No play ban wagon

@Andurian quote:

@Tristaris quote:

Best to just ignore that nonsense like that. You'll constantly be bombarded with "it's alpha!!" and "it's not a finished game!" like we are ignorant to that fact. 

Perhaps because y'all whine like you're ignorant of that fact?  

Making suggestions is entirely reasonable.  Complaining about the lack of QA before patches going live is fine.   Shouting "I'm taking my ball and going home because this unfinished game isn't exactly what I want!" is just childish, especially when none of you ever actually do.

The last time I logged on was... 09/04/2015.

Perhaps you should research before you try to make claims? Or are we not allowed to keep tabs on the forums and dev streams to keep an eye on progress to see how the game is shaping up? We are more than fine to voice our problems with the game, and concerns. Even if it comes off as a little ***y. 

I'd actually lay real life money on the fact that most people who care enough to come here and post, cares for the well being of this game, and while they may not post "well things aren't good right now, but things are all jolly! :)" they care enough to post their thoughts, in the first place. 

I've dumped my share of hours into this game, and I'm going to voice my concerns with it, and loudly at that fact, and if you haven't checked the forums often the last month or so, you'd see that I'm definitely not the only one who does. 

Thanks for your concern, but I think we'll manage just fine. 

Even worse, then.  You're the "fans" that refuse to attend a game because the team is so bad, but spend all your time doing living room coaching online.  

"This game is so horrible I don't play it, and I'm convinced it will never be good because the devs suxor, but I feel the need to spend all my time in the forums complaining." is just irrational.

@Andurian quote:

Even worse, then.  You're the "fans" that refuse to attend a game because the team is so bad, but spend all your time doing living room coaching online.  

"This game is so horrible I don't play it, and I'm convinced it will never be good because the devs suxor, but I feel the need to spend all my time in the forums complaining." is just irrational.

Tell me, where on earth did I ever say anything along the lines of "this game will never be good! The devs are terrible!" ?

Oh that's right, I didn't. Just keep on spewing nonsense. You seem to be good at putting words in peoples' mouths. I'll not bother to respond again to any of your posts because I'd rather see someone post a raging topic about the game, rather than to see someone running around trying to moderate the forums and bash anyone for speaking negatively. 

This whole thread is about how terrible the devs are and how the game will never be good.

In response to a suggestion for fixing we get:  "Can go back and reinstall DD1 XD"

Regarding where the game is going we get: "GG, WP, GL HF, NO RE."

About the hard work the devs don't do we're told "They could do SO much if they wanted to."

About the honesty of the devs what do we hear?: "I just don't think they let the community influence help guide the priorities as much as they want us to believe."

And generally about how horrible the devs are other than the art team:  "Their art team is amazing, only thing that doesn't need fixing."

@Andurian quote:

Even worse, then.  You're the "fans" that refuse to attend a game because the team is so bad, but spend all your time doing living room coaching online.  

"This game is so horrible I don't play it, and I'm convinced it will never be good because the devs suxor, but I feel the need to spend all my time in the forums complaining." is just irrational.

now THAT is what i hate about you white knights and apologists. 99% of people who voiced their opinion, and said that they'll leave the game, they NEVER said "game will be never good and devs suck". you are getting random accusations from nowhere. how many already said same thing over and over, some of them in constructive form, some just raging and some both of them combined. oh and numbers dont lie, game lost lots of players. even after it became cheaper and many got the game for free, it still hardly reaches 2k players at same time, most of people just login to do their daily. and consider, if this people didn't care, they wouldn't come here in the first place.

@Andurian quote:

This whole thread is about how terrible the devs are and how the game will never be good.

In response to a suggestion for fixing we get:  "Can go back and reinstall DD1 XD"

Regarding where the game is going we get: "GG, WP, GL HF, NO RE."

About the hard work the devs don't do we're told "They could do SO much if they wanted to."

About the honesty of the devs what do we hear?: "I just don't think they let the community influence help guide the priorities as much as they want us to believe."

And generally about how horrible the devs are other than the art team:  "Their art team is amazing, only thing that doesn't need fixing."

