trades (which was a essential part in DD1 / any coop-driven game), broken/useless ubers, Useless classes (melee-dps)... the list goes on. No need to repeat every single thread listed in the forums. Just take a look

Take a look at the gamehubs on steam, where people state how happy they are, that they can communicate with the devs. And here? Nearly nothing...

Still, I don't get it... anyway, I'll wait till the very next patch and decide afterwards, if i will continue playing this game.
Let us fight for Eternia again.. with passion, love and desire.

Good luck and have a Good Year 2016

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@DasSaffe quote:

... WHY do you not even consider listening to the community? ...

Yes why... why. I know some hate the hero deck but because of that just to say they never listen is kinda sad.

Ok devs don't listen, i will go once with it and i will try to get a list to prove that they don't listen. These changes came in after forum topics where there for a while and often hotly discussed.


1. Players wanting it "harder/easier" (not afk able maps on hardest dif.)  (multiple times it switches like a leave in the wind)

devs responded to it making it easier and later harder again then easier and harder (last few patches). Not the best implementation though with just stat increase on monster but they responded.

2. Players wanting maps were you need to play with a strategy or kinda solve a puzzle

When this discussion appeared more in the forum, they got their first map abit more into that, the spooky one. Now they included even a map which is completly doable with anything as long as you know how to play it and know how to solve it (harbinger).

3. Players wanting more builds and more weapons and ways to fight.

A process which will grow with time, more builds are comming and they adding already constantly some which are viable. Aura / cannons / flames got a huge boost now too.  Even some passivs from the harbinger builds / fights are  viable. Lot of Slamdunk monks, and a few other figthers with the new passivs. The dummies have the same HP/DU like barricades and only need DH to reach it with the passiv on the weapon! The arcane walls are still abit lacking in my eyes but they are as usefull too, but probably more usefull in a group then solo (that's my opinion on them).

4. Players wanted to not xp/gold pay for buyed skins. 

They changed it so you kinda don't need it now.

5. Easier to get food to get pets faster up.

They changed it so it's super easy and now everyone can get their pets max fed.

6. Cheaper enchantment for gear.

Got in!

7.  More skins because players "wanting" this to be the main pay point for the free to play, to have it be there needs to be some variation in the skins already.

Yeah we still need to pay for extra char slots and bags, and some wanting this completly gone from the gem list. But the devs would need options to earn money. Any ideas for what they can charge players? The game is free to play and probably will stay like that and i honestly like that they don't turn it into a p2w.

8. Players wanting stronger monthly pets.

With the first few pets players didn't felt much rewarded for the work they put in to get them. Their skills were middle class and not that strong at all (I actually liked it because this took the pressure of players to always farm them in case it is an good one, and that the normal pets are still good.). So they heard and made the next monthly pets stronger and stronger and more unique. They started to grow with their evolution lvl too and are now often the "monthly pet meta" on their release.  But they are fun and worth the time spend to get them. Now there were already some topics in the forum where players complained that you need them and that their skills should also be in the normal pet list so that a player doesn't need to be forced to get these pets.

9. Players wanting to get the monthly pet easier.

Done, every monthly got easier since the big complains on the first pets. Now everyone can get them and don't need to be a hardcore addicted =).

10. Players wanting to get the monthly kill quest shared.

Was done right on the next monthly pet after a raise in topics about this issue.

11. Legacy gear should be gone (special frosty powers).

This one was a huge one which actually didn't influenced the game overall in the current state, but they took the uproar to actually overthing on how to do it without a wipe and get it right for future changes and adjustments and ballancing without wiping everytime. They got the automatical adjustment in for that and with that they changed a few passivs to fit another wish for the playerbase too. After it got implemented alot complained how their gear changed. It was abit funny to watch on one hand they wanted the change so bad that they opened multiple topics and on the other hand when their gear was also touched the complaining was high. I think it was a right step though and i don't mind much that i lost my 170+ frosty power to be honest.

12. No item wipes (ongoing battle).

The system which came in to adjust passivs. With that one "threat" of wipes is gone.

13. Players wanting better items (better stats and passiv combinations).

Loot 2.0 came and again some were pleased some not so much. But this is duo to bugs probably and adjustments will be made when they come back. Overall the drops are rolling better together now and good loot is easier to find for various builds (special if you love crit). Barricades are harder to build up now probably because to many complained in the testing phase that it was to easy to get. They maybe will change it though.

