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Bonzai101

Nightmare 4, 3 level 50's, 1 level 40

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So just for a bit of fun earlier, some of guys who I used to play with regularly decided to bring my level 40 Squire along to a nightmare 4 run!

Fan kept knocking enemies over here where if we didn't have a ranged character they really didn't feel like dying!

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We almost made it to wave 15, but our tanks were getting thrown around to much and our barricades went down.

It was absolute chaos and my level 40 squire could only watch and try to repair the barricades!

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Trying to get a good shot of everyone and failing............... due to no camera rotation without char rotation

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So after experiencing this for the first time my feedback would be:
- Every 3rd wave should have bosses, no exception, especially because mob loot seems to be very thin.

- I don't think there is really any other setup you could use to get this done, which I see as a failure, if you can get your builders strong enough you should be able to use mixed builds with either primarily squire or apprentice towers.

- Because you are doing 3 waves to every usual one this mode can drag if there are to many enemies, especially stupidly tough enemies.

- You barely get any xp which is pretty lame, I didn't even get one level after doing about 22 waves worth over 2 games.

- The gear you 'signed up for' at the start (by category) was 90% of the time worse than what the bosses were dropping.

- Serenity auras are stupidly overpowered and the only reason I kept alive (while tanking mobs) as much as I did.

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-Agree with every third wave being a boss wave. It's a boss wave 90% of the time, so i kind of have no complaints about that.
-Actually, you do not need super powerful Hero Stats to be able to soak some damage inside a Builder's Serenity Aura, as it mostly heals you for 18-27% at that point in end game, depending on the builder's DP. 2k of Armor is enough to take a punch or two from Ogre. Especially, if you are a squire. Then it's a piece of Legendary cake. 
-Speaking of "too many" monsters, try the horde waves=) 800-1k+ overall enemies per wave depending on the round. Squire towers are powerless against that :> 
-Disagree with XP. This is End Game and it requires you to be level 50 to queue for one publicly (officially). There is no more need for experience for level 50 players =) Therefore, it's not rewarding and it shouldn't be. End Game is there for loot, not boosting levels =) I kind of enjoy joining people in public Free Play for experience with my lvl 45 Apprentice. 
-The Gear you get as a reward mostly suck. I agree.
-In my opinion, Serenity Auras should not be nerfed. Rather, their beneficial stat should be changed from DP to, say, Monk's total HP or something. It kind of does not make sense, that building a dps builder monk, the support monk improves just as much (Serenity, Boost).

Oh, and last thing: you can hold B button  to rotate the screen without turning around yourself =) 

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@Bonzai101 quote:

Fan kept knocking enemies over here where if we didn't have a ranged character they really didn't feel like dying!


Trying to get a good shot of everyone and failing............... due to no camera rotation without char rotation

- I don't think there is really any other setup you could use to get this done, which I see as a failure, if you can get your builders strong enough you should be able to use mixed builds with either primarily squire or apprentice towers.


- You barely get any xp which is pretty lame, I didn't even get one level after doing about 22 waves worth over 2 games.


- Serenity auras are stupidly overpowered and the only reason I kept alive (while tanking mobs) as much as I did.

1. You had an apprentice, right? Even as a builder you can kill them and they are dying when they do not move for a specific amount of time.

2. Hold down B and rotate your camera. You're welcome.

3. I think you could at least use Lightning Strikes Auras/Lightning Auras or Explosive Traps since they are very good if you place them in the right spots. Blaze Baloons could also help.

4. I assume this was an Endgame run? You are supposed to play Endgame content with level 50 characters, so you don't need that much exp. The only thing leveling afterwards are your pet and your costumes and i think that these are leveling fast enough.

5. Serenity Aura has to be strong, not overpowered but strong because almost nobody would use it otherwise. And it does what it should do, heal you and reduce incoming damage.

