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Update 1 Beta Bug List

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With the Update 1 Beta now having been through its first weekend of testing, I thought it would be good to keep a running list of bugs in a central location so that players can know which ones the community is aware of.  I am fairly certain each of the ones listed below have been reported to Trendy already.  IF you dont see a bug that you have found listed below, please make sure to send a bug report to Trendy and feel free to list it in this thread as well.

Keep in mind we want to look at "new" bugs first that were introduced with the Update and not just DD bugs in general.  Those are being reported in "To Do LIst" thread currently.  

Current Known Issues

  • Moonbase item rewards get re-rolled it seems when dropping on tavern floor. Host sees this but guest in tavern may still see original spawn stats. - CONFIRMED FIXED

  • Servants Quarters not able to build minions on a large portion of the map. I have not verified this yet either but strange that it would be affected by this update. - CONFIRMED FIXED

  • F1 doesn't bring up Chat History (currently mapped to ` key.  Thanks Jemma) - CONFIRMED FIXED

  • Can't pick up an item dropped in someone else's tavern if locked. Currently in live branch, when you drop an item in someone else's tavern, you can pick it back up. In Beta you can't and neither can the host unless they unlock the tavern. - CONFIRMED FIXED 

  • Moonbase rewards too good? This may or may not be a huge problem but many have asked if there will be a nerf.  I have not looked at all the rewards personally.  I know I will be doing more testing but some numbers I saw looked fairly negligible when in Nightmare.  So if you have Nightmare numbers for current weapons you are comparing and the new weapons, please feel free to add below.  

  • Lock All / Unlock All can freeze up DD.

  • Lock All / Unlock is not selectable with a controller. 

  • Controllers are unable to select Lock/Unlock All as well as Hide Accessories Option from the menus. - SHOULD BE FIXED NOW

  • Hitting 'k' will instantly kill your char (test command and shouldnt be in final release) - CONFIRMED FIXED

  • "Invest All" not subtracting mana from bank when you don't have enough to upgrade.

  • Dynast will allow me to upgrade Tower Health from 420=>421 even though it is mythical and should cap @ 360

Requested Modification to Features

  • An option to turn on and off the "moving while building". While many seem to like this feature, it may be problematic for those with a controller. I haven't tested it myself with a controller yet but was informed by a player it is causing a lot of frustration for him.
  • Mana bank number formatting. While it is nice to have 2 Trillion limit now, the numbers are displayed in a weird manner it seems. Not a game breaker for sure.
  • Remove Defender Store buttons - STILL AN ISSUE

I will try to keep this as up to date as possible.  Please keep testing when you can to help ensure that this will be a great update to a great game. 

Thanks.  Happy Defending!!


EDITS:

- Added Lock / Unlock all issues

- Added Controller Issues

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I have found that typing k is instant suicide.

Not necessarily a bad thing, as long as you know it.

Perhaps not a great choice as k, is often used in chat for 'ok', 'afk' and 'kippers' (just me on the last one?)


One from Curt is the high proportion of items rolling with 1^100 ups

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Actually I would not consider the 100 upgrades number as a bug, more like a feature/minimum upgrades value. Similar example applies to Blaster Rifles from Tinkerer's Lab where you won't get lower than a 50^ one. Though I see a point in changing it into a real random-number-value with 1^ upgrade as a minimum together with changing the spawn stats, so far they all get the same stats (all hero stats + 2 tower stats) with astronomic high values, even for lower tiers.

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An update on the function keys, the keys work correctly and it's just an issue chat history. When I submitted the bug report saying they weren't working was a mistake on my part with my emulator. 

Also, not sure if it's a bug, but spiders won't move if you're in the secret room. 

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@czThePROcz quote:

Actually I would not consider the 100 upgrades number as a bug, more like a feature/minimum upgrades value. Similar example applies to Blaster Rifles from Tinkerer's Lab where you won't get lower than a 50^ one. Though I see a point in changing it into a real random-number-value with 1^ upgrade as a minimum together with changing the spawn stats, so far they all get the same stats (all hero stats + 2 tower stats) with astronomic high values, even for lower tiers.

I would says it's bad because currently rifles (not sure about other rewards since I forgot to check), always rolled ult or 1/100 for me.