I was one of these who also complained before about how the items were random, now i complain about that i still can't get what i want. Still better though then before...

14. Players wanting a change so monster don't pass or climb walls.

The attempt on how it was "fixed" was quit well... unique. Making the defense bigger actually changed the gamestyle quit abit. Towers which were save before were now vulnerable on certain placements. Monster still pass the wall and climb over it, but it is way less then it was before. So it kinda "works".

15. Players wanting the Ipow requirement gone.

It got in and now after the f2p change players wanting it actually "back". It is a new issue which also probably will be worked on in the future.

16. Players wanting Xmas presents to be usefull for nm4.

Well they changed it, and with that you either had luck or not luck. The presents could be op now or absolut useless =). I sadly didn't got anything good, but i gratulate everyone who got a 730+ ipow base builder item. (yes i am jelly).

17. Players wanting "for sure" drops as rewards for some maps.

First step into that direction is done with spooky and harbinger. Though a few complains appeared now that some items should be still hard to get.

18. Player wanted the end chest to be more rewarding.

They changed it and implemented a system for it in for the first 5 chests. Even though it is still heavily luck based (yeah i mean this green and blue chest on the last daily :_D), it is overall good. This also leads to another change player wished for.

19. Players wanted diversity in playable maps.

This started with throne room, to liferoot and then gates kinda. These got farmed over and over again in their prime time. The chest change and drops for later wave changes are part of the process to actually motivating player to play different maps. Now i often see people running often different maps and finding them on different too. Mostly common one are now betsy, gates, harbinger, liferoot, ramparts, little village, plaza.

20. Players wanting a challenge on the campaign mode (raise of difficult) (for new players).

Well yeah.

21. Players wanting skipable cutscenes.

Got in. I am kinda waiting for a topic now "end chest cutscene skipable pls".

22. Players wanting the grind to be reduced for reaching 50 (and second+ chars).

They did alot for this and probably still thinking on how to change it further. (xp bonus, spheres, xp from higher difficult modes)

23. Players wanting little secrets in the game (like secret tavern room).

They included one in the spooky map and it actually was a blast reading the forum and how the players worked together to figure it out.

24. Some minor private experience for "listening" to the community.

I had an issue back then with daily quests, there was a bug were i didn't got any daily quests at all. So i could not earn any tokens (my luck forbids me to earn them in onsl). Couldn't buy skills for testing back then nor open skin boxes. I was VERY VERY frustrated about that. Because even after weeks it was not fixed. After a time though the devs took it more serious, it was before the monthly pet came with the requirement to earn tokens. The issue got fixed till then but i still made a snappy rant in one topic about monthly pets saying that "hopefull the bug will not appear or the monthly quest is not doable and this would be very frustrating". I was still very frustrated of it, even though it was now fixed. What happend was a dev contacted me directly then over notes, it suprised me to be honest and he even offered to directly restore the daily missions (with the hope to fix the problem) on my profile. I declined because it was working though. But oh well, they did listened to a small rant... .


No i am not trying to defend them here and i have my own share of frustration with the devs for not fixing some bugs as fast as i would like, but i know they will do it with time, even if it takes some years.

Even if some don't like it, it's an alpha game, if you want a finished product wait maybe 1 1/2-2 years and come back then. Stuff needs time to be created and with the cheer amount of ideas it's obvious not everything is done instantly to the next patch, it takes time. Still this is no reason to dis the devs like some here do so hard.

And just because i payed something for a game doesn't mean i own the whole company and that they need to change everything in the game to my liking. It's what the forum feels like sometimes. The demanding part is so huge a "would nice to have or if it would be like this" is currently more a "Do that or i quit and the game is dying". Don't get me wrong on it though, ideas and suggestions are good and they are taking them (probably) in and decides on what to use and not, because to please everyone is not possible.

In the end the game has issues, but don't listening to the playerbase is definitiv not one. Instability problems, alot disconnects and crashes and lags on many players, tons of frustrating bugs. There is many to do till this game is finished at it's base. Not even talking about new mechanics and changes still comming in.

Disclaimer.

Sorry i don't got all the changes they made in from the players topics/suggestions, i don't have everything in my head nor do i want to actually invest houres to do a complete list. They did so much more from player feedback then just the few mentioned points here.


TL;DR:

Just gobu. Enjoy and have fun and feed the goblins. Devs keep going like you do, you do it right! =) I am excited to see how the game will look in 2 years.

