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pressdelight

Well, I'm done until something changes.

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@iamisom quote:
@mkjo quote:\

This sounds good.

However, even with the relatively few available builds right now the chance of getting good gear (i.e. passives and hero stats) feels unrewarding against time spent trying for it.

Heaven knows I can take a grind but with the current drop rates, introducing more builds and therefore more passives may only make this worse.

Something to think about... 

Yeah, that's what the "needle in the haystack" thread hit on very well. How would you suggest we address this? I'd love to hear your thoughts. :)

Add weighting to the RNG so it populates items with stats that go well together.  Currently 90% of items are sold without a second thought because they have mixed stats.  Why would I ever want the frosty passive with hero stats?  When I hear the legendary drop sound, I should think "wow, an awesome item just dropped."  Instead what I think is "meh, another junk item to feed the enchantress's wheel with."

Mind you, I'm not saying all items should be perfect.  But I think the majority of items should at least be useful.  Two stats or a stat and passive that go together would be a good baseline.  Furthermore I would bias the RNG towards builder items, since the typical hero deck has more builders than anything else.

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@iamisom quote:


@mkjo quote:\

This sounds good.

However, even with the relatively few available builds right now the chance of getting good gear (i.e. passives and hero stats) feels unrewarding against time spent trying for it.

Heaven knows I can take a grind but with the current drop rates, introducing more builds and therefore more passives may only make this worse.

Something to think about... 

Yeah, that's what the "needle in the haystack" thread hit on very well. How would you suggest we address this? I'd love to hear your thoughts. :)

You need to really look at how you're itemizing gear. Understand that most stats suck from the player perspective. Any stat that doesn't give us offensive power will be seen as terrible. The resistance stats? They're extra special terrible. 

Builders have, essentially, one stat: DP. DPS heroes have Hero power and AP. I don't really believe you're going to be able to make crit something people are going to stack, so it'll never be a primary stat. 

The VAST majority of gear people see drop right now doesn't have DP on it at all. Which feels like a bug, by the way. It's anomalously absurd how little DP drops across the board. 

But even if it was distributed normally - there's no variety in the gear at all. If you restrict builds to NM, that means players will have 1 stat to work with until the endiest of endgame - DP. 

Imagine this from the solo perspective: you cannot solo the game with just a DPS hero. So you need to have a good builder. Take away build gear and you just have players grinding DP. Why is this different from grinding DS (excluding the part about DS causing the animations to go weird)?


The passives were a good idea to add variety to the game. A good idea that you smothered to death with a pillow by suggesting only end game players will be allowed to use them. That's the kind of design change that would make me give up - dangle this really cool idea and then lock it off for only but the top tiny X% of players. 


You guys said yourself that most people haven't even left Insane. That most people only have 1 hero. 


So why are you spending all your time and energy not only building, but hyping up stuff that you don't intend the population to even have access to?


Here's how you correct this misstep. 


1. Remove the crappy stats. Give players spheres to boost resistances for tanky toons. 

2. Put DH or H on all the gear, in lower amounts. Don't try to make it something that takes up a primary stat except in very specific circumstances (like a trinket that gives you a TON of HH for tanks)

3. Figure out some other primary stat that helps tower performance that's not DS or crit. We need ways to boost our "effectiveness" without stacking one single stat to the exclusion of all others. 

4. Add "minor builds" to the early game. You need to give players something interesting to strive for to collect pieces of gear at all levels of the game. Minor builds could be stuff that doesn't necessarily have VFX like the Phoenix but gives you a boost to help get over the humps. Like maybe a build that adds some AoE to physical towers.  Make a minor build gives a boost to certain defenses if they are played together, like Frosty, except less dramatic and more specific - say a smaller variant of frosty that only works with traps or auras. 

You might even try stuff that counters specific enemies. Having trouble with spear throwers? Then seek out the minor build that reflects X% of your DP back to that specific enemy when it hits your towers. 

Whatever. Think outside the box.


If the game is about stacking DP until you can blunt force your way into NM, then people will get bored quickly. 

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About stats I have to agree, compared to DD1 the current system stat is very weird. First there is more stats as hero than builder which doesn't make sense. Secondly the crit system is just off, it can be good only if you put one or two towers with crit while your friend build the rest but basing your defenses on crits is a terrible idea because if you don't have crit when the huge wave arrives you're dead. Adding RNG to a game already based on RNG (loots) is a not pleasant and terrible idea.

I really miss defense range and defense speed, right now you have 0 tactical option aside from builds which are currently VERY straightforward and not any fun (the towers boosted are not the most exciting one, they are kinda original but don't add fun to the game that much).

I'd rather see a system where all passives are located in a talent points kinda section (and not this crap way too expensive spheres system) and why not putting all the special stuff in the relic slot, weapons would have other special stuff (like the betsys weapons currently have, or the new build weapons).