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Note: I have not tested these numbers myself; my internet is too slow to download the beta in a reasonable time frame. Take what I say with a grain of salt.


As to item balance...

ToT seems fine. I might consider changing the method of acquisition, since they can spawn better than diamonds, but can have better stats.

Fish is fine where it is.

Hyper Rifle is strong. It don't think, however, that it is too strong. The Pawn Shot still has its niche of obnoxiously high final damage for Proton Charge Beam/Piercing Shot. If the Hyper Rifle was released today, i would not have a big issue with it. I would, however, like to see its power dropped just a bit. It has better dmg/^, base damage, and better stats than Blaster, and the extra projectile just pushes it over the top. i see no reason to farm Ecannon or Blaster Rifle anymore because of it. A small decrease in power somewhere wouldn't hurt.

By all accounts, Dynast seems fine. Steam Saw remains the niche hawk weapon, and the Dynast doesn't improve on the Esword much, as the Esword has a beefy base damage to match the Dynast. Imo it can stay the way it is.

Fusion Rift is an odd one. If the numbers I were given were correct, (and they seem to be) 384/^ is WAAYYY too much for a staff. At the same time, however, the Fusion that Oliwaltony posted in the Moonbase thread still did not outdamage a Rainmaker, indicating that its damage scales oddly with hero attack. I personally think it should have ~160-180/^, lower base damage/elemental damage, and normalized damage scaling, because at the moment it is too hard to compare with current staffs beyond "it's way too strong". Despite power creep clearly being a theme here, I believe it is still way too soon to see weapons being comparable to Rainmaker.

Quietus needs to be tuned back a bit. It has better stats, significantly better dmg/^, and has a better swing rate than Espear. Before Quietus we had a good balance in the melee monk weapons between Espear and Monk Wrench, but the Quietus just blows by that balance. This may be a more general issue with the lack of good Monk weapons, but as it stands I think Quietus needs to lose some power, because there is no niche weapon that can outdamage it or fill any other DPS task better. There is no Pawn Shot or Steam Saw to fill a void. Primarily because of the way the Monk's abilities operate. Yes, Moonbase weapons are designed to be stronger than the previous ones, but the Quietus is a step too far forward far too soon. In my opinion anyway. I have not had the opportunity to test it yet, so take that for what it is worth.


I only have 1 other thing to mention. I have seen a few mythical hyper rifles with over 400 in stats floating around, and I think this shouldn't happen. I think the 400 rule should apply even to Moonbase, if only for the sake of consistency. If we want stat inflation, let it happen at the Ultimate level, not the mythical level.


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Thanks for the post Caimen.  I know you dont have the ability to check yourself, but do you know if those numbers were in tavern or in NM? With the nerf that character DPS receives in NM, I wonder how big of a difference the Quietus actually is for end game.  This is something I am hoping to test myself tonight though in case others dont have the numbers already.  

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@Caimen0 quote:


I only have 1 other thing to mention. I have seen a few mythical hyper rifles with over 400 in stats floating around, and I think this shouldn't happen. I think the 400 rule should apply even to Moonbase, if only for the sake of consistency. If we want stat inflation, let it happen at the Ultimate level, not the mythical level.


But... but.. myth builders :(

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This was all done in tavern to my knowledge.

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@Caimen0 quote:

ToT seems fine.

* flips table

How can one say such thing!? ToT at this state as it is is plain re-skinned diamond (yes it has the same speed boost as diamond), and with stats it spawns, am sure most of you saw them, it will put diamonds in a deep dark corner of shame if left at the same state. So just a big NO! Changing the way to acquire them won't help either. How much it takes to get ToT, or even multiple of those with alts, 13 stupid minutes on avarage for me, with basically no challenge, Moonbase even on Nightmare is a simple catwalk, not mentioning lack of any challenge in form of boss. So instead of spending time hoarding coals and getting lucky with spawn RNGesus to get a decent one, you'll just do few Moonbase runs and you'll be laughing like a nerd PRO, this just can't go out like this.

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@czThePROcz quote:
@Caimen0 quote:

ToT seems fine.