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24 changes in the midsts of hundreds and hundreds of complaints is a good job folks

gobu gObu GoBU gOBu Emoji_Huntress.png


lol, some of them are just weird changes.  There was one thread where someone flipped out about costumes requiring 25k gold per upgrade.  So they remove it the next update.  Why did that get so much attention vs other stuff that's gotten way more outrage


btw, you're understanding pretty well what's at play with comments like these: 

21. Players wanting skipable cutscenes.

Got in. I am kinda waiting for a topic now "end chest cutscene skipable pls".

Not all suggestions are to be taken to heart...  at the end of the day the devs have to have a vision more grounded and pronounced than the community or patches will be this constant back and forth of trying to placate, basically, a child who doesn't know what it wants.  What that 'child' then needs is a parent who knows what it wants.  Otherwise the whole situation is a mess.  Community feedback should be a guiding force, not an inspirational one


Let's be real, most of the suggestions presented by people are just dumb and serve just to waste precious dev time.  Them spending any amount of time on stupid changes (I realize the skin thing was probably a 2 minute thing) is a good testament of the studio, internally, not aligned with a grand vision for the game.  



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@Pachipachio quote:

24 changes in the midsts of hundreds and hundreds of complaints is a good job folks

gobu gObu GoBU gOBu Emoji_Huntress.png

It's fine =), I don't plan to make a full list of every change. It would take to much time and work for me. If you want to do it feel free, there is so much more then these 24 i mentioned. And don't forget, have fun!

Gobu!

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@dreamanime quote:TL;DR:

Just gobu. Enjoy and have fun and feed the goblins. Devs keep going like you do, you do it right! =) I am excited to see how the game will look in 2 years.

I'm not sure about half this craziness but it's kinda of like why are these things getting fixed instead of the ones that matter. Yes we complain about things, but these massive threads are about the same few things and not what you included in your post.

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@dreamanime quote:


@Pachipachio quote:

24 changes in the midsts of hundreds and hundreds of complaints is a good job folks

gobu gObu GoBU gOBu Emoji_Huntress.png

It's fine =), I don't plan to make a full list of every change. It would take to much time and work for me. If you want to do it feel free, there is so much more then these 24 i mentioned. And don't forget, have fun!

Gobu!

I wasn't criticizing you for taking the time to put up only 24.  That's a lot, and it took a lot of time/patience to do.  In my opinion, that's your most informative and comprehensive post I've seen.  And I'm fully in agreement there are way more than the 24 you came up with on a whim


I was criticizing your lack of perspective.  Yes, they're listening to some community concerns and changing things as a direct result of some community concerns.  That, to you, seems to disqualify any shred of chance that they're incompetent

To some, it's really obvious that we're not steadily moving towards a grand vision.  You obviously see the back-and-forth changes they're implementing because you kind of poke fun them in your post.  But you seem to ascribe that to be the fault of players (no surprise if you haphazardly listen to the voices of a couple dozen people you'll seem schizophrenic).  The blame should unquestionably fall on the devs for being swayed by bad advice

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Okay, I appreciate your point of view, dreamanime. You made a list of things they changed (even though I guess that half of them are not related to player-wishes). But you didn't say anything about my complaints. No Interaction with the community (regarding to the screenshots), uber-spheres, lags, disconnects.. Problems which are actually a pain.


I give you that point, that they made an imminent change, so that you can start your game in a private tavern. It took like 8 months or so, but they did it and I'm thankful for that. I also agree on some of your points, that not every advice/wish should be heard, specially when it is only one person who cries. But you can't deny the uselessness of some uberspheres or the onslaught-mode.


Of course there is a steady change with every patch. This has to be done and yes, sometimes there are even rollbacks after a change. But if you run a "alpha", this is what you have to expect. An alpha doesn't only show the state, it is more to get feedback from the playerbase (as listed on their steam shopsite for DD2).

“We want to build a great game with you.

or

This enables you, our Steam Community, to Influence the game as we develop it, incorporating many of your ideas along the way.”

That said, yes, some of the ideas were heard and implemented somehow, while others still remain for over a year now. Just look at the threads, problems still occur today, as well as several months ago.


I'm not forcing trendy to react in seconds, but would it be to much to get a feedback? Open an idea, have a discussion with pros and cons and get the feedback from trendy: "yes, we read the idea and will discuss it" and maybe the outcome of the meeting? Or a roadmap, what the changes for the next patch is/are.