First I never said the dev are horrible. I did say lately they have made poor choices as to the priority to fix things. There are things I like about DD2 over DD1 but not many. I want this to be a great game and if the devs didn't want input they wouldn't ask. If you have anything that you want to make better and all you ever got was the sugar coat then how do you truly make it better.

i think the OP should start a suggestion article about trendy putting up weekly influence votes or some other voting form about the actual topics.

@batoutofhe11 quote:

i think the OP should start a suggestion article about trendy putting up weekly influence votes or some other voting form about the actual topics.

I have actually posted about the need for A) influence votes that feel more impactful. B) The use of form based polls to collect data C) Using the in game feature  to collect poll data as to player happiness.  The benifet of form based polls is a double edge sword for the devs. If you throw out a poll and it contradicts your goals then you have to either change or prepare damage control. I think my biggest argument was already made in the form of influence week and the item that received the most votes for change. Was that changed yet? Well technically yes they added 1 slot to the hero deck. Did that fix the issue? Put up another influence vote and let's see.

i think the devs should be happy to accommodate the players if the players feel one way while the devs feel the other. the players are the ones paying the bills

@Chappyy quote:

I have actually posted about the need for A) influence votes that feel more impactful. B) The use of form based polls to collect data C) Using the in game feature  to collect poll data as to player happiness.  The benifet of form based polls is a double edge sword for the devs. If you throw out a poll and it contradicts your goals then you have to either change or prepare damage control. I think my biggest argument was already made in the form of influence week and the item that received the most votes for change. Was that changed yet? Well technically yes they added 1 slot to the hero deck. Did that fix the issue? Put up another influence vote and let's see.

@batoutofhe11 quote:

i think the devs should be happy to accommodate the players if the players feel one way while the devs feel the other. the players are the ones paying the bills

@Chappyy quote:

I have actually posted about the need for A) influence votes that feel more impactful. B) The use of form based polls to collect data C) Using the in game feature  to collect poll data as to player happiness.  The benifet of form based polls is a double edge sword for the devs. If you throw out a poll and it contradicts your goals then you have to either change or prepare damage control. I think my biggest argument was already made in the form of influence week and the item that received the most votes for change. Was that changed yet? Well technically yes they added 1 slot to the hero deck. Did that fix the issue? Put up another influence vote and let's see.

I genuinely believe the devs want to accommodate the players. What I think the issue is right now is that the problems the community are having clash with monitory designs so they want to figure out how to make it work without loosing money potential. The only real solution is to be open about your actual intentions about why unexplained features are there. And if you are going to fix them then fine. I just get a huge feeling of these issues get glossed over in dev streams and posts. I feel like every answer is a smoke screen. IT'S A F2P GAME WE KNOW YOU WANT TO MAKE MONEY. I'm ok with that just be up front about it.

This is true whining my frustrated friend:

@Andurian quote:

Perhaps because y'all whine like you're ignorant of that fact?  

Making suggestions is entirely reasonable.  Complaining about the lack of QA before patches going live is fine.   Shouting "I'm taking my ball and going home because this unfinished game isn't exactly what I want!" is just childish, especially when none of you ever actually do.

Let me explain how it works:

1. There are alot of us who really loved DD1 and have passion about the sequel.

(No edit button)

2. Customers who give feedback is alot better then customers who does not say anyting, just leave. It is actually respectful to take the time to express why they are not playing.

3. To play something that is not fun makes no sense.

There's an edit button in a tab top left of your posts.  Click the ... to open up the tab

&so true.  My attention, time, and money is valuable.  If the product sucks I'll walk away without a word.  If the product sucks and I want it to succeed, I'll let the business know I'm leaving so that maybe if they care about me leaving they'll fix things.  If they don't care about me leaving ok, no hard feelings, customers aren't -always- right

That's kinda how capitalism works.  I'm not going to eat *** if the devs tell me to just because I really like the concept of dungeon defenders.  Genuinely don't understand the white knighters and where they're coming from

And it's not even that I'm leaving, I'm just not going to waist my time until things get fixed.  Which I don't think will be any time soon judging from the dev stream and all the hype about PS4 and when it came time to talk about the PC they choose take the easy questions and then gloss over the ones that are making people so irate. Which lands on my point if I don't like playing the game and I have told you why then why am I going to play if it doesn't change? I'm not telling them do it my way or the highway. I am simply saying talk about these big ticket issues and give us something more then we are looking into it or we want to do something. Then when something gets changed I will come back and see how it works. I am excited to play this game in theory, just not in practice at this time.