* flips table

How can one say such thing!? ToT at this state as it is is plain re-skinned diamond (yes it has the same speed boost as diamond), and with stats it spawns, am sure most of you saw them, it will put diamonds in a deep dark corner of shame if left at the same state. So just a big NO! Changing the way to acquire them won't help either. How much it takes to get ToT, or even multiple of those with alts, 13 minutes on avarage for me, with basically no challenge, Moonbase even on Nightmare is a simple catwalk, not mentioning lack of any challenge in form of boss. So instead of spending time hoarding coals and getting lucky with spawn RNGesus to get a decent one, you'll just do few Moonbase runs and you'll be laughing like a nerd PRO, this just can't go out like this.

It can, though. The point of Moonbase is to add further endgame content, and therefore higher stats. Diamonds were bound to be eclipsed eventually, and it appears that now is the time. It's readily apparent in every single item that is in Moonbase with the sole exception of the Fish.

Quietus is a better Monk Wrench.

Dynast is a better Esword.

Fusion Rift is a better Classic's Eagle Crested Standard.

Hyper Rifle is a better Blaster Rifle.

The stats of all said items is also phenomenally better than anything save Obsidian items, and these not only have obs level stats, but non-obs level damage.

I can definitely understand how you think it is overpowered. ToT can most certainly spawn with excellent stats, but it seems that the chance of them spawning so well is very small. (Again, take what I say with a grain of salt. I haven't been able to test myself yet.) I think that spawning over 900 (as it is certainly capable of doing) is certainly pushing acceptable.

Deep dark corner of shame? How would you imagine the Krytykal Stryke feels? The Rainbow Unicorn? The Blasticus? The Crystal Tracker? The Backstabber? In the end, items will be left behind. All of those items i just mentioned were, at one point or another, the height of DPS in this game. All have long since been put to absolute shame by what we have today.

You have to accept at some point that the standards are advancing. We've been using the same items for over a year now. We have to accept now that things can improve. DPS can get better. We can have better side stats and multicapping U++ weapons not called "Obsidian Clava" or "Obsidian Gladius".

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ToT definitely has a better possible stat cap.  On the other side of that it has a far lower minimum spawn limit than a diamond does. Therefore overall stats are typically less than a diamond.  Getting a good ToT might take just as long as farming a diamond.  Of course more testing is needed to verify that.

Stat creep can definitely be a concern for some though.  However 200 more points in end game wont effect game play much.  

Anyone check insane stats yet or what lvl requirement this is yet?

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So in TL;DR words: are you saying that you'd make Moonbase as the main and only source for multiple items probably for every hero, putting any other (multiple) map specific rewards aside because they'd be "not as good"? This seems for me like removing content, other than

@Caimen0 quote:

The point of Moonbase is to add further endgame content

..who would bother in that case with doing something else? And for what would you improve your stats or DPS furthermore. I wouldn't mind if there was a significantly tougher challenge to beat, which indeed would require higher stats in which case progressively higher-quality rewards would be welcome, but as far as of yet there is none, so I do not see a point in that. Make a new difficulty. Call it "HELL!!!", exchange every single mob for corrupted hero, each one with 80mil+ HP, make bosses with multiple trilion of HP, then I wouldn't mind such stats on rewards with this little effort. But not at this point, where you don't need it to beat the game.

And to add some input on certain point.

@Caimen0 quote:

ToT can most certainly spawn with excellent stats, but it seems that the chance of them spawning so well is very small. I think that spawning over 900 (as it is certainly capable of doing) is certainly pushing acceptable.

Again, big NO! I can even share my test sample I provided in my very long report just so you can see, it is not that rare to get multiple stats over 800. Such reward with that little effort is just unacceptable, not even mentioning the fact that you no longer need a lvl 100 for this "diamond", which would when handled to a non-high-end-game player would most likely break the game progression experience immensely.

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It sounds like a REALLY bad idea to have a single map that basically nerfs pretty much every single end game map farmed for weapons. Why bother playing Tinks, Sky City, CD, Boss Rush or WW? Coal will be worthless since it is easier to just go and farm a nice ToT. I have no idea how often the ToT with stats above the diamonds spawn, but from the screens I have seen they tend to spawn really high..