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Gonna do both a bit of devil's advocate and white knighting here.

  • As derp derp gobu gobu said above, there is a TON of things they change regarding the game as a direct result of our feedback - nobody can deny this. Every single patch we get there are tons and tons of improvements that have been a direct result of them listening to players.
  • However - when it comes to the big stuff (like hero deck, wave director, build passives and overall defense balance), that's where they follow their own agenda pretty rigidly without much input from the community. This has nothing to do with community managers - it has everything to do with the project leads and designers choosing what to work on next. Trust me when I say that Isom is doing literally everything humanely possible to advocate community concerns.
  • I speculate (pretty confidently) that they don't work on the big stuff for several reasons:
    - They don't know how to proceed with it, such as the hero deck. Flat-out removing the hero deck has potentially even more dire consequences than leaving it in.
    - The project is a HUGE undertaking, such as onslaught revamp, wave director, and server browser. Most of the biggest gripes the community has with the game requires months for a team their size to develop.
    - They must balance these huge undertakings with keeping the playerbase engaged by keeping content fresh. Holiday content, Harbinger, new maps, etc.

The problem with not working on the big stuff is that the playerbase is going to continually wane because the existing game mechanics cannot scale, regardless of what fresh new content is introduced. What sucks is that we are going to see more and more of these threads and the community will become more and more agitated until we're either heard or we head off to another community that has devs that listen to not only the small stuff but the big stuff too.

In short, Trendy I know you listen to us and fully understand the position you're in. But holy crap if you don't fix the gaping flaws that are in the game right now, DD2 is going to tank hard.

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I'm pretty confident, people would sign an NDA and work on a free base (or lets say gems as a reward) to code for them. There are plenty of (game)-developers out there, freelancing or even in this forum. For myself, I'd help as good as I can with some coding stuff. It hasn't be the core mechanic, it can be small fixes. Adjusting health or passives isn't something you have to read for months. (depending on the documentation) :P


But yeah, I agree with you, gigazelle. There are changes in every patch (as I already said), but the major problems still remain. Indeed it can't be accomplished in just one go and it takes more time, but you already said it: You want to keep people interested with events and new content - while you have to have an eye on the end-game. There is only the solution to hire more devs.

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Hmm, I just think that they took a 2 week vacation, and also changed their priorities. They are dead set on making this game overly grind heavy too early, with uninteresting loot, and if there IS interesting loot it's drop rate is rediculusly low. Like get rid of all legendary items but the ones that ARE legendary.


Make the game more rewarding.


And make sure you don't balance just for one class with that ONE build to be able to complete maps. 8-40% slows aren't enough to replace baracades. They are way too needed, it squanders hope for people to actually have fun with a squire. (my favorite class that used to be fun) Making a sertain build REQUIRED to play isn't fun, Before these patches after wipeageddon, Squire was in a great place. App was in a great place, I am glad I got the game then, when the game was better.


Now the game is insanely grind heavy, the balance is so lopsided to require the squire to use ONE build. And the lack of rewarding drops, and a bunch of blue balls that are legendaries and mythic items. The games loot is far worse even after the latest loot patch than vanilla diablo 3.

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@gigazelle quote:

Gonna do both a bit of devil's advocate and white knighting here.

  • As derp derp gobu gobu said above, there is a TON of things they change regarding the game as a direct result of our feedback - nobody can deny this. Every single patch we get there are tons and tons of improvements that have been a direct result of them listening to players.
  • However - when it comes to the big stuff (like hero deck, wave director, build passives and overall defense balance), that's where they follow their own agenda pretty rigidly without much input from the community. This has nothing to do with community managers - it has everything to do with the project leads and designers choosing what to work on next. Trust me when I say that Isom is doing literally everything humanely possible to advocate community concerns.
  • I speculate (pretty confidently) that they don't work on the big stuff for several reasons:
    - They don't know how to proceed with it, such as the hero deck. Flat-out removing the hero deck has potentially even more dire consequences than leaving it in.
    - The project is a HUGE undertaking, such as onslaught revamp, wave director, and server browser. Most of the biggest gripes the community has with the game requires months for a team their size to develop.
    - They must balance these huge undertakings with keeping the playerbase engaged by keeping content fresh. Holiday content, Harbinger, new maps, etc.

The problem with not working on the big stuff is that the playerbase is going to continually wane because the existing game mechanics cannot scale, regardless of what fresh new content is introduced. What sucks is that we are going to see more and more of these threads and the community will become more and more agitated until we're either heard or we head off to another community that listens to their devs on not only the small stuff but the big stuff too.