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@Seph quote:

-Agree with every third wave being a boss wave. It's a boss wave 90% of the time, so i kind of have no complaints about that.
-Actually, you do not need super powerful Hero Stats to be able to soak some damage inside a Builder's Serenity Aura, as it mostly heals you for 18-27% at that point in end game, depending on the builder's DP. 2k of Armor is enough to take a punch or two from Ogre. Especially, if you are a squire. Then it's a piece of Legendary cake. 
-Speaking of "too many" monsters, try the horde waves=) 800-1k+ overall enemies per wave depending on the round. Squire towers are powerless against that :> 
-Disagree with XP. This is End Game and it requires you to be level 50 to queue for one publicly (officially). There is no more need for experience for level 50 players =) Therefore, it's not rewarding and it shouldn't be. End Game is there for loot, not boosting levels =) I kind of enjoy joining people in public Free Play for experience with my lvl 45 Apprentice. 
-The Gear you get as a reward mostly suck. I agree.
-In my opinion, Serenity Auras should not be nerfed. Rather, their beneficial stat should be changed from DP to, say, Monk's total HP or something. It kind of does not make sense, that building a dps builder monk, the support monk improves just as much (Serenity, Boost).

Oh, and last thing: you can hold B button  to rotate the screen without turning around yourself =) 

- We had 3 waves in a row with zero bosses....................
- We had horde waves quite a few times and they just slowed down the whole game as all you get is a traffic jam.
- Decent XP should be in there regardless, its nightmare 4.................
- Serenity aura kept me alive (level 40 builder squire) in amongst huge numbers of enemies, bit OP.
- B Button! , thanks!


@Thalios Damotil quote:


@Bonzai101 quote:

Fan kept knocking enemies over here where if we didn't have a ranged character they really didn't feel like dying!


Trying to get a good shot of everyone and failing............... due to no camera rotation without char rotation

- I don't think there is really any other setup you could use to get this done, which I see as a failure, if you can get your builders strong enough you should be able to use mixed builds with either primarily squire or apprentice towers.


- You barely get any xp which is pretty lame, I didn't even get one level after doing about 22 waves worth over 2 games.


- Serenity auras are stupidly overpowered and the only reason I kept alive (while tanking mobs) as much as I did.

1. You had an apprentice, right? Even as a builder you can kill them and they are dying when they do not move for a specific amount of time.

2. Hold down B and rotate your camera. You're welcome.

3. I think you could at least use Lightning Strikes Auras/Lightning Auras or Explosive Traps since they are very good if you place them in the right spots. Blaze Baloons could also help.

4. I assume this was an Endgame run? You are supposed to play Endgame content with level 50 characters, so you don't need that much exp. The only thing leveling afterwards are your pet and your costumes and i think that these are leveling fast enough.

5. Serenity Aura has to be strong, not overpowered but strong because almost nobody would use it otherwise. And it does what it should do, heal you and reduce incoming damage.

1. If they are continually walking on the spot I'm not so sure.
2. Thanks, last guy also mentioned that, will try in the future.
3. Guess what was being used.............. Nightmare 4.
4. You should just get xp at all levels, the higher the more you get..............
5. As above.

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Three whole rounds or three waves? If three rounds, then damn! Talk about bad luck!
Yeah, horde waves are awesome fun but consumes time =( 
XP? What for? What use do level 50 hero have from XP besides leveling up his accessory?
Level 40 Squire can tank NM4 Ogre. Even lvl 34 can tank it.
Haha, you are welcome!

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If you tried to level up your accessory with 5k exp NM4 runs it'd take you till the actual release of the game to unlock accessories 

Is the message: if you want unlocked accessories you need to grind free play liferoot hard on your 50? lol

That's not really all that cool

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Yeah I absolutely agree there should be at least one special (two would be more in line, IMO) every third wave, given that normal mobs don't drop anything.

And also agree that onslaught rewards need to be looked at, 95% of the time it's a blue that I use to vendor.

Horde waves are insane amounts of fun. Blaze balloons, and explosive traps are good fun for horde waves as they absolutely melt!

