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Tristaris

Loot will need to be reworked very soon.

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I think I can speak for at least a few of us, when I say that loot while it wasn't too bad before, is going to become very very frustrating to deal with very soon, if it isn't worked on.

Before we had a lot of the new special passives, it was pretty simple to gear. Even now it's not too terribly bad at certain times.

But currently, specials of different classes can roll on the same item, basically rendering it completely worthless if you're worried about optimizing.

Currently, this image pretty much sums out how it's becoming for loot:

it0X0UD.jpg


Loot should be class specific. Seeing multiple special stats for various classes on the same item only makes it frustrating, and adds to the already massive RNG wall you have to climb to see something you're looking for. 

A few things that would help even further is, special stats should not replace the white text, in the first place. Make it completely separate. If it's legendary, it's going to have +1 or 2 specials + the 3 white texts, it was able to roll before. 

I don't mind seeing the special stats, but items having the chance to roll specials from more than one class, just pushes it over the top, and needs to be addressed. This is a loot game, after-all!

What are your thoughts on the matter?

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I've written lengthier posts about the loot system in other threads, but I'll re-summarize here:

Loot should go back to DD1 style.  Let items roll with many different stats. Let the stats roll in a range.  Move passives to an expanded sphere system.  The effect is that we get to spend a long time looking for the perfect gear, we get to have many more small upgrades along the way, we get to make interesting trade-offs, gear can be shuffled around between characters, and if we want to try out build X on character Y then we can do so without having to farm an entire set of gear for it.

As it stands, there is very little granularity between a garbage piece of gear and the perfect piece of gear and the magnitude of the passive often trumps everything else.  Farming gear looks like this:

1) Does it have the right passive? If yes, see 2. If no, garbage.

2) Did the passive roll a higher percentage than your current piece? If yes, see 3. If no, garbage.

3) Did the passive roll the right 1-2 stats?  If yes, you will probably never replace it.  If no, probably garbage, but maybe an edge case.  Hope you own a calculator.


A side effect of getting passives off of our gear and into an expanded sphere system (or skill tree), is that balance adjustments can be made to the strength of builds without altering people's hard farmed gear or changing the coefficients on towers.  

A side effect of letting stats roll in ranges is that overlapping ranges for different maps both smooth out the gear/difficulty progression and also allow people to farm for upgrades without spamming the highest ipwr map ad nauseam.

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Thanks for the reply, [[38837,users]]

I don't think I noticed your post before, I'd be interested in checking it out, though. I just feel it's going to definitely need some changing, though!

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Agree that with the addition of more and more passives on gear, the game will become grindier and grindier. For example, if you want to have a well equipped wall squire, be prepared to devote 20 to 30 hours just to get him appropriate gear with all the right primary, secondary, and passive stats.

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@Zuqual quote:

I've written lengthier posts about the loot system in other threads, but I'll re-summarize here:

Loot should go back to DD1 style.  Let items roll with many different stats. Let the stats roll in a range.  Move passives to an expanded sphere system.  The effect is that we get to spend a long time looking for the perfect gear, we get to have many more small upgrades along the way, we get to make interesting trade-offs, gear can be shuffled around between characters, and if we want to try out build X on character Y then we can do so without having to farm an entire set of gear for it.

As it stands, there is very little granularity between a garbage piece of gear and the perfect piece of gear and the magnitude of the passive often trumps everything else.  Farming gear looks like this:

1) Does it have the right passive? If yes, see 2. If no, garbage.

2) Did the passive roll a higher percentage than your current piece? If yes, see 3. If no, garbage.

3) Did the passive roll the right 1-2 stats?  If yes, you will probably never replace it.  If no, probably garbage, but maybe an edge case.  Hope you own a calculator.


A side effect of getting passives off of our gear and into an expanded sphere system (or skill tree), is that balance adjustments can be made to the strength of builds without altering people's hard farmed gear or changing the coefficients on towers.  

A side effect of letting stats roll in ranges is that overlapping ranges for different maps both smooth out the gear/difficulty progression and also allow people to farm for upgrades without spamming the highest ipwr map ad nauseam.

Nice one. I think they have it all wrong with letting the RNG gear decide the stats. I think we should be in control and put stat points where we want like in DD1. Instead they could focus on making the weapons more interesting. Where are the multiple projectiles at?

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It would be a shame if Trendy is rushing the loot system as this is the core of the game. The way it is going it seems like you will end up with creating a character based on what loot what you find, not the other way around.

If the new tower passives was items that dropped from mobs i.e. "Armor gems" for players to insert into Gem slots in armor pieces it could work really nice, as mentioned by others as well. This would be really awesome.

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@Zuqual quote:

A side effect of getting passives off of our gear and into an expanded sphere system (or skill tree), is that balance adjustments can be made to the strength of builds without altering people's hard farmed gear or changing the coefficients on towers.  

I love the fact that people want an expanded sphere system. I feel like the sphere system should control what type of build you want your character to have and the gear should supplement it. That way you can create your build then go out and look for that ideal piece of gear.

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I for one like passives on gear!  I dislike the frequency in which passives for other hero classes roll on gear that drops!  On the flip side, I really hate how I feel like (compared to DD) I have very little to no control over modifying/improving my gear to my needs.  In DD, upgrading gear and finding gear with the right stats to balance out your hero was challenging and rewarding (well, not always, but mostly).  In DD2, if we didn't have the passive system (which adds some challenge/customization), we would only have a tiny number of stats to search for with most hero builds only looking for 2 or 3 stats.  That gets boring fast, especially when you take into account the way that "fusing" and upgrading items to get better just doesn't feel as rewarding as upgrading items in DD was.

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Well we should wait and see how it plays out when they have fixed the bugs.

- Passives from several heroes on the same item.

- Passive stat priority for the hero you are playing is not working correctly.

Just those two will bring a lot of ease to the equation. 

I am looking forward to more passives and unique items coming up. 

Have to agree with [[27276,users]], pouring a million into a weapon/gear yet it might only give you a boost of 10-20% in one stat is pretty meh.


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Some amount of randomness keeps the game interesting, but too much of it makes farming tedious.  I find Diablo III's system fairly good.  Items are randomly generated, but they take classes into account so you'll never see mixed skill bonuses, or primary stat for one class combined with skill bonuses of another.  There's also a very high chance (99% or so) of getting an item for the class you are playing.  This cuts out a lot of items that would be completely useless.  Then there's the enchantress, who allows you to replace one property on an item.  That gives some leeway with the rolls, as a near-perfect item can be made into a perfect one.  Of course, D3 has the random numerical values for item stats, which were recently removed from DD2, so getting an item with the correct stats and perfect numerical rolls only happens once in a blue moon.  

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I think item upgrades should work like tower upgrades. Instead of putting single points in each stat, athe whole item should upgrade. Making upgrading harder and loot % gain per level depending on it's quality would be cool.

For example, a green tier item get 5% (for example) and a legendary 15% per upgrade (although much harder than it is now) could make things cooler. That, or also let us upgrade passives.

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Class specific passives are already incredibly strong (ok well not including the new huntress ones yet). If/when they fix the drop rates for the class you are playing I think it will be fine.

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