In short, Trendy I know you listen to us and fully understand the position you're in. But holy crap if you don't fix the gaping flaws that are in the game right now, DD2 is going to tank hard.

I feel this is pretty spot on, though I disagree with dire consequences on removing the hero deck as a whole. The only thing I think it will bring is a bunch of people crying p2w now...which in a team game it isnt and also there are no leaderboards no season, no real competition. 


Idea if they do implement a leaderboard they could make a hero cap stipulation and such. But thats for another day. With a team there size everything they have done has been pretty decent right now. Now they just need to remove the hero deck and that should quite people down long enough for them to get more things done in the game before people come back to the forums crying about RNG or NM4 incursion is to hard still for them even with no hero deck lol.

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Probably the longest quote...Just to say we need more people like you dreamanime...I hope Trendy hires you :D!

@dreamanime quote:
@DasSaffe quote:

... WHY do you not even consider listening to the community? ...

Yes why... why. I know some hate the hero deck but because of that just to say they never listen is kinda sad.

Ok devs don't listen, i will go once with it and i will try to get a list to prove that they don't listen. These changes came in after forum topics where there for a while and often hotly discussed.


1. Players wanting it "harder/easier" (not afk able maps on hardest dif.)  (multiple times it switches like a leave in the wind)

devs responded to it making it easier and later harder again then easier and harder (last few patches). Not the best implementation though with just stat increase on monster but they responded.

2. Players wanting maps were you need to play with a strategy or kinda solve a puzzle

When this discussion appeared more in the forum, they got their first map abit more into that, the spooky one. Now they included even a map which is completly doable with anything as long as you know how to play it and know how to solve it (harbinger).

3. Players wanting more builds and more weapons and ways to fight.

A process which will grow with time, more builds are comming and they adding already constantly some which are viable. Aura / cannons / flames got a huge boost now too.  Even some passivs from the harbinger builds / fights are  viable. Lot of Slamdunk monks, and a few other figthers with the new passivs. The dummies have the same HP/DU like barricades and only need DH to reach it with the passiv on the weapon! The arcane walls are still abit lacking in my eyes but they are as usefull too, but probably more usefull in a group then solo (that's my opinion on them).

4. Players wanted to not xp/gold pay for buyed skins. 

They changed it so you kinda don't need it now.

5. Easier to get food to get pets faster up.

They changed it so it's super easy and now everyone can get their pets max fed.

6. Cheaper enchantment for gear.

Got in!

7.  More skins because players "wanting" this to be the main pay point for the free to play, to have it be there needs to be some variation in the skins already.

Yeah we still need to pay for extra char slots and bags, and some wanting this completly gone from the gem list. But the devs would need options to earn money. Any ideas for what they can charge players? The game is free to play and probably will stay like that and i honestly like that they don't turn it into a p2w.

8. Players wanting stronger monthly pets.

With the first few pets players didn't felt much rewarded for the work they put in to get them. Their skills were middle class and not that strong at all (I actually liked it because this took the pressure of players to always farm them in case it is an good one, and that the normal pets are still good.). So they heard and made the next monthly pets stronger and stronger and more unique. They started to grow with their evolution lvl too and are now often the "monthly pet meta" on their release.  But they are fun and worth the time spend to get them. Now there were already some topics in the forum where players complained that you need them and that their skills should also be in the normal pet list so that a player doesn't need to be forced to get these pets.

9. Players wanting to get the monthly pet easier.

Done, every monthly got easier since the big complains on the first pets. Now everyone can get them and don't need to be a hardcore addicted =).

10. Players wanting to get the monthly kill quest shared.

Was done right on the next monthly pet after a raise in topics about this issue.

11. Legacy gear should be gone (special frosty powers).

This one was a huge one which actually didn't influenced the game overall in the current state, but they took the uproar to actually overthing on how to do it without a wipe and get it right for future changes and adjustments and ballancing without wiping everytime. They got the automatical adjustment in for that and with that they changed a few passivs to fit another wish for the playerbase too. After it got implemented alot complained how their gear changed. It was abit funny to watch on one hand they wanted the change so bad that they opened multiple topics and on the other hand when their gear was also touched the complaining was high. I think it was a right step though and i don't mind much that i lost my 170+ frosty power to be honest.