And the armor 4 slots would focus almost only on stats and a couple of minor bonuses such as mana regen, repair speed etc.

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@antiproton quote:

You need to really look at how you're itemizing gear. Understand that most stats suck from the player perspective. Any stat that doesn't give us offensive power will be seen as terrible. The resistance stats? They're extra special terrible. 

Aren't resistances and hero health useful for tanks whose job is to keep enemies stationary and soak damage?

Hero crit stats are the only ones I really struggle to find a use for.  Possibly defense crit chance as well, since the passive outshines the stat.

Builders have, essentially, one stat: DP. DPS heroes have Hero power and AP. I don't really believe you're going to be able to make crit something people are going to stack, so it'll never be a primary stat. 

DP is the most important stat for offensive builders, yes.  The crit stats are not useless either, and I'd rather take those than a hero stat for the second stat in my items.  Currently the combination I'm looking for is DP+DCD as stats and DCC as passive.

Pure wallers benefit from DH more than from DP.  As a solo player I don't have the luxury of a pure waller hero, so I'm looking for DP+DH for my waller squire, preferably combined with the hearty blockade passive.

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@Sombrero quote:

About stats I have to agree, compared to DD1 the current system stat is very weird. First there is more stats as hero than builder which doesn't make sense.

General stats from DD1:

  • Hero health
  • Hero damage
  • Hero speed
  • Hero cast rate
  • Two ability stats
  • Defense damage
  • Defense attack rate
  • Defense range
  • Defense health

That's six hero stats and four defense stats (I'm counting the ability stats as hero stats since most of them had nothing to do with defenses).

General stats from DD2:

  • Hero health
  • Hero resist (the one that didn't already appear as primary stat)
  • Hero power
  • Hero critical chance
  • Hero critical damage
  • Ability power
  • Defense health
  • Defense power
  • Defense critical chance
  • Defense critical damage

Again, six hero stats and four defense stats.  The utility of each stats is different though, with a heavy bias towards defense power.  In DD1 I recall huntress and monk requiring defense health to avoid depletion of auras and traps, which in DD2 seems to be a non-issue.

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Why not allow to set a "preferred kind of Loot" like in WoW? Where you can select if you want to receive Items for your Tanking, DD or Healing Spec (incase you have a class that supports this). Of course in  WoW you have fixed items and here Random stats. But you could for example increase the chance through theselection of “Tank” the drop rate of items with Hero Life stats by 30%, or passives that are preferred for tanking, eg. CD for the Squires Taunt Ability?

You can’t guess what the player is farming for, why not let us decide what kind of loot we would preferred to receive.

You basically would just have to define the categories and define what passive and stat fits into those, and when selected increase the chance of items having those stats by x%.

The players would enjoy this since we have an increase in the item drops we want and have a feeling of getting better rewards for our playstyle, and it is still random andtime consuming, so enough playtime should be generated, both parties Win. ;-)

You even could build in challanges that raise the percentage on this chance. Just an idea. :-) 

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my best solution to fixing this would be to get rid of the "builds" non-white passives, and to make the towers once again receive adequate stats, bring back the monster spawners that didnt ONLY throw out mobs of goblins, bring back tower speed in actuality, or work it in the leveling up of heroes as it's annoying to level up and see +0 tower speed every time. 

@iamisom quote:


@mkjo quote:\

This sounds good.

However, even with the relatively few available builds right now the chance of getting good gear (i.e. passives and hero stats) feels unrewarding against time spent trying for it.

Heaven knows I can take a grind but with the current drop rates, introducing more builds and therefore more passives may only make this worse.

Something to think about... 

Yeah, that's what the "needle in the haystack" thread hit on very well. How would you suggest we address this? I'd love to hear your thoughts. :)


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Things are changing, just sucks they keep releasing big updates before the weekend when they can't fix anything, leaving players to twiddle their thumbs waiting for fixes and rerolls.

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I just wanted to say I have to applaud iamisom and the devs for acknowledging that their game isn't perfect and for continuously reaching out to their players for suggestions to make DD2 better for everyone.

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@iamisom quote:


@mkjo quote:\

This sounds good.

However, even with the relatively few available builds right now the chance of getting good gear (i.e. passives and hero stats) feels unrewarding against time spent trying for it.

Heaven knows I can take a grind but with the current drop rates, introducing more builds and therefore more passives may only make this worse.

Something to think about... 

Yeah, that's what the "needle in the haystack" thread hit on very well. How would you suggest we address this? I'd love to hear your thoughts. :)

I would stop making passives Do or DIe.


Passives are required at this point.  When Ipwr 200 is better then ipwr 800 because the 200 has a passive and the 800 doesn't... It's broken.



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