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I looked through the ones that Nova posted.  There were about 5 out of the 17 that were diamond level.  I have seen a screens of about 12 others and maybe 2 were about diamond level.  So it does look like they could be farmed faster than a diamond but you still have to get lucky with it, especially if you wanted one with damage over 800 with good sides.

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@ddace quote:

I looked through the ones that Nova posted.  There were about 5 out of the 17 that were diamond level.  I have seen a screens of about 12 others and maybe 2 were about diamond level.  So it does look like they could be farmed faster than a diamond but you still have to get lucky with it, especially if you wanted one with damage over 800 with good sides.

So.... you can get approximately 1 out of 3 greater-than-diamond level ToT for a 13 minute run.   In effect at LEAST 1 diamond-level ToT EVERY 13 MINUTES.  (In DD1 currently, you can get 1 diamond pet, almost-always-non-cap after 11 hours of farming).

Balance... where???  (looks around) >.>

Luck really seems to not be a factor here.  The spawn stats NEED to be toned down SEVERELY.  I am in agreement with several others that the pet should have kobald or even less stats....

If you look at a run of Tavern Defense, it takes much longer to get those 4 kobolds than Moonbase.   ToTs should be a survival reward.  As is, this totally breaks the game.

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@czThePROcz quote:

So in TL;DR words: are you saying that you'd make Moonbase as the main and only source for multiple items probably for every hero, putting any other (multiple) map specific rewards aside because they'd be "not as good"? This seems for me like removing content, other than

Don't put words in my mouth. To be completely honest here, do you even know what I want? I've made it abundantly clear in at least 3 threads that this is the last thing I want. How on earth did you arrive at that conclusion? Go into my thread I made discussing end of map rewards, specifically how I view Lab Assault. Look at how I described the balance of the weapons in this thread. Would you please at least take the time to educate yourself as to my opinions before you try to guess at what I want?



@czThePROcz quote:..who would bother in that case with doing something else? And for what would you improve your stats or DPS furthermore. I wouldn't mind if there was a significantly tougher challenge to beat, which indeed would require higher stats in which case progressively higher-quality rewards would be welcome, but as far as of yet there is none, so I do not see a point in that. Make a new difficulty. Call it "HELL!!!", exchange every single mob for corrupted hero, each one with 80mil+ HP, make bosses with multiple trilion of HP, then I wouldn't mind such stats on rewards with this little effort. But not at this point, where you don't need it to beat the game.

Could you not have made the same argument about Akatiti Jungle or The Tinkerer's Lab when they were released? On that note, are either of those difficult? At all? I can upgrade the buffs and auras on both of those maps and afk after the third wave. How does the difficulty of those maps justify the rewards? Especially Akatiti, where you can get upwards of double capping ult++ tower weapons? I can also name a harder challenge that I would absolutely LOVE it if it was added to Ranked: Temple of Polybius.




@czThePROcz quote:Again, big NO! I can even share my test sample I provided in my very long report just so you can see, it is not that rare to get multiple stats over 800. Such reward with that little effort is just unacceptable, not even mentioning the fact that you no longer need a lvl 100 for this "diamond", which would when handled to a non-high-end-game player would most likely break the game progression experience immensely.

I have to concede here; I haven't been able to do any playtesting myself, so i am unaware of spawn rates and the like. This is, however, the reason I said I would up the difficulty of acquisition. I would say that this pet should be lv 100 restricted; I can agree with that wholeheartedly. Again, however, you seem to be missing the point of "power creep". It happens in every MMO. WoW players can tell you this. It happens in RPGs. Skyrim players can tell you this. It happens in every MOBA. LoL and DotA players can tell you this. It has happened in this game, I already gave examples of it happening. I agree that sometimes items can step too far, but you can't honestly be this opposed to advancement in a game that is 100% about advancement.

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Moonbase is a special map as it is the first for a year and one we all fought for. So, yes, lets make something special. It SHOULD drop something that is nice, the best in game maybe, agreed. Just not, for me, the best tower pet and dps for ALL or SEVERAL of the classes.

Caimen mentioned Tinks. This dropped Mega (best DPS pet?) in survival and blaster (one of best two Huntress weps?) in campaign. Perhaps Moonbase could do something similar. One super duper wep for one class and a nice pet for survival.