12. No item wipes (ongoing battle).

The system which came in to adjust passivs. With that one "threat" of wipes is gone.

13. Players wanting better items (better stats and passiv combinations).

Loot 2.0 came and again some were pleased some not so much. But this is duo to bugs probably and adjustments will be made when they come back. Overall the drops are rolling better together now and good loot is easier to find for various builds (special if you love crit). Barricades are harder to build up now probably because to many complained in the testing phase that it was to easy to get. They maybe will change it though.

I was one of these who also complained before about how the items were random, now i complain about that i still can't get what i want. Still better though then before...

14. Players wanting a change so monster don't pass or climb walls.

The attempt on how it was "fixed" was quit well... unique. Making the defense bigger actually changed the gamestyle quit abit. Towers which were save before were now vulnerable on certain placements. Monster still pass the wall and climb over it, but it is way less then it was before. So it kinda "works".

15. Players wanting the Ipow requirement gone.

It got in and now after the f2p change players wanting it actually "back". It is a new issue which also probably will be worked on in the future.

16. Players wanting Xmas presents to be usefull for nm4.

Well they changed it, and with that you either had luck or not luck. The presents could be op now or absolut useless =). I sadly didn't got anything good, but i gratulate everyone who got a 730+ ipow base builder item. (yes i am jelly).

17. Players wanting "for sure" drops as rewards for some maps.

First step into that direction is done with spooky and harbinger. Though a few complains appeared now that some items should be still hard to get.

18. Player wanted the end chest to be more rewarding.

They changed it and implemented a system for it in for the first 5 chests. Even though it is still heavily luck based (yeah i mean this green and blue chest on the last daily :_D), it is overall good. This also leads to another change player wished for.

19. Players wanted diversity in playable maps.

This started with throne room, to liferoot and then gates kinda. These got farmed over and over again in their prime time. The chest change and drops for later wave changes are part of the process to actually motivating player to play different maps. Now i often see people running often different maps and finding them on different too. Mostly common one are now betsy, gates, harbinger, liferoot, ramparts, little village, plaza.

20. Players wanting a challenge on the campaign mode (raise of difficult) (for new players).

Well yeah.

21. Players wanting skipable cutscenes.

Got in. I am kinda waiting for a topic now "end chest cutscene skipable pls".

22. Players wanting the grind to be reduced for reaching 50 (and second+ chars).

They did alot for this and probably still thinking on how to change it further. (xp bonus, spheres, xp from higher difficult modes)

23. Players wanting little secrets in the game (like secret tavern room).

They included one in the spooky map and it actually was a blast reading the forum and how the players worked together to figure it out.

24. Some minor private experience for "listening" to the community.

I had an issue back then with daily quests, there was a bug were i didn't got any daily quests at all. So i could not earn any tokens (my luck forbids me to earn them in onsl). Couldn't buy skills for testing back then nor open skin boxes. I was VERY VERY frustrated about that. Because even after weeks it was not fixed. After a time though the devs took it more serious, it was before the monthly pet came with the requirement to earn tokens. The issue got fixed till then but i still made a snappy rant in one topic about monthly pets saying that "hopefull the bug will not appear or the monthly quest is not doable and this would be very frustrating". I was still very frustrated of it, even though it was now fixed. What happend was a dev contacted me directly then over notes, it suprised me to be honest and he even offered to directly restore the daily missions (with the hope to fix the problem) on my profile. I declined because it was working though. But oh well, they did listened to a small rant... .


No i am not trying to defend them here and i have my own share of frustration with the devs for not fixing some bugs as fast as i would like, but i know they will do it with time, even if it takes some years.

Even if some don't like it, it's an alpha game, if you want a finished product wait maybe 1 1/2-2 years and come back then. Stuff needs time to be created and with the cheer amount of ideas it's obvious not everything is done instantly to the next patch, it takes time. Still this is no reason to dis the devs like some here do so hard.

And just because i payed something for a game doesn't mean i own the whole company and that they need to change everything in the game to my liking. It's what the forum feels like sometimes. The demanding part is so huge a "would nice to have or if it would be like this" is currently more a "Do that or i quit and the game is dying". Don't get me wrong on it though, ideas and suggestions are good and they are taking them (probably) in and decides on what to use and not, because to please everyone is not possible.

In the end the game has issues, but don't listening to the playerbase is definitiv not one. Instability problems, alot disconnects and crashes and lags on many players, tons of frustrating bugs. There is many to do till this game is finished at it's base. Not even talking about new mechanics and changes still comming in.