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@Pachipachio quote:

If you tried to level up your accessory with 5k exp NM4 runs it'd take you till the actual release of the game to unlock accessories 

Is the message: if you want unlocked accessories you need to grind free play liferoot hard on your 50? lol

That's not really all that cool

The Nightmare content could give absolutely no experience and it would still make perfect sense.
However, i do have to agree with accessories. 

Compromise? Separate accessory experience from hero experience and increase or add an accessory xp rates to the game. That way, you could level up your accessories while playing maps that are not supposed to be a source of Experience Points. 

Although, while it is not all that cool to level up accessories in Free Play grinds when you are level 50, i do like having my accessories NOT maxed out the first day. It gives me something to look forward to. I also like the 10m XP requirement for the last unlock on monk's mark. 

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Why go and lvl your alts on low maps when u can complete 100x times harder maps with harder difficulty. So more exp in end game content over lower content or this is a really really poor designed game and that is one of the biggest DD-fans saying :o
There are many other things they could work on too, I will go and let this game alone for some months or even years until it's even worth to play (sorry this game isn't what it should be or what it was before wipe :()

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@Bonzai101 quote:

- Serenity auras are stupidly overpowered and the only reason I kept alive (while tanking mobs) as much as I did.

You wanna know why the serenity aura is stupidly overpowered? Because it is a percentage-based defense that scales with stats. Boost aura used to be percentage-based, and it was stupidly overpowered too. And actually, the damage protection is percent based and scales as well, so chances it will hit a point where it will be OP again for its damage reduction.

The most overpowered defenses in both DD1 and DD2 have been and always will be percentage based.

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@Carrylex quote:

Why go and lvl your alts on low maps when u can complete 100x times harder maps with harder difficulty. So more exp in end game content over lower content or this is a really really poor designed game and that is one of the biggest DD-fans saying :o
There are many other things they could work on too, I will go and let this game alone for some months or even years until it's even worth to play (sorry this game isn't what it should be or what it was before wipe :()

If before wipe you mean when there was defense speed, I do not see why that has to be so important. The best build I found was monk aura, surrounded by geysers, with aa shooting the airborne foes. Sure, they have grounded waves, but the monk aura was good enough I could just tank hits inside it if that was necessary. In my opinion having to follow that one cookie cutter build is not that fun. Granted, there may be cookie cutter setups now at endgame, but I haven't leveled my way there yet because I don't have that kind of time, plus none of my friends play so I am always playing the games they do in my free time. On the note of defense speed though, I do think they should do something about the ballista and the earthshatter? tower, with the way those seem programmed if the target dies they tend to reset aim, making them mostly useless so far in my experience. I may use them more once mobs live longer, but as it is I do not like them at all.

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@gamer21d quote:


@Carrylex quote:

Why go and lvl your alts on low maps when u can complete 100x times harder maps with harder difficulty. So more exp in end game content over lower content or this is a really really poor designed game and that is one of the biggest DD-fans saying :o
There are many other things they could work on too, I will go and let this game alone for some months or even years until it's even worth to play (sorry this game isn't what it should be or what it was before wipe :()

If before wipe you mean when there was defense speed, I do not see why that has to be so important. The best build I found was monk aura, surrounded by geysers, with aa shooting the airborne foes. Sure, they have grounded waves, but the monk aura was good enough I could just tank hits inside it if that was necessary. In my opinion having to follow that one cookie cutter build is not that fun. Granted, there may be cookie cutter setups now at endgame, but I haven't leveled my way there yet because I don't have that kind of time, plus none of my friends play so I am always playing the games they do in my free time. On the note of defense speed though, I do think they should do something about the ballista and the earthshatter? tower, with the way those seem programmed if the target dies they tend to reset aim, making them mostly useless so far in my experience. I may use them more once mobs live longer, but as it is I do not like them at all.

To me it seems like since they removed defense speed they slowed down most of the towers to much.

Most of the towers would be more useful with about a 25% increase in base speed and a -25% of base damage to balance it out.

Right now it doesn't seem like you can primarily build with either apprentice or squire in the endgame area.

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