My problem at this point is that I'm starting to wish DD2 was just an aesthetically and generally mechanically improved DD1. It was stated from the beginning that this game would not be a direct sequel, that you could choose to play either game as they'd be their own thing. The problems arising are that other than the aesthetical difference, there's nothing notable that would make you want to play this game over the last one.

DD1 cost money and still had DLC purchases, yet it succeeded well as the game itself was solid and some people (myself included) wanted more out of their initial purchase. The fact that DD2 is F2P is what I believe is gonna be it's undoing since the mechanics of the game seem to be based around it. We're still paying for costumes which are cool, but the 'Gems' (a mobile game term I despise) make it all feel like we're throwing money around with no purpose. Combined with the 'gotta balance everything so perfectly' design choices they're running with which have lost the wackiness and therefore the charm and appeal the original had.

Frankly, the loss of the Defense Speed and Defense Range stats have made the game lose it's sense of progression, you don't feel more powerful later in the game, if anything you're weaker as the same number of enemies waltz around and take a staggering number of hits to kill. Where's the FPS dropping number of enemies and Balista arrows? That was funny!

I sincerely think the new passives need to be either removed or modified into a Skill Sphere-like system. The concept is fun but trudging around to find them, only to have to need to replace them with stronger stat items makes obtaining loot tedious. Just make them seperate drops of which you can equip one at a time. Then your builds would be unique (assuming there's no 'this one's clearly the best' passives which is currently the case).

I'd be reiterating on previous posts at this point so: Weapons and Pets. They need diversity.

The current game works fine but that doesn't necessarily translate to a fun and rewarding experience, and being this far into development, I'm worried things aren't going to change.

This was originally going to be a paragraph long but there's so many things I find frustrating that aren't being addressed that I went on a tangent, oh well. As for the topic of not playing: currently I just want my monthly and daily quests. I want the Itsy-Betsy, that is my one goal at this point. Actually I think that's been my only driving point for a couple months. Again, no feeling of progression.

I hope devs read this thread, it's really interesting one. shows how many of us feel at this point.

I just wanna leave a +1 here to show that I am on that same wagon.

@Faysumi quote:

DD1 cost money and still had DLC purchases, yet it succeeded well as the game itself was solid and some people (myself included) wanted more out of their initial purchase. The fact that DD2 is F2P is what I believe is gonna be it's undoing since the mechanics of the game seem to be based around it. 

 I think F2P adds another consideration to every development choice made, can we make money. Which is fine but the balance act is then where to insert monitory points and game play effects. Forget balancing end game, this will be the hardest thing to balance by far. And if you screw it up it can slowly kill your game.

i was kinda thinking that the towers should evolve instead of the passives. have the basic towers evolve depending on how you put level up points into them, with say a fireball tower becoming a flamthrower with tower speed and a lavapit tower with attack respectively preferenced.

@Faysumi quote:

Frankly, the loss of the Defense Speed and Defense Range stats have made the game lose it's sense of progression, you don't feel more powerful later in the game, if anything you're weaker as the same number of enemies waltz around and take a staggering number of hits to kill. Where's the FPS dropping number of enemies and Balista arrows? That was funny!

I sincerely think the new passives need to be either removed or modified into a Skill Sphere-like system. The concept is fun but trudging around to find them, only to have to need to replace them with stronger stat items makes obtaining loot tedious. Just make them seperate drops of which you can equip one at a time. Then your builds would be unique (assuming there's no 'this one's clearly the best' passives which is currently the case).