Disclaimer.

Sorry i don't got all the changes they made in from the players topics/suggestions, i don't have everything in my head nor do i want to actually invest houres to do a complete list. They did so much more from player feedback then just the few mentioned points here.


TL;DR:

Just gobu. Enjoy and have fun and feed the goblins. Devs keep going like you do, you do it right! =) I am excited to see how the game will look in 2 years.


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@braydon180 quote:

Maybe they gave up on the defense council for being hostile?

The defense council's purpose was fulfilled when the game went F2P. Sure it had its fair share of heated arguments in the council forums, but they were by no means hostile in any way. The defense council isn't really used anymore because there's a lot more people playing the game, and everyone's feedback is equally valuable.

@Xopo quote:

I feel this is pretty spot on, though I disagree with dire consequences on removing the hero deck as a whole. The only thing I think it will bring is a bunch of people crying p2w now...which in a team game it isnt and also there are no leaderboards no season, no real competition.

If they take it out, there's no going back - not even partially. Even if a modified hero deck mechanic that would be advantageous for the game was implemented after it was taken out entirely, the playerbase would riot. So instead of causing a ridiculous upheaval, they're leaving it in until they get the modified mechanics right.

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@gigazelle quote:


@braydon180 quote:

Maybe they gave up on the defense council for being hostile?

The defense council's purpose was fulfilled when the game went F2P. Sure it had its fair share of heated arguments in the council forums, but they were by no means hostile in any way. The defense council isn't really used anymore because there's a lot more people playing the game, and everyone's feedback is equally valuable.

@Xopo quote:

I feel this is pretty spot on, though I disagree with dire consequences on removing the hero deck as a whole. The only thing I think it will bring is a bunch of people crying p2w now...which in a team game it isnt and also there are no leaderboards no season, no real competition.

If they take it out, there's no going back - not even partially. Even if a modified hero deck mechanic that would be advantageous for the game was implemented after it was taken out entirely, the playerbase would riot. So instead of causing a ridiculous upheaval, they're leaving it in until they get the modified mechanics right.

This suggest that removal of the hero deck would, in the end be what the playerbase likes the best. I wont say wants because I think there are people that don't want it removed now but if it was removed they would say "wow I'm glad it's gone".

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@Chappyy quote:

This suggest that removal of the hero deck would, in the end be what the playerbase likes the best. I wont say wants because I think there are people that don't want it removed now but if it was removed they would say "wow I'm glad it's gone".

They really would be glad. No-one would miss it at all. And if they did they could just limit themselves. Everyone's a winner!

Kill it with fire!

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Actually not only is the HD limiting the game and boring me to death, they are losing money keeping it in.

Think about it and I have brought this up time and time again. They are funding this game through skins, yet you can only have 4 characters at your disposal.

So why in the hell would anyone have incentive to buy more skins for characters they can't use?

If people had no limits (see what I did there?) to how many characters they could bring at one time, they would be inclined to throw around a little cash to skin them up.

Logic eludes the marketing team at Trendy.

They have dug themselves in a hole with the HD, so I'm interested to see how they are going to resolve it.

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@KnowsNoLimits quote:

Actually not only is the HD limiting the game and boring me to death, they are losing money keeping it in.

Think about it and I have brought this up time and time again. They are funding this game through skins, yet you can only have 4 characters at your disposal.

So why in the hell would anyone have incentive to buy more skins for characters they can't use?

If people had no limits (see what I did there?) to how many characters they could bring at one time, they would be inclined to throw around a little cash to skin them up.

Logic eludes the marketing team at Trendy.

They have dug themselves in a hole with the HD, so I'm interested to see how they are going to resolve it.

Amen

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You have it all wrong. They DO listen to the community. What they do not do is let a vocal minority of whiners design the game for them. And that's a good thing.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

You have it all wrong. They DO listen to the community. What they do not do is let a vocal minority of whiners design the game for them. And that's a good thing.

Minority? Onslaught-Threads, Uber-spheres, lack of endgame, Hero Deck? sure, just a few players...

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Hi, everyone! I hope you’ve all had a pleasant holiday and a happy New Year. As I looked through the forums yesterday, this thread caught my eye late in the day. I wanted to wait until morning to reply to it, partly to avoid Thread Reply Anxiety (a very sad condition that affects 10 out of 10 Community Teams), and partly to see what kind of replies the post itself would receive.