Isom's post mentioned two updates with the second a free content update. Let's assume AT LEAST one new map. Will this have a pet with 1200 tower stats? With the next having 1400? DPS at 150% of Rainmaker and Glacier?


Thanks to Trendy, we have the promise of community led content with the possibility of more and more maps. It seems that we all want more maps to play AND farm. Perhaps we could stagger the stat creep across these maps rather than make the first one have amazing everything.

We can play the long game here.

Finally, and forgive me as I only really play DD, is power creep in these other games not normally matched by enemy power creep too - often opening up whole new worlds of tougher enemies - not just one small map. I do not even see an increased level of difficulty in Moonbase.

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Reading this from someone clearly stating
@Caimen0 quote:

I haven't been able to do any playtesting myself, so i am unaware of spawn rates and the like

..makes me feel like I'm wasting time talking to a plain flat white wall. But I'll try it for the last time.


@Caimen0 quote:

Don't put words in my mouth.


I'm not, I'm stating what I see.


@Caimen0 quote:

To be completely honest here, do you even know what I want?

Hoard/greed for more stats, that's what I see.


@Caimen0 quote:

Could you not have made the same argument about Akatiti Jungle or The Tinkerer's Lab when they were released?

Yes, but there is variety of ways how to obtain such item(s) with similar results in multiple ways, not just on one place.


@Caimen0 quote:

On that note, are either of those difficult? At all?

CD is not difficult for you I guess. Akatiti is not the easiest thing to do itself, neither is Tinkerer's. Regarding the very first quote, go try the map yourself first, then try to argue with me, please.


@Caimen0 quote:

How does the difficulty of those maps justify the rewards? Especially Akatiti, where you can get upwards of double capping ult++ tower weapons?

Possibility to obtain such one is one thing, how often do you see such one is second thing.


@Caimen0 quote:

but you can't honestly be this opposed to advancement in a game that is 100% about advancement.

You're right, partially, but not by this huge step when it's not needed.

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It's really difficult to have both a gradual stat creep (basically a requirement for me to stay interested) and a large variety of maps to farm relevant gear from.  One will always end up being better by some fraction of a percent, and therefore be the optimal choice, eventually seen as the "required farming map".  Ultimately it will probably fall to map completion awards being worth the effort for farming different maps.

I'm absolutely blown away with excitement that we can get more powerful gear.  I don't want us to wreck that party.  Stats don't need to explode out of control, but they do need to trend upwards.  My two cents, anyway.

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czThePROcz quote:

 (yes it has the same speed boost as diamond)

That's false. Take a Legendary squire lvl 100 without stuff and walk around with a diamond, then try it with the ToT. The speed boost of the ToT is obviously lower.


czThePROcz quote:

Caimen0 quote:

Don't put words in my mouth.


I'm not, I'm stating what I see.


czThePROcz quote:

Caimen0 quote:

To be completely honest here, do you even know what I want?

Hoard/greed for more stats, that's what I see.

That's unfair...

You're literally putting words in his mouth now....
From what I know after having talked with him, he really wants the weapons to be nerfed.



PS: STUPID QUOTES x( !!!


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@katherineofsky quote:

Luck really seems to not be a factor here.  The spawn stats NEED to be toned down SEVERELY.  I am in agreement with several others that the pet should have kobald or even less stats....

If Treadmills aren't better than diamonds, there is no point in farming any of them. Moonbase is clearly an end game map going to be done by mostly people with diamonds. I'd say lower the chances of a nice one, but I've come to agree with others, we need stat progression. Nobody cares about about kobolds outside of pet projects like myth geared toons. If the treadmill is as crappy as as the kobold, they won't be used. Balance doesn't mean make everything equal, balance means not letting them have 1k in all stats.

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@Akasame quote:

czThePROcz quote:

 (yes it has the same speed boost as diamond)

That's false.

Tried running with heroes equipped with diamond and ToT running next to each other several times. Both had the same speed, maybe ToT had even a tiny bit faster speed. Unless you can provide better proof, unfortunately you're the one wrong here.

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Well i personally think it should just be a kobold with decent speed boost. If it stays as it currently is, then the level requirement for equipping it must be raised (currently 70).

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Nova's right, I did quite a bit of runs and they're the same. I got within +-.5 seconds of each other multiple times which is just error I believe.

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