First, I want to personally apologize for the lack of response in the Defense Council forum. They do not see much activity, and regrettably, I allowed them to fall by the wayside. I’ll personally ensure that the Defense Council forum gets more responses from me.

Secondly, I want to assure everyone that we read every single thread that is posted on these forums. Every single one. The reason that there was not a response since December 18th was due to the entire office going on break for the winter holiday. Now that we’re back, believe me, there’s going to be some replying. So much replying. Replies all over the place…

Now, on to the meaty goodness of this issue. We’re constantly working to balance your requests with our own internal vision. The need for fresh, engaging content is in constant tension with the need for polish and bugfixes. In a bigger studio, these problems can be solved by throwing bodies at them. For us, this is a delicate balancing act with limited resources and a constantly ticking clock. It is extremely challenging to add features in a short time frame. Major changes may not happen as quickly as we would like, but rest assured, they do happen, and I believe that many of you will be very pleased with some of the changes that are coming down the pipeline.

A prime example of this is the implementation of Loot V2. Loot V2 is the result of reading a lot of player feedback about the frustrating loot RNG and how much trash loot there was. (Like the numerous threads from our forums from Loot Cave 2.0 [shoutout to @Tristaris] and this opinion thread from Reddit.) We deployed the first implementation of Loot V2, and some problems were immediately identified by the community. As a result of that feedback, we made tweaks with Hotfix 9.3, and we’re continuing to adjust the loot system until it gets to a point where we are all happy with it.

Another example is everyone’s favorite, the Hero Deck. That is a huge undertaking that absolutely cannot be rushed. As others in this thread have mentioned (shoutout to @Gigazelle), the consequences of getting this wrong could be disastrous. As a result, we’ve taken a careful approach to it, and as we mentioned before break, the Hero Deck is something we want to focus on this year (hopefully in the next few milestones -- stay tuned for more info).

In short, Defenders, we do listen to you! We scour your feedback for things we can act on. We act on what we can and try our best to balance the rest with our internal pipeline. If we sometimes do not get to an item as quickly as you’d like us to, it’s not because we are ignoring you! We are in fact trying to figure out the best way to approach and fix the problems, while keeping true to both the spirit of the game and the realities of running a business that so closely entwines customer desire with our own creativity.

I hope that this answered some of your questions, and put some fears to rest. For myself, I will continue to hit the forums hard, and in fact redouble my efforts to provide quality responses. I hope that you continue to put your trust in us. With your help, and a little patience, I’m confident that we’ll be able to make a game that we can all be proud of.

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@DasSaffe quote:


@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

You have it all wrong. They DO listen to the community. What they do not do is let a vocal minority of whiners design the game for them. And that's a good thing.

Minority? Onslaught-Threads, Uber-spheres, lack of endgame, Hero Deck? sure, just a few players...

Everything you listed are things that Trendy has already told us they are looking into. So you're not complaining about them not listening (they clearly are listening to those issues), you're complaining about them taking their time to carefully design the best solution.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:


@DasSaffe quote:


@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

You have it all wrong. They DO listen to the community. What they do not do is let a vocal minority of whiners design the game for them. And that's a good thing.

Minority? Onslaught-Threads, Uber-spheres, lack of endgame, Hero Deck? sure, just a few players...

Everything you listed are things that Trendy has already told us they are looking into. So you're not complaining about them not listening (they clearly are listening to those issues), you're complaining about them taking their time to carefully design the best solution.

The time they had to do all these things, and balancing towers as well. Drastically changed when they launched as F2P. So many players will not give any game a second chance. 

What can they do to draw in more players the next time? The game is already free. It being a new game will wear of and their potential customer base will be gone before they have the game where they want it to be.

They cannot simply go on the internet in 6-8 months and say "Our game is great now! Come back!" 

It sadly doesn't work like that.

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Well butters, you guys made a few boo boos with loot2.0.  Might wanna look at shield changes and the passives no longer acquirable on them thanks to that.

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@Hom-Sha-Bom quote:

You have it all wrong. They DO listen to the community. What they do not do is let a vocal minority of whiners design the game for them. And that's a good thing.

You mean like the thread where a person complained about needing gold to upgrade constumes, got a trendy response like 4 posts in, and then we see the next update flat out remove all requirements for costume upgrades despite there being many (everyone? was saying 25k gold is nothing later levels) people in the thread disagreeing?


That vocal minority?  That's the one? Emoji_Huntress.png

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